HELP- WW II 38 M&P - C.T. Co. ??? >>>>>>>>> LETTER Update

[handejector]

Hi Guys,
A fairly mundane 38 M&P in 38 Special, Ser # 835555, all 5 metal numbers match:

There are NO military marks, but there is this- anybody know what "C.T. Co." was? "17" stamped into the wood. The grips were NEVER numbered, but appear to be fitted to the gun.

ALSO interesting is the "T" and the "S" at the top corners of the gripstraps, which I don't recall ever seeing before:

Finally, an "S" stamped under the barrel:

 

[handejector]

Hi Guys,
A fairly mundane 38 M&P in 38 Special, Ser # 835555, all 5 metal numbers match:

There are NO military marks, but there is this- anybody know what "C.T. Co." was? "17" stamped into the wood. The grips were NEVER numbered, but appear to be fitted to the gun.

ALSO interesting is the "T" and the "S" at the top corners of the gripstraps, which I don't recall ever seeing before:

Finally, an "S" stamped under the barrel:

 

[hsguy]

Lee, did you check to see if it had the new hammer block? Not the usual place for the "S" stamp but you never know. John

 

[handejector]

Originally posted by hsguy:
Lee, did you check to see if it had the new hammer block? Not the usual place for the "S" stamp but you never know. John

John,
Yes, I did. It has the typical PIVOTING hammer block (sailor killer) of a pre war gun.

 

[Kamerer]

Lee,

This may or may not help, but I have an immediate post war gun (S 934-something I think) with a "v" stamp up in that are of he grip strap (left side, like your "T"), so maybe they are assembly codes?

Also, I keep meaning to ask, where are you around Lake Oconee? I have family in that area - my uncle owns a marina on lake Sinclair and lives on property adjoining the forest. My parents were there just yesterday, actually.

 

[opoefc]

Lee, Letter the gun and tell us where it wa shipped - that may reveal the meaning of C.T. CO. The stamping looks like a factory stamping, so the invoice/shipping data may provide the answer, and the presence of the lanyard swivel leans toward a police or guard, even quasi-military destination. In my experience, the small letter & symbol stampings on various parts for S&Ws are nearly always a fitter/polisher/assembler or inspector (foreman) marks. Ed.

 

[m-1911]

Lee

I Googled C. T. Co and this is what I got

C.T.Co is a European IT solutions and services outsourcing company located in Riga, Latvia (EU). C.T.Co is a subsidiary of international technology services group Com Tec Co (CTC).

Since 1997, C.T.Co has established long-term trusted relationships with a number of leading European financial services companies such as Swiss Re (www.swissre.com), world's largest reinsurer.

CTC employs over 300 IT professionals, focusing on attracting the best talent matching the strong organizational culture. Through our commitment to personnel development, the company enjoys very low turnover rate contributing to the strategy of having highly professional, motivated and client-oriented workforce.

Somehow I doubt it is the same company

 

[walnutred]

I have seen transit company fare tokens marked CT Co. Would a transit company have had armed guards in that time period?

 

[walnutred]

Now that I think about most of the city transit companies were owned by the electric companies. Columbus Traction Company here in Ohio being an example. I can see an electric company having armed guards early in the war. Especially in Col. Oh.

 

[walnutred]

But I am sure there is a much more interesting answer to who this revolver was issued to.

 

[Kamerer]

"Transit" - now that's the likely answer. I figured it was a guard gun/security gun of some type -as I'm sure Lee did. I first guessed "Telegraph" - e.g. - something with enough importance to get a valuable gun via the WPB or whoever else it was that allotted firearms to the civilian market during the war. Transit sounds like a better idea.

 

[2152hq]

Could be just 'City Transit Co.'

 

[Jebus35745]

I've seen some guns around here (Cleveland, Ohio) with CTC used by the security at the old Cleveland Trust Company. It was one of the main banks here. One even had a badge for sale with it. Hope this helps, Larry

 

[CI_SeaWolf]

Going over some archives of our local utility showed that in March of 1942, sidearms (pistols) were carried by armed guards in electric substations here out west. The instructions were quite explicit, even telling the armed man to carry 5 rounds with the hammer on an empty chamber. It seems like this coincides with the start of relocating enemy aliens.

 

[cxm]

A long shot to be sure, but Central Traction was an inter-urban railroad that is now long out of business.

Railroads had their own police forces... so it is at least possible Central Traction had a need for revolvers in that time frame.

FWIW

Chuck

 

[ordnanceguy]

Hi Lee:

That is a neat gun. From our Pre-Victory Model Database I can estimate for you that it was likely shipped from the factory in the September, 1941 time frame.

I don't know what the butt marking is all about, but I would lean towards the Cxxx Trust Company angle as being most likely.

I think you need to spend the $30 for the factory letter so that the idle curiosity the rest of us have about it can be satisfied! ;<)

Regards,
Charlie Flick

 

[carguychris]

Originally posted by cxm:
A long shot to be sure, but Central Traction was an inter-urban railroad that is now long out of business.

Railroads had their own police forces... so it is at least possible Central Traction had a need for revolvers in that time frame.

FWIW if Central Traction operated RPO (Railway Post Office) service, it was normal in the pre-war days for at least one employee aboard every RPO car to be armed- you know, constitutional requirements to protect the mails and all that.

Just like cops, their armament usually consisted of a S&W or Colt .38Spl revolver.

Although most interurban railways didn't operate RPO service due to their strictly regional nature, I seem to recall that a few did.

Also, for the benefit of those unversed in U.S. railroad history, "traction" is a now-archaic term for local railways that use electric power from overhead wires- in other words, trolleys (if you were a Northener) or streetcars (if you were a Southerner).

An interurban was a railroad that operated regional city-to-city traction service as opposed to (or sometimes in addition to) local intracity service.

 

[handejector]

Originally posted by carguychris:

Originally posted by cxm:
A long shot to be sure, but Central Traction was an inter-urban railroad that is now long out of business.

Railroads had their own police forces... so it is at least possible Central Traction had a need for revolvers in that time frame.

FWIW if Central Traction operated RPO (Railway Post Office) service, it was normal in the pre-war days for at least one employee aboard every RPO car to be armed- you know, constitutional requirements to protect the mails and all that.

Just like cops, their armament usually consisted of a S&W or Colt .38Spl revolver.

Although most interurban railways didn't operate RPO service due to their strictly regional nature, I seem to recall that a few did.

Also, for the benefit of those unversed in U.S. railroad history, "traction" is a now-archaic term for local railways that use electric power from overhead wires- in other words, trolleys (if you were a Northener) or streetcars (if you were a Southerner).

An interurban was a railroad that operated regional city-to-city traction service as opposed to (or sometimes in addition to) local intracity service.

Chris,
Thanks. I'm not real well versed in RR stuff. I grew up in Atlanta in the 50's, and I remember steel rails for streetcars being every where in the city streets. The streetcars were no longer used, and I don't remember ever seeing them, but the tracks remained to challenge us on our bicycles! They had been replaced by full sized rubber tired electric busses that ran off the same overhead wires. Interestingly, the busses were called "trolleys" by everyone, but everyone still called the old "tracked" cars streetcars.

Charlie, Thanks for checking. I don't mind lettering it one bit. Only problem- I have 20-30 guns stacked up to letter! Does Roy still ask that SWCA members only request two per week, or can we ask for three, like normal folks?

 

[cxm]

Chris,

Would you private email me?

You don't have an email in your profile so I can't email you.

V/r

Chuck

Originally posted by carguychris:

Originally posted by cxm:
A long shot to be sure, but Central Traction was an inter-urban railroad that is now long out of business.

Railroads had their own police forces... so it is at least possible Central Traction had a need for revolvers in that time frame.

FWIW if Central Traction operated RPO (Railway Post Office) service, it was normal in the pre-war days for at least one employee aboard every RPO car to be armed- you know, constitutional requirements to protect the mails and all that.

Just like cops, their armament usually consisted of a S&W or Colt .38Spl revolver.

Although most interurban railways didn't operate RPO service due to their strictly regional nature, I seem to recall that a few did.

Also, for the benefit of those unversed in U.S. railroad history, "traction" is a now-archaic term for local railways that use electric power from overhead wires- in other words, trolleys (if you were a Northener) or streetcars (if you were a Southerner).

An interurban was a railroad that operated regional city-to-city traction service as opposed to (or sometimes in addition to) local intracity service.

 

[mikepriwer]

For what its worth, a trolley is not Northern or Southern. Its primary definition has to do
with the wheel that runs along a wire, gathering electric current. Electric buses use trolleys,
just like stretcars did. This is the real meaning of trolley; sometimes it refers to a vehicle,
but its general meaning is as above.

Later, Mike Priwer

1. a trolley car.
2. a pulley or truck traveling on an overhead track and serving to support and move a suspended object.
3. a grooved metallic wheel or pulley carried on the end of a pole (trolley pole) by an electric car or locomotive, and held in contact with an overhead conductor, usually a suspended wire (trolley wire), from which it collects the current for the propulsion of the car or locomotive.
4. any of various devices for collecting current for such a purpose, as a pantograph, or a bowlike structure (bow trolley) sliding along an overhead wire, or a device (underground trolley) for taking current from the underground wire or conductor used by some electric railways.
5. a small truck or car operated on a track, as in a mine or factory.
6. a serving cart, as one used to serve desserts.
7. Chiefly British. any of various low carts or vehicles, as a railway handcar or costermonger's cart.