H&R handgun question
- Thread starter growr
- Start date
They do and the gun is open in the pic. The ejection feature is usually the first thing to stop working correctly in these old top breaks. Often when worn or parts have broken the gun tries to eject the entire cyl when opened.
Seems a bit odd that the cyl would be bored straight through which would leave the throat dia at .379 with a bore dia of .357. All is not lost however. I figured out a way for you to shoot it. If there is indeed no taper in the chambers then you can trim .38 spl or .357 brass to just under cyl length which would make the throat dia .357. Then shoot very light loads with flush seated WCs or correctly sized round balls. I have to wonder if at some time in the past someone reamed the chambers straight through to convert your gun to .38 Spl
I dropped a .38 spl casing into the cylinder with no issues. A seated flush 148 wadcutter is just short of the cylinder mouth.
Would it be best to load it with blackpowder or it looks like 2.5 gr. of Unique is a mild load with a 148.
If I use a 158 RNL I would have to trim the casings to Short Colt length which isn't a problem, just an extra step.
Randy
Would it be best to load it with blackpowder or it looks like 2.5 gr. of Unique is a mild load with a 148.
If I use a 158 RNL I would have to trim the casings to Short Colt length which isn't a problem, just an extra step.
Randy
Randy, check your PMs. I have a small amount of SC brass I can send you.
I've always used Bullseye or Trailboss loads for my 32 and 38 top breaks. Looking at the Hodgons reloading site you will find several loads for lighter 93 and 135 gr lead bullets using their powders.
I think a light load of Bullseye or Red Dot would be a better choice than Unique with your bullet weight, if your revolver is sound. Say around 2-2.2 grs of either. Velocity and pressures will be lower.
John
I've always used Bullseye or Trailboss loads for my 32 and 38 top breaks. Looking at the Hodgons reloading site you will find several loads for lighter 93 and 135 gr lead bullets using their powders.
I think a light load of Bullseye or Red Dot would be a better choice than Unique with your bullet weight, if your revolver is sound. Say around 2-2.2 grs of either. Velocity and pressures will be lower.
John
I would use the .38 spl cases as they are since that would basically give you a .357 chamber throat. Unique is not a good powder for very light loads as it needs more pressure to burn well. Bullseye burns well at very low pressure. Use a flush seated WC and check loading manuals for starting loads of Bullseye depending on bullet weight and type. There was an article in my old AR Handloading manual about minimum loads with .38 spl WCs. A guy was able to get velocities low enough to shoot into cardboard boxes in his garage. You should be able to get clean burning loads at pressure levels that are safe in your old revolver.
I checked the article about minimum loads in the .38 spl and the author was able to go as low as .75 grs of Bullseye with a flush seated WC in a 1 7/8” model 36 but warned that bullets would stick in longer barrels. Velocity was only 165 FPS. If I was doing your project I would start with a flush seated 148 gr WC and 1.5 grs of any fast powder like Bullseye, Red Dot-Promo, 700X, Clays, Titewad or what have you. You could probably get at least 400 FPS with a 148 gr bullet with very low pressure and no fear of blowing up your old gun. A good 30 ft tin can or Cottontail load.
Interesting project for sure. I keep thinking about it. The factory .38 spl HBWC round is pretty light with pressures probably no higher than the .38 S&W ctg. The near perfect match of the target round in your gun makes me wonder if it might have come from the factory like it is. I’ll bet it would handle the factory WC round with no problems.
To all wondering if the H&R revolver might be a rimfire.....
So I primed an empty .38 spl case and fired to see if it would strike center or out at the rim.....it struck dead center.
Which leads me to believe it was not a conversion but rather a centerfire from H&R
Randy
So I primed an empty .38 spl case and fired to see if it would strike center or out at the rim.....it struck dead center.
Which leads me to believe it was not a conversion but rather a centerfire from H&R
Randy
Looking at the H&R book by Bill Goforth, your pistol is what's called the Auto Ejecting Second Model, or the H&R Automatic. From the barrel markings your model was made between 1897-1904. As mentioned earlier, since there are no caliber markings it is a black powder pistol.
Removing the left grip will give you the complete serial number, as there's a letter in front of the serial number that will also give a better idea of a manufacture date. Letter should be C through G.
C-1897
D-1898-1898
E-1900-1901
F-1902-1903
G-1904
Removing the left grip will give you the complete serial number, as there's a letter in front of the serial number that will also give a better idea of a manufacture date. Letter should be C through G.
C-1897
D-1898-1898
E-1900-1901
F-1902-1903
G-1904
Last edited:
The .38 spl as we all know was first introduced as a black powder ctg so the H&R in question could have been factory chambered for the .38 spl “Target Round” which is today a very low pressure factory ctg. The short cyl would have prevented it from being used with the hotter 158 gr RN “Service Round”. Pure speculation of course since the gun can’t talk. But given it’s age and the habits of the average Joe I would bet it has fired a fair number of 158 gr factory rounds with the bullet nose cut off so they would fit in the chambers without tying up the gun. Not very smart but the gun is still all together after all these years.
I think your H&R is a 2nd model, 5th variation. The full serial number with letter most likely is under the top strap, as the one below. You'll have to remove the cylinder to see it. As others have already said, no caliber marking left side of barrel = blackpowder.
As Bill Goforth mentions in his book, nothing is concrete when it comes to H&R serial numbers! Some of them where his best guess at the time, since he was the only one really digging deep into H&R.
And as CZU mentions, it might be under the top strap, which can be easily seen with the cylinder removed.
I have a couple H&R pistols that don't follow what should be protocol, but with the barrel markings and the frame, and that there are no caliber marks, I would still say it's an Auto Ejecting 2nd model.
And as CZU mentions, it might be under the top strap, which can be easily seen with the cylinder removed.
I have a couple H&R pistols that don't follow what should be protocol, but with the barrel markings and the frame, and that there are no caliber marks, I would still say it's an Auto Ejecting 2nd model.
According to the book, the difference in variations is mainly barrel markings!
The 3rd Model is when it was strengthened for smokeless powder and the caliber was listed on the barrel left side. And at some point, the cylinder was no longer free wheeling.
The 3rd Model is when it was strengthened for smokeless powder and the caliber was listed on the barrel left side. And at some point, the cylinder was no longer free wheeling.
BigBill
Absent Comrade
I purchased a h&r they thought was nickel. It was a 22 lr in chrome.
Similar threads
