cjwils
Member
Does anyone have an idea why Colt historical letters ($75 to $300) are so much more expensive than S&W historical letters (usually $50)?
Historical letters
- Thread starter cjwils
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Titegroups
Member
Because it says "Colt" on it.
alaskavett
US Veteran
Greed, and the fact that SOMEBODY will pay... Kyle
DWalt
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Because they can. And because some people will pay for a letter with a Colt or S&W letterhead on it.
I know a lot of people place great store in getting their guns "lettered" but unless it's obviously a piece with a high probability of having important historical significance or rarity, I don't know why anyone would want to pay the fee for getting a more or less run-of-the-mill handgun lettered. I'd just about bet that most letters don't actually provide any information of value, mainly just the date of shipment and to whom shipped. Is that information really worth the money? I have a fair number of antique and near-antique pistols, but none are extraordinary or historic. From SNs I can pretty well date them, and why would I care to what distributor they were shipped?
Now if I had a gun reputedly owned/used by Pancho Villa, John Dillinger, Bonnie and Clyde, Wyatt Earp, George Patton, etc., etc., I would letter that one no matter the cost.
I know a lot of people place great store in getting their guns "lettered" but unless it's obviously a piece with a high probability of having important historical significance or rarity, I don't know why anyone would want to pay the fee for getting a more or less run-of-the-mill handgun lettered. I'd just about bet that most letters don't actually provide any information of value, mainly just the date of shipment and to whom shipped. Is that information really worth the money? I have a fair number of antique and near-antique pistols, but none are extraordinary or historic. From SNs I can pretty well date them, and why would I care to what distributor they were shipped?
Now if I had a gun reputedly owned/used by Pancho Villa, John Dillinger, Bonnie and Clyde, Wyatt Earp, George Patton, etc., etc., I would letter that one no matter the cost.
Here are a few very good reasons for obtaining factory letters:
There are plenty of uncommon S & W models and variations, and verifying such guns are in factory original condition adds value, or at least confirms a gun is worth an asking price. Confirming a ship date that matches a special occasion (the "birthday gun"). As you noted, the chance (however small) that a gun was ordered by and shipped to somebody famous - see the cover of the 2009 or 28th edition of the Blue Book. Just plain curiosity, or a desire to know the history of a particular gun to the extent possible.
I agree lettering a common recent gun probably has little value beyond the curiosity factor, and information as to ownership/use after the factory is rare. If you'll excuse me, I have a letter request to fill out
.
There are plenty of uncommon S & W models and variations, and verifying such guns are in factory original condition adds value, or at least confirms a gun is worth an asking price. Confirming a ship date that matches a special occasion (the "birthday gun"). As you noted, the chance (however small) that a gun was ordered by and shipped to somebody famous - see the cover of the 2009 or 28th edition of the Blue Book. Just plain curiosity, or a desire to know the history of a particular gun to the extent possible.
I agree lettering a common recent gun probably has little value beyond the curiosity factor, and information as to ownership/use after the factory is rare. If you'll excuse me, I have a letter request to fill out
.Dragon88
Member
Many collectors have high-dollar guns, such that spending an extra $50 on one is inconsequential in the grand scheme of things. Especially when that $50 letter can reveal very interesting and important information about a gun, which may add personal or monetary value well beyond the cost of the letter.
And another point, perhaps unimportant to others but interesting to me: if one collects specimens of a particular uncommon model, lettering them will show you what sections of the country most appreciated the model when it was new. There are clear geographic preferences for some models, and if you letter enough guns, you will actually find out something about the society that bought them. I have been a data squeezer all my life. The more you know, the more you can deduce.
Actually, I need to get a request off for three more S&W letters today! (I haven't lettered a Colt yet, but I have a couple of candidates whose value would be enhanced if I can document their status as early specimens of their kind.)
But arguments and evidence aside, it boils down to this: letters are the kind of thing that will appeal to people who like that kind of thing, but not to those who don't.
Actually, I need to get a request off for three more S&W letters today! (I haven't lettered a Colt yet, but I have a couple of candidates whose value would be enhanced if I can document their status as early specimens of their kind.)
But arguments and evidence aside, it boils down to this: letters are the kind of thing that will appeal to people who like that kind of thing, but not to those who don't.
Driftwood Johnson
Member
Well, I have lettered a Colt, and I am not rich. I have two 2nd Gen SAAs. By the serial numbers I already knew that one was made in 1968 and the other in 1973. I also knew that the earlier one is a parts gun, the grip frame is not original to it. I knew this because the dealer I bought it from was honest and told me up front. So I had no interest in lettering that gun.
My other one is slightly newer, like I said 1973. But at the time it was the most expensive gun I owned, and I wanted to find out a bit more about it. Most interesting was the fact that when I bought it the gun came with two cylinders. A standard cylinder and a 'long flute' cylinder. I had paid enough for the gun that I it was worth it to me to find out the story behind the second cylinder. I wanted to know if it had originally shipped with the gun. But the most interesting thing I found out was that the gun had left the factory in January of 1973 with a twelve inch barrel! It was shipped to a sporting goods company in Iowa. Then it was returned to the factory in December of 1973 and reshipped to a company in Connecticut. When I bought the gun in 2004 it had a 7 1/2" barrel on it, obviously professionally done, I had no reason to doubt it was not original.
So what my $100 told me was my Colt had shipped very early in 1973 with a 12" barrel and one cylinder. There would have been a notation if it had shipped with two cylinders. Less than a year later it showed up back at the factory and had its barrel bobbed to 7 1/2" and a second cylinder fitted. Then it was shipped someplace completely different. Pretty interesting, and I always remember all that whenever I shoot it.
S&W letters were always a huge bargain at $30. I should have taken advantage of it and lettered a bunch more of mine at that price, but I did not. I still have a couple that I want to letter at $50, and they are unusual enough that they will be worth it.
By the way, the most valuable gun I own is a New Model #3 that I bought in January of this year. Paid about twice what I paid for the Colt. And thankfully, the previous owner had already lettered it, so I already knew everything there was to know about it. Shipped in August 1882. Refinished at the factory in 1965. Looks brand new still. But the most interesting part of that letter is it was part of a shipment of 4 identical pistols, and they were billed at $13 each! So much for no information about value.
That's why you letter a gun.
I also find it very interesting to note that my New Model #3 was shipped to a distributor in Boston, and did not travel very far in its almost 130 years, whereas my Colt was shipped to Iowa, then reshipped to Connecticut, before I wound up buying it in Mass. I think that is very interesting information.
By the way, since joining the SWCA I have taken advantage of the policy of getting ship dates on several old Smiths. Very useful. No juicy details, just the ship date. Another good bargain. Because you can't always tell by the SN when it shipped.
P.S. It took around 6 months for me to get my Colt letter. Roy does much better than that.
My other one is slightly newer, like I said 1973. But at the time it was the most expensive gun I owned, and I wanted to find out a bit more about it. Most interesting was the fact that when I bought it the gun came with two cylinders. A standard cylinder and a 'long flute' cylinder. I had paid enough for the gun that I it was worth it to me to find out the story behind the second cylinder. I wanted to know if it had originally shipped with the gun. But the most interesting thing I found out was that the gun had left the factory in January of 1973 with a twelve inch barrel! It was shipped to a sporting goods company in Iowa. Then it was returned to the factory in December of 1973 and reshipped to a company in Connecticut. When I bought the gun in 2004 it had a 7 1/2" barrel on it, obviously professionally done, I had no reason to doubt it was not original.
So what my $100 told me was my Colt had shipped very early in 1973 with a 12" barrel and one cylinder. There would have been a notation if it had shipped with two cylinders. Less than a year later it showed up back at the factory and had its barrel bobbed to 7 1/2" and a second cylinder fitted. Then it was shipped someplace completely different. Pretty interesting, and I always remember all that whenever I shoot it.
S&W letters were always a huge bargain at $30. I should have taken advantage of it and lettered a bunch more of mine at that price, but I did not. I still have a couple that I want to letter at $50, and they are unusual enough that they will be worth it.
By the way, the most valuable gun I own is a New Model #3 that I bought in January of this year. Paid about twice what I paid for the Colt. And thankfully, the previous owner had already lettered it, so I already knew everything there was to know about it. Shipped in August 1882. Refinished at the factory in 1965. Looks brand new still. But the most interesting part of that letter is it was part of a shipment of 4 identical pistols, and they were billed at $13 each! So much for no information about value.
That's why you letter a gun.
I also find it very interesting to note that my New Model #3 was shipped to a distributor in Boston, and did not travel very far in its almost 130 years, whereas my Colt was shipped to Iowa, then reshipped to Connecticut, before I wound up buying it in Mass. I think that is very interesting information.
By the way, since joining the SWCA I have taken advantage of the policy of getting ship dates on several old Smiths. Very useful. No juicy details, just the ship date. Another good bargain. Because you can't always tell by the SN when it shipped.
P.S. It took around 6 months for me to get my Colt letter. Roy does much better than that.
Last edited:
TACC1
US Veteran
If you had a firearm whose identity, as to model & etc., was
murky or in question, the letter from S&W will tell you that info.
I finally found a revolver that I Really like, but don't know what it is.
I'm having the action worked on while waiting for the letter. I'll
know what to look for if the repairs don't work out. TACC1
murky or in question, the letter from S&W will tell you that info.
I finally found a revolver that I Really like, but don't know what it is.
I'm having the action worked on while waiting for the letter. I'll
know what to look for if the repairs don't work out. TACC1
august1410
Member
Quite honestly, I just want the letter to find out if mine was a police gun. I know what year it was manufactured, I just want a little more info on it.
JSR III
SWCA Member Absent Comrade
Unless you letter the gun, how will you ever know that the gun was owned/used by Pancho Villa, John Dillinger, Bonnie and Clyde, Wyatt Earp, George Patton, etc., etc.,???
I recently purchased a Model 1917 .45 DA and found out that it was shipped to the Chief Ordnance Inspector at the Springfield Armory that was in charge of monitoring the production of all S&W Model of 1917 .45 DA revolvers and was his personal gun. That is a fairly non significant gun that was produced in the thousands for war time use, however, had I not inquired, I would have never known exactly how significant this particular one was.
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