Holosun C optic vs K on M2 C 4"

[OldLefty]

Bought the MP9 4" for the thinner width.
While shopping, it looked the the Holosun 507C was suggested because the K version was for smaller sub compacts.
But now that it is mounted, I am disappointed because the optic overhangs the sides of the slide.
Then I saw someone mention a third party plate can be used to mount a K?

 

[SoCalDep]

You mention going with the 4” M&P because it’s “thinner”, but it’s the same width as the full size M&P. It has a 1/4” shorter barrel/slide and slightly shorter grip.

As for the optic, there are adaptor plates (C&H Precision and I think Eleven71 make them… maybe others too) to use the “K” footprint if you’d prefer.

Some people buy guns for the looks of the gun so I get it not “looking” right, but I’d caution you to consider that if you are using the pistol for defense, consider that the “K” optics will have a smaller window. It would allow the use of the excellent EPS or EPS Carry enclosed emitter optics though. I’m very happy with those on carry guns.

 

[hardluk1]

As noted above the M&P 2.0 compact 4" is a 15 shot version of the full size with the same widths of the slide and frame just a 1/4" or 3/4" less barrel and a couple less rounds of ammo in the mag . Using a smaller K size Holosun gives you a smaller field of view over the C .

 

[Dave Lively]

I have a 4" M&P 2.0 Compact with a Holosun C and it looks fine to me. Do you have a Compact which takes 15 or 17 round magazines or the M&P 9mm Shield Plus? Unless you live in a state that restricts magazine capacity if your gun came with a magazine that holds less than 15 rounds its not a M&P Compact.

When I get back home later today I will post a picture unless someone beats me to it.

If you do have a Shield or Shield plus you should get the Holosun K to avoid having a sight that increases the width of your gun.

 

[Gman556]

What I'm trying to wrap my head around is why are we talking about field of view for a red dot optic?

You're not supposed to be looking through the optic like it's a scope and focusing your eyes on the target bringing the dot to the target.

Anyone who trains or teaches this is 1000% wrong. That's not how these sites are supposed to work.

That being said if you don't like the wider holosun overhanging then the k model's would be perfect for what you're looking for, and don't worry about FOV because it's a moot point.

 

[SoCalDep]

We’re not talking about field of view… or at least I’m not.

I’m talking about the amount of deviation from center in which the dot is still visible, which allows one to take a responsible shot (if appropriate) or quickly correct when the pistol is less perfectly presented to the target… since parallax is a minimal issue.

You are correct that one shouldn’t be looking at the dot or the optic itself. We are indeed looking through the optic… focus should be, however, on the target, which is much easier said than done - especially for those used to iron sights.

Ben Stoeger recently did a really good video on this… but I’ve stayed at a holiday inn and have a bit of experience with dots from an instructor perspective so we can certainly deep dive further.

 

[Bullet Bob]

"It would allow the use of the excellent EPS or EPS Carry enclosed emitter optics"

What do you like about the EPS enclosed over a "regular" Holosun? I've never seen/looked through the EPS models. Thanks in advance.

 

[Transamconvert]

I like that it's easier to keep the eps clean since you're not trying to wipe inside of it, and a piece of lint can't get down in it and scatter the dot.
I'm not replacing my 507s with them but if I get a new one it's an eps series.

 

[SoCalDep]

"It would allow the use of the excellent EPS or EPS Carry enclosed emitter optics"

What do you like about the EPS enclosed over a "regular" Holosun? I've never seen/looked through the EPS models. Thanks in advance.

For a concealed carry pistol, as has been mentioned in the previous post/response, I think the big advantage in the enclosed emitters is that they are easier to clean and keep clean and the dot can't be obscured or distorted due to debris on the emitter or the ocular side of the reflective window.

Until recently I'd been mostly concerned with advantages of enclosed emitters from a law enforcement duty perspective. In that case there are environmental factors such as rain, temperature shifts and humidity (condensational fogging of the optic windown and in extreme circumstances the emitter), and the potential for stuff (bbq sauce, blood, mud, etc.) to get on the optic where an enclosed emitter is easier to move on or deal with.

For concealed carry most of those issues are non-factors. Since the pistol is carried against the body the condensational fogging and temperature shift isn't a concern, and since concealed/covered, there's way less likelihood for rain or goo to get into the optic.

So... While I think enclosed emitters offer advantages to both CCW and law enforcement, I think the open emitters are still a great option for CCW, and a perfectly adequate option for LE.

 

[Dave Lively]

But now that it is mounted, I am disappointed because the optic overhangs the sides of the slide.?

I earlier stated mine does not hang over the side. I stand corrected. It does stick out due to the slide's bevel even though it is not actually wider than the slide. It has never bothered me though.

BTW, the red blob is a 32 MOA ring around a 2 MOA dot that my phone did not focus on. It is sharp and clear in real life.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

To my ancient eyes a larger window (field of view?) makes for easier target acquisition... A quarter size being easier than a dime. Making the pistol a quarter inch wider requires a caliper for me to notice.

Cheers!

P.S. A closed emitter, although USUALLY a larger entity on the top of the slide, is basically immune to environmental influences. I don't feel the need to drop-test my red dots (or that to which they are attached) onto steel plates, immerse them in mud, etc. I let others do (and record) that (for me and for posterity?)...

From what I have seen MOST closed emitters are incredibly tough and should really take a lickin' and keep on tickin': certainly enough for my purposes. My initial foray is a Viridian: I will give it a run and report in the future.

 

[Gman556]

We’re not talking about field of view… or at least I’m not.

I’m talking about the amount of deviation from center in which the dot is still visible, which allows one to take a responsible shot (if appropriate) or quickly correct when the pistol is less perfectly presented to the target… since parallax is a minimal issue.

You are correct that one shouldn’t be looking at the dot or the optic itself. We are indeed looking through the optic… focus should be, however, on the target, which is much easier said than done - especially for those used to iron sights.

Ben Stoeger recently did a really good video on this… but I’ve stayed at a holiday inn and have a bit of experience with dots from an instructor perspective so we can certainly deep dive further.

I agree that those used to irons are going to have a hard time picking up the dot at first and a larger window may help, but that also means that their presentation was never that good with irons either.

This is where the dot shines. It's shows you of some of those bad habits that are ingrained in you that you need to train away. Ask me how I know this?

A really great option are those holosuns with the Primary Arms ACSS reticles in them.

I grabbed one when they first came out and it helped me immensely get my **** squared away with pistol rds. Cool thing is is you can just turn off that outer circle when you're not really needing it any more. I still turn mine on sometimes when I know I may be shooting from awkward positions like behind or around barriers Etc.

Yes those Ben Stoeger videos are a great wealth of info.

He is definitely one of my top 3 favorites, but the beautiful thing now days is there are a lot of instructors out there and you can take the knowledge from each one of them and apply them to improve your shooting skills.

What I love about Ben is that he tells it like it is and he doesn't sugarcoat anything, and will tell someone if there being an idiot.

IMHO A good instructor That gets my respect are the guys who honestly disclose that they are not the end all be all on everything, and are still learning themselves. IMHO I believe you should always be a student of your craft no matter how good you think you may be at it.

 

[metroplex]

407C/507C is the larger RMR footprint
407K/507K is the smaller modified RMSc footprint (intended for carry guns)


The 407K is 6 MOA, 507K is 2 MOA dot with a selectable circle/dot.
407C is 2 MOA, 507C is dot or circle/dot.


EPS Carry is another option, its the same 407K/507K footprint with a 2 MOA dot or circle dot, but it is a sealed emitter.

Personally I don't care for the circle dot.

 

[OldLefty]

thinner ... < than other 4" guns ( TP9, M18, Walther) ...
Where that photo shows the overhang; when I reach over to rack the slide, I keep grasping the optic.

Bought the 507C-GR-x2 w/Chevron! But now I am shopping for the 407K-GR-x2 for the 6 MOA green dot. That was suggested for my Astigmatism!

Found three different plate mfg: DPP, C+H, Calc Kinetics.

 

[Dave Lively]

Bought the 507C-GR-x2 w/Chevron! But now I am shopping for the 407K-GR-x2 for the 6 MOA green dot. That was suggested for my Astigmatism!

That is true in general but not always. With my astigmatism green is worse than red. Its worth trying but if you have a chance to buy locally and look through the green optic before buying, do so.

 

[metroplex]

thinner ... < than other 4" guns ( TP9, M18, Walther) ...
Where that photo shows the overhang; when I reach over to rack the slide, I keep grasping the optic.

Bought the 507C-GR-x2 w/Chevron! But now I am shopping for the 407K-GR-x2 for the 6 MOA green dot. That was suggested for my Astigmatism!

Found three different plate mfg: DPP, C+H, Calc Kinetics.

I have the DPP plates for the M&P 2.0 for 407/507C/RMR and the 407k/507k/EPS Carry. I'd say the DPP plate for the 407k footprint is a much tighter fit, I could barely remove it - it also fits the slide so flush and well.

 

[sstark036]

I have both c and k models,assumed c was for compact,but the k model is the smaller of the two


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[hardluk1]

OldLefty The width of the C model optic is not an issue for the majority of users or with other large dot optics designed for full size handguns .

If you had looked at the optic's spec on Holosun's site you would have noticed the C optic is 1.24" wide !!

 

[RE0]

I have a Holosun 507 c gr x 2 on my SW 10mm 4 inch. I went with green dot instead of red one. I pick up.and focus more on the green.

 

[OldLefty]

Still shopping. So far, no one has the 407K 6 moa green dot on display.

I did find a 507k that they let me check the fit.
Interesting, it still overhangs the slide but much better fit.

Surprised that the C model does not bother others. Wonder if being left handed is the issue.