Gunbroker Auctions Can be Fraudulent

[TACC1]

On GB, first I look at the pics, if blurry, I pass. If seller says
"no returns", then it's another pass. I've been very happy
with the GB experience. I think it's a great resource, if I'm careful.
TACC1

 

[semperfi71]

I have, so far, done well on Gunbroker, AuctionArms, and Gunsamerica. I have been lucky.

BUT, I always follow this rule first: "If I win it, I keep it." Meaning I expect to get stuck with whatever comes in the mail.

Therefore I try to buy from sellers with LOTS of positive feedback, ask lot of questions if necessary, and expect to see enough clear pictures of the weapon.

It also helps to buy from someone who allows the use of a Credit Card to pay. Even if they charge the "extra fee" for its usage. With a Credit Card purchase one should be able to refute the payment if problems arise.

 

[kbm6893]

I was just looking for that guy's stuff. I wanted to see what new listings he had.

He's back. Same scam. Polished guns advertised as new or "100% finish". He has far less auctions, though.

 

[Camster]

Return policies are not always what they appear to be.

Last year my nephew bought a Chief Special on GB that was advertised as unfired and in original box. When he brought it out to my place to test fire it, I could tell that it had been fired, possibly a lot, and the box that he received was not original to the gun.

When he contacted the seller, he was told that the gun was unfired when it left his possession and if it had been fired then my nephew had done the firing. He also stated that the box was the one he received when he bought the gun. Sorry, no refund.

I went through that sort of nonsense with a fellow in Ct.The NIB gun had a ding in one cylinder flute.He denied that it was there.....of course when I got the gun, the ding was conveniently under the top strap,which defies the odds.I must have done it or was trying to get away with something.No refund.
On another gun,some damage from an unknowing person trying to remove the cylinder without removing the screw.It took me a while to realize it,honestly think the dealer missed it too,and had no problem getting a refund.

 

[NFrameFred]

I've had fairly good luck with GB auctions, but it's always a shot in the dark.

Someone asked why a seller would state 'sold as is - no returns' unless he had "something to hide"?

True, there are people who try to peddle their "problem child" this way, no denying it. But another point to consider is there are those (some of them hang around the edges of the classifieds here) that are always going to "buy two of those when my rich uncle gets out of the poor house". They make an "I'll take it" statement and then you never hear from them again, or worse the wife happens to be home when the package comes in (and apparently wasn't when the commitment was made) and all of a sudden the whiner finds every imagined conceivable flaw that you 'didn't tell him about' to try to return a gun there is nothing wrong with, rather than buck "she-who-must-be-obeyed".

Then there are the yahoos that will actually take parts off of your gun and replace them with their junk that needed repair, send the gun back and claim they never had it apart. I've seen it happen. Those are just a couple of reasons some decide to sell as is. Like others have said, Caveat Emptor. I try to speak to the seller personally, get lot's of good pix, and make a snap judgement as to if it 'smells' OK. Part of allure and danger of finding a "good deal". Many times if it sounds too good to be true, it usually is. But all of us like to hope we'd be the stiff that lucks up and finds a registered magnum for $300. Because it has happened. But odds are . . . . . best to get an inspection period if possible. But having said that, I have bought some that had no inspection/return period and I haven't been burned . . . yet.

I sold a set of grips to a guy from the classifieds here, described them in detail and sent numerous pictures and offered more pics if he desired. He decided when he received them he didn't want them after all (probably found another set after he bought these) and gave me some lame excuse about the coloring of the grips and informed me he was sending them back. I tore up his check and took them back. I just learned not to do business with him. Takes all kinds.

 

[Black Dog]

NRA Condition System

I know this makes me another old guy lamenting better days now gone, but the NRA Gun Grading system was always the accepted standard for defining condition, often used with specific details in the pre digital photo age. Sellers who don`t use it today either don`t know about it, or are looking for "wiggle room" IMO.

FACTORY NEW
All original parts; 100% original finish; in perfect condition in every respect, inside and out.

EXCELLENT
All original parts; over 80% original finish; sharp lettering, numerals, and design on metal and wood; unmarred wood; fine bore.

FINE
All original parts; over 30% original finish; sharp lettering, numerals, and design on metal and wood; minor marks in wood; good bore.

VERY GOOD
All original parts; none to 30% original finish; original metal surfaces smooth with all edges sharp; clear lettering, numerals and design on metal; wood slightly scratched or bruised; bore disregarded for collectors firearms.

GOOD
Some minor replacement parts; metal smoothly rusted or lightly pitted in places, cleaned or reblued; principal lettering, numerals, and design on metal legible; wood refinished, scratched, bruised, or minor cracks repaired; in good working order.

FAIR
Some major parts replaced; minor replacement parts may be required; metal rusted, may be lightly pitted all over, vigorously cleaned or reblued; rounded edges on metal and wood; principal lettering, numerals, and design on metal partly obliterated; wood scratched, bruised, cracked, or repaired where broken; in fair working order or can be easily repaired and placed in working order.

POOR
Major and minor parts replaced; major replacement parts required and extensive restoration needed; metal deeply pitted; principal lettering, numerals, and design obliterated; wood badly scratched, bruised, cracked, or broken; mechanically inoperative; generally undesirable as a collector's firearm.

FWIW, I won`t buy on the Gun Auctions without a 3 day inspection stated in a EMail, and a phone call with the seller who has at least some completed transactions.

 

[skeete]

I bought three firearms on Gunbroker. One was a new Socom 16 that came to me with a frozen rear sight, Smith Enterprises fixed for an extra $125 (plus travel time)to the price. To the credit of the dealer he did send me $100.
Then there was the "flawless, like new in box" Colt Python that would not fire on the second shot plus it had totally mismatched stock that was impossible to see as the photos were one side at a time and the lighting did not pick up the difference. That cost me an extra $300.
Finally there was a Custom Shop Python that was on GB but it was a private party in my area. I saw the gun in person and it was a buy of a lifetime.
I have since learned even clear photographs can be misleading. There are too many things to look out for on a firearm. I have noticed several GB Pythons with the rear sight blade all the way to one side which in my experience is a barrel that is not on center. Maybe you are safe with a credit card but that is not always 100%.
With Pythons there are several sellers trying to unload counterfeit, Made in China, manuals, test targets,boxes and even labels (including the Colt Custom Shop yellow label).

 

[rollin_hot]

GB

I also like the GB auctions where the seller goes out of their way to hide the fact that the gun has a lock.

Tons of pictures of everything except the side the lock is on, or it will have a pic of the side but the camera will be angled so the lock is hidden behind the cylinder release.

Watch for it, it's almost comical.

 

[Ralph G. Briscoe]

I've had good luck with GB with one exception. I bought a Police Positive last year from a private party. It was advertised as "original finish," "locks up tight." It looked OK in the not-great pictures, and a bargain price. Of course it turned out it was an obvious reblue and did not "lock up tight." I sent the seller an Email that tore him a new one and could probably have gotten a refund. However I determined that, though it was not as advertised, it was worth the low price.

 

[geotech]

Been in this boat myself with a fella in PA who always sells S&W stocks on GB. Wanted a pair of good condition factories of the era for my Model 15 shooter. I was totally amazed this seller had one-pair of new-old-stock! Corresponded via email and even a phone call about them, and seemed to have passed my sniff test so I bid with confidence. I win and send my money order next day by Certified Mail. He gets it the following day according to tracking. Seven days later I get an email thanking me for payment and my grips were packed and ready to ship - great, I just had my shooter gone through mechanically at S&W and they'd arrive a day apart.

I get the package and in it are not a set of new old stock, but two mismatched stocks with very different color, grain, and one with a severely peeled medallion. Also included was a hand-scribbled note saying I dropped your grips on the concrete and one cracked. Please accept these very finely matched, but used grips and a $20 refund! Umm.... I paid an outstanding premium for new old stock stocks, and get a pair of lackluster, mismatched used stocks and $20 back, which then is about $50 higher than other GB sellers that have very nice sets for! REALLY!?!? I ended up getting my purchase money back after some hardnosed exchanges, but the *** robbed me for shipping $15 (he actually sent for $4.95 in a USPS FREE flat-rate box) and I ate the $4.95 returning the garbage to him (wanted tracking/delivery confirmation), and he thought that was fair! The $20 wasn't worth any more of my time to fight, but this guy is a FRAUD since he could have emailed me that what I purchased was damaged and simply sent back my money order and not lied in an email to me saying my grips were packed and ready to ship! Caveat emptor, I know.

 

[lhump1961]

There is a guy now on GB describing his model 19 as a 3" when it is obviously a 2 1/2". Same guy same problem on a 66. No response to emails and of course it is "as is/no refunds". Pass, thank you very much! Another seller has a 66-1 listed as "LN unfired" with a case colored trigger...not hard chromed like it should be and like the hammer is. Funny stuff goes on.

And there are bids on these guns!

 

[perrazi]

i have bought several guns on the main site for gun auctions and a few more on two others. fortunately i haven't been to unhappy yet. i will not buy from someone that has several negatives and must have at least 20 positives. i have bought no return guns and been very happy,but some deals that don't pass the smell test i pass on. so far, anything i have sold has been through here and will try to keep it that way. i feel that this site has a higher than usual quality than most gun sites in that the knowledge is better and wider ranging than most. not to mention it is one of the most civil of the ones i have been to. long may it live.

 

[sirrduke2010]

"New" is an inexact word that can mean different things.

I know I have seen the definition of new as it pertains to purchasing an item but just because someone say something is new doesn't mean it is in perfect condition. The area which seems to be the trap is that new can also mean never used or a new bike could be new to someone else. The person has never owned the bike so the bike is considered new to her. I wanted to say a statement of condition is important as well. As a seller it is important to be honest with my clients. If I say something is new it means to me to be that it is never been used and give an accounting about the condition of the item as well. An escrow type of service is valuable in prohibiting Fraud as are credit card purchases. Pay Pal and Payment services are valuable. USPS Money orders can help prevent Fraud as well. Here is a link to an article on eBay on "How to prevent eBay scams or Fraud." The link is: How to Avoid eBay Scams and Fraud

 

[mkk41]

Just remember , if it sounds too good to be true , it probably is.

Look for someone with a high number of transactions , and at least 99%positive feedback. There's always bound to be at least 1 sourpuss.

Don't deal with anyone who has too many negative feedbacks.

I only have a handful of transactions , but 100% positive (A+) feedback.

Much like Ebay , some buyers/sellers didn't give me any feedback , though the deal went well.

When I buy and pay , I expect positive feedback immediately , as I have fulfilled my obligation , regardless of the eventual satisfaction or dissatisfaction with the item I'm buying , or the sellers actions.

When I sell , and someone pays me immediately , I give them a positive.

My latest deal was with Handejector himself , and it was a perfect transaction.

 

[old bear]

The Internet has opened up a whole new world for each and every one of us, the ability to buy sell and trade items, 15 years ago this was unheard of. As with any opportunity there will always be a few dishonest people who are willing to steal from the rest of us.
Any auction site can be an open invention to fraud or downright theft, so Gun broker is not necessarily the bad guy here. I do though have some hard and fast rules for any on-line purchase I make, firearm or not. Only do business with seller who has a "brick and mortar" location, only use sellers who have an A++ rating, the seller must offer an inspection/return period, and last but not least the seller must accept American Express credit cards.
I know I have lost out one some guns I really wanted and perhaps have paid more than was necessary to get some others, but all it takes is one BAD deal to wipe out several GOOD deals. At my age I no longer have the inculcation to have to take on one more fight with some scammer S.O.B.

 

[M3Stuart]

What I find annoying is the rampant use of "LNIB" in the descriptions of pretty much everything. Then, when you start looking at the pictures, it's just an ordinary scratch-n-dent gun.

 

[celticfisherman]

I've bought a few off the big box site and I haven't been displeased. But I pretty much quit because in GA we have a good site that pretty much allows me to buy and trade and sell without shipping. AND I HATE SHIPPING!

 

[AllAces]

There are bad deals everywhere

Haris1,

I agree. There are GB deals that are unreal, as in "not real". However, there are bad deals everywhere. I recently had buys on another forum (begins with 19 and ends with 10+1). One experience was excellent, first rate dude. The other, from a "long time member", went sideways on me. Fortunately, not a lot of money was lost.

 

[dlbx2]

Haris, the 4" 27-2 nickel that I sold you about a year ago went about as smoothly as any sale that I have made. It was the only gun that I have sold that was absolutely LNIB. Haven't had one like it since. I do have an unfired 6" 29-2 in the case, but it is my first 29, and won't be for sale. I guess you have about one of everything by now!
David