Heating Options for the Great White North

[cmj8591]

Most of the people I hang with in Maine are using some type of combination. All of them have wood stoves that get used mostly during times of power outage or when cheap wood is available. The Renni's are popular mostly as a convenience. If you want to heat things up quick to take a shower or something like that, you can switch it on and then turn it off when the wood stove gets going. The outdoor wood fired boilers are pretty popular also. One of my friends has his place set up with radiant heat in the floor and the place is always toasty even when it's below zero. During the cold snaps, he still only has to feed it about once a day. I think it also takes types of wood that can't be used in a house stove. Everyone I know up there has a generator. It's considered a survival necessity. I know people who have gone more than a month with no electric service after a big storm. I guess that's why any EV's you see up there have plates from someplace else.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Research ductless cold climate heat pumps, and ignore anyone that tells you a heat pump won't work in the Nord. They are all the rage here, cheap to run and very efficient, good down to zero outside temps. And as an added bonus, AC in the summer. If it were me, I would go with the heat pumps and the Rinai for a backup during the most bitter cold weather when the heat pump works hard to keep up.

Interesting... I had heard that the newer ones worked well in colder temps. Do you have a recommendation (brand/model)? As it turns out my neighbour here is originally from VT and her sisters still live there & in Maine. She has thought of a heat pump for her place. For everyday heat on the open-plan main floor she has a small wood stove which is perfect.

She has a gas furnace but almost never uses it except when it gets really cold, like last winter when it briefly hit 0ºF, VERY cold for here; as it rarely goes below about 16º. A heat pump could be integrated into her duct work.

 

[DUSTYDOGDAN]

Research Franklin Wood Stove

The Franklin wood stove is a free standing, cast iron fireplace created in 1741 by Benjamin Franklin.
If you have room they are a great wood burner that you can place a Dutch oven on and cook a meal or put a cowboy coffee pot on as well.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Out of curiosity, does anyone have experience with a masonry furnace ("kachelofen", Tulikivi)? They're bulky and expensive to make, (esp. the Finnish Tulikivi as they're made from soapstone) but from what I've read they are excellent and really efficient and clean-burning. You fire them up at full tilt morning and evening; the masonry slowly absorbs the heat and then slowly radiates it after the fire burns down.

 

[dockmurgw]

Interesting... I had heard that the newer ones worked well in colder temps. Do you have a recommendation (brand/model)? As it turns out my neighbour here is originally from VT and her sisters still live there & in Maine. She has thought of a heat pump for her place. For everyday heat on the open-plan main floor she has a small wood stove which is perfect.

She has a gas furnace but almost never uses it except when it gets really cold, like last winter when it briefly hit 0ºF, VERY cold for here; as it rarely goes below about 16º. A heat pump could be integrated into her duct work.

Here is one manufacturer. I have a Daikin brand in my office building, and that's all I use for heat and AC.

Residential HVAC – Home Heating and Cooling | Mitsubishi Electric

They work quite well, and they keep getting more efficient at colder temps as new refrigerant is being developed. We get rebates here for installing them.

 

[mtgianni]

If you think there is the slightest chance of living there full time I would suggest you look into a small high efficiency furnace.
Looking at the website of the Rinnai heater the best I see is an 82 percent.
Electric baseboard will be expensive to operate and most likely require a fairly good size generator in the event of power outages. The small furnace would require less power to operate.

What is the size of the "cabin" you are thinking of?

A Rennai retails under $2000 at Home Depot and goes from boxed to running inside of 4 hours by a trained person. Ducted furnaces in a modular will show the ducts, take 4 days to install the system and be over $6,000. More if you pay to have the ducts boxed in.
If the heating costs are $1000 a year and the 8% difference in burner efficiency at peak usage is the same you save $80 a year in fuel costs. Assume the builder charges $2500 for the Rennai, payback of the principle without interest is in 43.75 years.

My ductless heat pump is used for cooling and manufacturer says not to use it below 13 F. I filled up my tank in Aug @2.01 per gallon of LP. Electric cost is just under 14 cents per kwh. It is about a wash to run either. I put aside $100 per month for LP and have a balance each year. LP runs a furnace, rennai space heater, range, dryer and BBQ grill.

 

[gjgalligan]

Your heat pump would be useless in Montana if you can't use below 13 degrees.
In the late 80s I was installing furnaces in new build home and it had to be a mighty big house to take 4 days!
I didn't say putting in a furnace would be cheap, I just suggested as a better option.

 

[Farmer17]

I would look at using spray foam insulation on the walls and ceiling and make sure you have some Low E, Argon gas windows. A small HVAC split system that runs on propane along with a wood burning fireplace that is tied to the ductwork to heat the air flowing with the heater fan on. If the burning wood keeps the temperature warm enough the thermostat never kicks in the propane furnace.

 

[yaktamer]

A Rennai retails under $2000 at Home Depot and goes from boxed to running inside of 4 hours by a trained person. Ducted furnaces in a modular will show the ducts, take 4 days to install the system and be over $6,000. More if you pay to have the ducts boxed in.
If the heating costs are $1000 a year and the 8% difference in burner efficiency at peak usage is the same you save $80 a year in fuel costs. Assume the builder charges $2500 for the Rennai, payback of the principle without interest is in 43.75 years.

My ductless heat pump is used for cooling and manufacturer says not to use it below 13 F. I filled up my tank in Aug @2.01 per gallon of LP. Electric cost is just under 14 cents per kwh. It is about a wash to run either. I put aside $100 per month for LP and have a balance each year. LP runs a furnace, rennai space heater, range, dryer and BBQ grill.

Thanks to everybody for all the responses. As noted in mtgianni's post here, if I go with the modular a ducted furnace isn't really a practical option. Looks like best option for me would be the Rinnai and a woodstove. Since I'd need propane for the Rinnai anyway, and I prefer cooking with gas as well, I'd probably go for a gas water heater as well, either 50 gallon or tankless.

 

[AlHunt]

I live in the frozen north. A wood stove and a wood lot to cut your own firewood. Have a plan to cut and split your wood and a large wood shed accessible from the house. You're talking about retirement age so arrange all the mechanical advantages you can.

Be firewood independent. Firewood goes up every time oil/gas spike and doesn't follow it back down.

The best advice I ever got about firewood was, any time you move it, move it in the direction of the stove.

 

[mtgianni]

Thanks to everybody for all the responses. As noted in mtgianni's post here, if I go with the modular a ducted furnace isn't really a practical option. Looks like best option for me would be the Rinnai and a woodstove. Since I'd need propane for the Rinnai anyway, and I prefer cooking with gas as well, I'd probably go for a gas water heater as well, either 50 gallon or tankless.

I worked in the Natural Gas service industry for3+ decades. I built in 2017 and went with an electric water heater. There is no vent in the house, the electronic safety controls on gas water heaters are what fails now, not tanks, and I have been pleased with it.
If you put in an LP water heater you will need to bring in outside combustion air with a duct that is open to the outside and have a vent that penetrates the roof or wall with a powered side vent.