help on 158 gr LSWCHP load for .38 spl+p

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auburn2

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I am handloading .38 special for self defense. I want to go with 158gr LSWCHPs as the bullet has an excellent reputation. Since the .38 is already somewhat limited I want to get as much velocity as possible while staying with a 158 grain lead bullet.

I am planning on using Magnus swaged bullets - number 516 on this page:
SWAGED LEAD BULLETS/38cal-45cal-44cal at .40 CALIBER HARD CAST LEAD

Alliant lists a load for speer 158gr LSWCs; 6.0gr of power pistol will generate 1037fps out of a 4" barrell. That should do similar with the magnus bullets and it is substantially faster than any other 158gr lead recipe I've seen. So I think this is the load I am going to use in my model 64 4".

I am debating whether I should also use this load in a 2" J-frame. I know I will lose velocity regardless but with a short barrel would I be better off changing powders and going with a faster burning powder like Bullsey?
 
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I'm not familar with Magnus bullets but that seems a little hot for a swaged bullet. You usally don't see swaged and hard cast in the same line.

6 gr of Power pistol is their max load for + P so I guess it could be done. It's your gun and is a published load. If it's indeed a hard cast you should be ok, if not hard cast you will probably get some leading.

Let us know how they work out.
 
i load 5 gr. of unique with a lyman 358156 hp. 155 gr. with a 50/50 mix of ww and pure lead. it is very close to +p they are ok in my model 60 j frame and that load is super accurate. i am not 100% convinced a hp. is so great anyway. i don't think at pistol velocitys they are guaranteed to expand. i have did many wet paper and water jug test where i got no or very little expansion even when 357s were used. i have shot a deer with a sierra 180 gr. jhc out of a 44 mag, it went all the way through on a lung shot with no expansion at all. i once shot another deer with a 41 mag with a 170 gr. sierra jhc. the bullet hit the back bone and the lead nose came off the bullet. i shot a hog between the eyes with the 41 load and the bullet went down the neck bone and went all to pieces, all i found was the jacket. i really like a solid swc better.
 
olskool said:
i load 5 gr. of unique with a lyman 358156 hp. 155 gr. with a 50/50 mix of ww and pure lead. it is very close to +p they are ok in my model 60 j frame and that load is super accurate. i am not 100% convinced a hp. is so great anyway. i don't think at pistol velocitys they are guaranteed to expand. i have did many wet paper and water jug test where i got no or very little expansion even when 357s were used. i have shot a deer with a sierra 180 gr. jhc out of a 44 mag, it went all the way through on a lung shot with no expansion at all. i once shot another deer with a 41 mag with a 170 gr. sierra jhc. the bullet hit the back bone and the lead nose came off the bullet. i shot a hog between the eyes with the 41 load and the bullet went down the neck bone and went all to pieces, all i found was the jacket. i really like a solid swc better.
Click to expand...

Were those lead bullets or jacketed bullets you tested? The reason I want to use swaged lead is for better expansion. I know it exapands well in water jugs, even with mild .38 handoads.

Do you know how fast 38156 is out of your J-Frame?
 
The 6.0 grain of Power Pistol is a good load that performs as advertised....but note that it is "flashy" in low light. The highest velocity load is the highest velocity load in all barrel lengths. "short barrel" loadings may select a powder for lower flash or less noise but faster powders are NOT the route to top velocity in a snubby. I happen to like 5grains of Unique for general use. 5.4 grainsUnique will be close to the 6 of PP and less flashy.... but if flash doesn't matter Power Pistol is marvelous.
 
No idea about the load data but if that is the weight Bullet you want you should consider the Rim Rock with the Gas Check. They are a very nice product and they just might run a lot cleaner in your setup esp due to the gas check.


Bob
 
Here's another vote for the gas-checked, soft lead Rimrock bullet over the swaged Magnus bullet. Magnus makes great bullets, but running a swaged bullet at +P pressures/velocities is going to give you a lot of leading, no matter how well the bullet diameter is fitted to the gun.
 
i have tested them all lead and jacket hp an sp. i will say this, back in the early 80s i loaded some 140 gr. speer hp with 8.4 gr. of blue dot and i think a mag primer. i gave some to my dad for his model 15 i am not glorifying this but it did happen. he was defending his home and was forced to shoot a very large man with one in the leg. i don't know if if it expanded but he said the man stopped, had a shocked look on his face wobbled from side to side then fell and cried like a girl. never underestimate the power of a 38 one thing about it, a hp. lead or jacket even if they don't expand will mess up a good day for a bad guy.
 
My take on the 38 Spl is that there is so little difference in performance between the +P and std. pressure loads, especially out of a short barrel, that it doesn't make much sense to worry about "maximizing" through powder choice or charge. It's always going to be relatively slow...

IMO, the std. velocity 158 works just fine. Pick a SWC or SWC-HP and load a faster-burning propellant to max std.-pressure load. This will have less muzzle-flash (especially than some of the powders mentioned above), which is a bigger factor in a fight than 30-50 fps. There's also no doubt in the back of one's mind that the load may be too much for the gun. (You've got bigger things to worry about at that moment.)

A well-shaped 158 (avoid RN) at standard velocity should make you feel confident that you're well-armed. Shot placement and keep shooting until the threat is stopped are the keys.
 
i agree 100% with mma10mm +p or standard velocity there ain't a dimes worth of difference to matter. i was in a gun shop in the 70s some young men was asking if the 38 target loads they were about to buy was good enough to stop a man. the old man at the shop said well it would ruin his day if shot with one.
 
My replica FBI Load is made with a Speer or Hornady 158gr LSWC/HP bullet and HS-6. I have done a lot of work on replicating the FBI load and that combination has performed the best for me. HS-6 will deliver the velocity you're looking for but will generate less pressure than other powders in the same burn rate range.

I am debating whether I should also use this load in a 2" J-frame. I know I will lose velocity regardless but with a short barrel would I be better off changing powders and going with a faster burning powder like Bullsey?
Click to expand...
I would NOT use a powder as fast as Bullseye because you will max out the pressures well before you reach the velocities you're trying to achieve. A good load is a good load even when shot from a shorter barrel. Whichever powder shoots best in a 4" barrel should be used in a 2" barrel too...
 
I recommend that instead of using handloads for self defense, you buy the Buffalo Bore 158g +P version instead. That way, you will not be compromised legally if you actually have to use them.
I have the LSWC version, but they also offer a LSWC-HP version as well. I shot a few to see how they shot from my J frame. They really pack a punch and feel almost like magnum loads. And accuracy at 10 yards offhand was amazing.
 
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It depends a LOT on how much your J frame weighs and its frame type on the load it is able to shoot.

950 fps has been done...............and more power to you if you can shoot five in a row and not complain.

A lot reduce it to 850 in a J frame which is also a full load for some.

Todays factory stuff runs around 788 to800 fps and can be safe in all J frames and has less recoil, if needed.

Pick your poison.
 
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