Guide rod/recoil spring issue Shield 9mm

[swsig]

I don't believe that the Shield recoil spring assembly is necessarily a poor design. SIG Sauer uses an RSA in its highly regarded P320 that is very similar to the Shield's, and SIG has had very few problems with it. I have a P320 Compact 9mm with over 3700 trouble-free rounds, and there are not legions of complaints about P320 RSA failures on the SIG Talk forum.

It seems to be more of a manufacturing problem with S&W than a design problem. The first two RSAs on my Shield 9mm gave me fits. (See my thread concerning my experience, here: http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/432397-shield-rsa-one-more-time.html)

Once I finally received a proper, undamaged Shield RSA, things began to go pretty well. I currently have 1200 rounds on my latest (good) RSA, and my Shield has become the enjoyable gun that so many others have experienced. My expectation is that with proper maintenance, a good Shield RSA should last for at least 5000 rounds.

I have attached a couple of photos of both the P320 and the Shield RSAs. The P320 RSA is the larger one on the left. I can't tell much difference, (other than the P320 RSA's heavier build to deal with a larger gun), but if anyone can identify superior design elements in the P320 RSA, it would be helpful to post them here.

 

[jsshackel]

Interesting on the Sig rod/spring assembly, never seen one. On my Shield I have no problem with 2-piece design. It's that way for a reason and engineered by some very smart gun makers. I would imagine the second rod with smaller, stiffer spring takes up some of the last bit of recoil force as the assembly collapses. I do have concerns with the replacement RSA having the equivalent strength, pounds of force, to the OEM assembly. I will be shooting both to compare. If the replacement is not as strong as it collapses, the shooter will feel it as excessive recoil, and the gun will take it as excessive wear. Don't want that. My only real gripe was not using flat-wound springs, and I imagine other gun manufacturers do too. There's no engineering reason not to, and a big reason to do so. The spring force needs to be distributed as evenly as possible on the rod end plates. They will not with the "snipped end" springs. Force starts to build as the springs collapse mainly in one small area that the spring tip touches. It tries to flatten the coil as it is compressed tighter, but that force will never be as even as flat wound ends. Taking my Shield out of the box and racking the slide first time was insanely hard. Getting it back far enough to disassemble the slide and barrel was darn near impossible. That's unacceptable to me to be coming from one of the oldest and finest handgun manufacturers on the planet. I should not have to hurt myself taking it down, or rotate an RSA so it won't bind, or order a replacement assembly on something I just bought brand new, or spend hours scouring the internet to see why my new firearm doesn't work properly..

 

[swsig]

...Taking my Shield out of the box and racking the slide first time was insanely hard. Getting it back far enough to disassemble the slide and barrel was darn near impossible...

Initially, my SIG P320 was pretty stiff, too, but my Shield was even worse. It's the only semi-auto I've ever shot where I've had to resort to the use of my wife's Handi-Racker to rack the slide. Based on what I've read here, it seems like "they all do it". I can only guess that the reason for the stiff spring is to reduce the recoil associated with such a light gun. Interestingly, my M&P 40 compact has the single-spring design used by the aftermarket Shield RSA. It has performed flawlessly for nearly 6000 rounds.

The best way to get the Shield RSA to a more rackable level is to shoot the heck out of it with 124g or heavier ammo. Be sure to use some +P stuff while you're at it. By 500 rounds or so, it gets much easier to rack. Just make sure that the RSA is inserted straight and level whenever you reassemble it.

It's not all bad. My Shield has a very nice trigger, and is very accurate for a lightweight short-barreled pistol. Despite my RSA problems, it is enjoyable enough to shoot that I've put nearly 4000 rounds through it in ten months.

Once you've spent some range time with it, you'll enjoy shooting yours, too. Good luck!

 

[yanici]

New rod/spring assembly came. Nothing like OEM. One-piece rod, one spring, fits perfectly. Now racking the slide feels normal for that size and caliber pistol, way better. Smooth as silk. And I don't have to go all gorilla on it for take-down. (Note on that, for disassemble --- magazine out, pull slide back, engage slide lock button, flip take-down lever to down position, release slide lock while pulling back on slide, let slide come forward. Now pull the trigger and the slide will slip right off the frame easy-peasy. Seems a bit of a trick on the pulling the trigger thing. Hopefully you're fully not loaded long before all this.) Will post again after shooting this coming weekend. Pics coming. Note the hex screw end goes toward the barrel, if you do one of these. And if the forum allows, e-mail me for some order notes with those folks. Note also Wolff gun springs company makes some nifty "calibration packs" of something like 12, 14, 16 pound springs for the full size M&P 9mm, so one could try different slide speeds and recoils, with OEM being 18 I think. But they have nothing for the Shield.

I've had the single spring from SS Guiderods on my Shield 9MM for months now. Runs perfectly and easier to rack. I have shoulder problems and this setup allows me to keep my Shield. It shoots great and is well made. I'd do it again if I bought another Shield.

Great customer service. I ordered 2 spare springs to have on hand and they also emailed me tips on how to change out the springs.

Don't be afraid to take the plunge.

Smith and Wesson Shield Stainless Steel Guide Rod Assembly - Stainless Steel Guide Rods

 

[Deadbug]

Over 5,000 rounds--Original Shield OEM RSA still like new

Okay, I resisted for a while; I know, old thread...but I just had to put this out there:

Just went over the 5,000 round mark in my 9mm Shield with the original S&W RSA still functioning perfectly. I've NEVER rotated it a certain way, mumbled voodoo or performed any special rituals. Just positioned it per the manual after fieldstripping and cleaning right after I bought it and before firing the first round.

Now, maybe I got lucky--I think my experience may be typical of the vast majority. However, I believe either RSA manufacturer QC and/or failure to follow manufacturer's recommendations before the first shot is fired has led to the issues we've all seen posted by a relatively small number of folks.

I have a new OEM RSA I keep as a spare--swapped 'em out just now to compare. Yep, the new one is much stiffer, but otherwise looks pretty much the same except for the minor finish wear on the disc. So I'll keep using the original for now. you know, if it ain't broke...don't "fix" it!

 

[Bud33]

I finally went with the SS guide rod assembly and it makes a world of difference.
Racking is easier. reassembly is also easier. it just slip into place!
I am sorry I didn't do this a lot earlier!
I do not notice much difference in the way it shoots.

 

[M5RahuL]

Ordered one for my Shield 9 too... Have one in the PPQ and there's a noticeable difference in muzzle flip!

 

[jsshackel]

Interesting note on the muzzle flip. An overly-stiff spring assembly will cause the nose to dive down when the slide slams forward after firing. So a little harder to bring back on target. Normal muzzle rise from the force of the shot. With good stance and grip the barrel starts to come back down to target, the slide slams home and dips it down a bit. Having to come back up a tad to get aligned again. Slows down fast shots and target acquisition. Saw some interesting videos online a while back about that, filmed with a 600 FPS high-speed camera.

 

[Bowserb]

This has been a most useful thread. The difficulty in racking the slide has been my wife's objection to the Shield as she continues her apparently never-ending search for a carry pistol. So the bottom line is that the Shield will really cost another $40 on top of the purchase price, but I think we can live with that.

Could be worse. Read the three years of nightmare stories on the Sig P938 (another my wife had been considering), which has a purchase price of $300-400 more than that of the Shield and is limited to a 7 round mag...and then mainspring housing issues, extractor issues, and so on.

 

[jsshackel]

An analogy

Took the plunge and went out and bought a brand new Mercedes-Benz yesterday, $85,000. One of the oldest and most respected car manufacturers on the planet. Didn't notice it when driving a demo, but when I got mine home I found the driver's door was extremely hard to open. Actually had to put my foot on the side of the car and pull hard to get it open far enough to crawl in. Took my wife and myself both to open it all the way. She can't even get in it by herself, so she won't be able to drive it unless I'm with her. When looking for the problem, I discovered a poor design on the door closure mechanism. Called Mercedes and they said to just open and close it a couple of thousand times and it would get easier. Ordered an aftermarket door closing kit, removed the door, and installed it. Now I can open it easily, it feels like most car doors that size and weight. My wife can also.

Sorry for the analogy, but I couldn't resist, and one last time to vent my frustration. One should not have to jack around with ANYTHING on a new firearm, and ordering a replacement part from another company to get it working normally is insane. I still say the S&W folks should be ashamed. And the same people who made my work-of-art 686-Plus revolver and other semi-autos that work flawlessly right out of the box.

 

[bassgunner]

Got my SSGuiderod in the mail. I don't see the new and improved engineering design. The spring end at the barrel end is still not flat wound and the overall spring still looks "bendy". I notice that the slide is a little easier to rack but I wasn't struggling with my worn in factory RSA either. I suppose I could consider it an upgrade if I was interested in changing the spring weight but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I will be keeping my factory one installed and put this away as a spare.

 

[Holmes375]

I'm not sold on this as a "must have" yet either. I think for those who find the factory set up difficult to rack the aftermarket version may have some merit.

 

[jsshackel]

Replacement rod/spring is perfect

Got to shoot the Shield for the first time today. Great pistol. Very accurate, very nice. The aftermarket spring/rod assembly ran fine. If anyone reading these posts feel they need to improve how their Shield racks, and make it much more enjoyable, it's the best 40 bucks you can spend.

Happy now. The End.

 

[Ofc.JL]

I too noticed the poorly cut spring on my new Shield RSA. Being an Armorer and having the ability and tools, I reshaped the poorly cut flat spring end to lay flat on the guide flange and now no problems with function and dis-assembly. Took me just minutes to do. Should that have to be done by the end user? I say no.

S&W, are you listening? Get this poorly cut spring problem in the Shield RSA fixed ASAP, please.

And an interesting side note. During the 3rd Gen metal frame pistol days(and this pertains to revolvers, too.), S&W reps instructed us during Armorers training that the way to identify if someone had cut springs on a problem handgun was to inspect the said spring closely. S&W stated that the factory never delivered a firearm w/ an "open ended" spring, i.e., all of S&W's firearms springs were finished closed on both ends.
Doesn't seem to be true on the Shield, IMHO.
Good luck, my Brothers. The Shield is still a brilliant little pistol.

 

[M5RahuL]

Got the SSGuide-rod today, and racking the shield ( still quite new with about 250 rounds thru it ) is so much easier now!!

Totally worth it for that feature itself!

 

[Holmes375]

Got the SSGuide-rod today, and racking the shield ( still quite new with about 250 rounds thru it ) is so much easier now!!

Totally worth it for that feature itself!

That's rather how I see it, too. The Shield has always had a rep for being hard to rack by seniors and some of the ladies. I've a couple of elderly friends who have absconded with both of mine thus I'll be ordering another.

 

[mangurian]

This has been a most useful thread. The difficulty in racking the slide has been my wife's objection to the Shield as she continues her apparently never-ending search for a carry pistol. So the bottom line is that the Shield will really cost another $40 on top of the purchase price, but I think we can live with that.

Could be worse. Read the three years of nightmare stories on the Sig P938 (another my wife had been considering), which has a purchase price of $300-400 more than that of the Shield and is limited to a 7 round mag...and then mainspring housing issues, extractor issues, and so on.

Please let me know how much easier racking became after the SS spring.
My wife could never rack my 9mm Shield.

If the stainless lets her do that, I will replace the OEM.

Thanks,