Hinged box end label over-stamp?

[mmaher94087]

Some Double Action and Safety Hammerless box labels are over-stamped in ink with various codes. Two such stampings are: 9332 and 99231 2W. Does anyone recognize the meaning of these markings? At first, I thought of Telegraphic Codes, but those codes are names, not numbers. Anyone? Thanks.

 

[glowe]

Picture might help.

 

[mmaher94087]

OK, here's a photo. Life got in the way last Friday and the bummer outcome caused the delay. Here's one of several stamps that have been seen on these boxes. They are not serial numbers, but I ask, 'What is the meaning'? I have a few more boxes with the numbers like these, but they have different numbers on different boxes with different descriptions for the contents.

 

[Onomea]

I suggest post your question and photo in the S&W 1896 - 1961 revolver sub forum here. I bet you'd get an answer pretty quick.

https://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-hand-ejectors-1896-1961/

 

[glowe]

I believe that is a 1880s box with maybe a serial number stamped on the label before they started writing the number on the box bottom?? I don't think it would be an inventory number from a distributor or gun shop since it would be very unusual to find two boxes of different caliber using the same stampings. No references to these numbers have ever been found in the factory records, plus log books only used serial numbers to identify their boxed guns in inventory. Here is another end label box from a member here with the same stamp style used. I think it is 9482, which would indicate a 32 DA, 2nd Model timeframe.

 

[shown50]

I’m interested in this as well. I’ve got a few pictures on my computer of end labels that have stamps or stickers. The 4 digit numbers in the right corner all seem to follow the same pattern and font. The only other end label modifications I’ve seen are “Pearl” either stamped on the left/right bottom edge or written in cursive across the bottom, or if it’s gold washed, I’ve seen the finish scratched out.
I don’t have a big enough sample size to draw a definitive conclusion on the stamped numbers. Here’s a picture of what I think is a distributor added label for inventory.

 

[mmaher94087]

"I think it is 9482, which would indicate a 32 DA, 2nd Model timeframe." Unfortunately, the 8", .32 DA barrel didn't become available until the 4th Model along with the 10" and was dropped by the 5th Model. I'm pleased to see the first label "01-3231/2 W." in shown50's lineup. The 'W' appears on a box that I have: "99231 2W." Shown50's inventory idea follows the label: One, .32, with a 3 1/2" barrel. The inventory theory falls flat with my label. The only things that are similar is the 'W', blue finish and, if the 2 before the W is moved left, the last digits are 312.

 

[mmaher94087]

Another Stamp

Here's another example of the ink stamp and I threw in four miscellaneous dealer additions for giggles.

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,


Is it possible these numbers are inventory numbers for a large
catalog reseller like Sears, Roebuck & Co.?


Cheers!
Webb

 

[Boulder350]

Hi There,


Is it possible these numbers are inventory numbers for a large
catalog reseller like Sears, Roebuck & Co.?


Cheers!
Webb

I would agree with Webb. They look like a distributor inventory number.

Catalog no. 124. : Sears, Roebuck and Company : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

 

[glowe]

. . . Unfortunately, the 8", .32 DA barrel didn't become available until the 4th Model along with the 10" and was dropped by the 5th Model . . .

There were 8" barrels on 32 SAs and they overlapped the 32 DA in production. Makes it easy to put one on a 32 DA if ordered or left over from SA production?

 

[mmaher94087]

Hum.... good point. I suppose the barrel roll marks would tell the story. I haven't seen every S&W manufactured nor have I seen the .32 SA barrel on a 2nd Model .32 DA but it's possible. I wonder about the catalog number from a large distributor like Sears. What and where do these code numbers originate? Aarghh.

 

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

Is it possible these numbers are inventory numbers for a large
catalog reseller like Sears, Roebuck & Co.?

After a little research, I would amend the above statement by
changing the catalog reseller to Montgomery Wards. Wards
started in 1872 and Sears started in 1892. So they had 20
more years in the business during the 19th Century.


Cheers!
Webb

 

[BMur]

Inventory number

I agree with Webb,
They are catalog numbers from Major Distributors.
The only real question is what Distributor.
Photos depict 3 Different Distributor catalogs.
Notice 3 different catalog numbers for each gun photo’d?
Actually kinda neat because once you cross reference the Distributor catalog number to the gun box you’ll know which Distributor sold that gun.

Murph

 

[glowe]

Hum.... good point. I suppose the barrel roll marks would tell the story. I haven't seen every S&W manufactured nor have I seen the .32 SA barrel on a 2nd Model .32 DA but it's possible. I wonder about the catalog number from a large distributor like Sears. What and where do these code numbers originate? Aarghh.

I think the top stamping should reflect the 32 DA dates. Most likely, the forged barrels would have resided in a large barrel or other receptacle until taken out to shape, stamp, polish, and finish for either model.

 

[mmaher94087]

I found another example of the stamped numbers on the label. I can't tell the whole number because the first digit has a groomer on it, but I think it is 9939. I don't have a stash of catalogs to reference, but it would be great to identify where these numbers originated.

For interest, I think the $6.00 .32 from 1916 is neat with the mostly legible writing on the bottom. And I threw in the Smokeless disclaimer for giggles.

 

[BMur]

Series 9000

The 9000 series catalog numbers are from
H.D.FOLSOM, New York.
They are seen listed with various Smith & Wesson revolvers beginning in the 1880’s.
I don’t have any catalogs from 1916 but I do have 3 originals from the 1920’s for Folsom at another location. Catalog numbers usually stay the same for many years.

Do I get a cookie Mike?



Murph

 

[mmaher94087]

Thanks, Murph. Have two cookies - they're good! I'll start nosing through any old catalogs and see if I can match any numbers. I'm not sure when I'll find a Folsom catalog, but I'll be looking.

 

[BMur]

Grass Valley Show

My best recommendation is to simply attend the
GRASS VALLEY OLD WEST SHOW.

It’s only once a year in May. I rarely miss it. They have the best selection of catalog references that I’ve ever seen at one location.
In fact a large portion of my collection is from that show. Lots of original catalogs and typical reproductions but very rare hard to find stuff. They also have a decent amount of antique guns. I purchased a minty 4” Baby Russian at that show years ago but often you’ll find rare guns as well. Prices vary and are often at or above Market but I seem to find sleepers a lot.
I’m mostly there for the catalog and historical documentation references. What they have is beyond amazing!

I’m not advertising the show! I’m just pointing out a great source for catalog references.

Murph

 

[shown50]

Here’s another example I found on GB. It’s currently for sale so I can put a link for it here. It’s a 3 digit code as far as I can tell.