Holsters Makers: Hermann H. Heiser Archive

[boykinlp]

Heiser Model 459 Holster

This is my last Heiser holster that hasn't been shown in this thread. I had to wait a while to get it. It is a Heiser Model 459 holster. It is a plain smooth finish with no tooling Heiser, and only my second one. This holster has the oval Heiser maker's mark with the model number "459" stamped below it, and the number "9" above it. I don't know what the stamped number 9 stands for. I think this model is known as Heiser's FBI Style holster when it has a hammer protector. I'm not sure it holds true without it, like this one. It is also ink marked "DS2" by the factory that means it was made to fit a Colt Detective Special revolver with a 2" barrel. What makes this holster odd, is it was special ordered with a nickel silver 1 1/2 inch "Frank-Loc belt clip" on it, to put the holster on your belt, and a safety strap with brown enamel snap. It makes putting the holster on a belt, and taking it off a belt, very quick and easy. It also makes for a very secure fit. Heiser first advertised a Franz-Loc belt clip in the number 40 catalog. IIRC, the FBI wanted their holsters to have a forward cant of I believe 30 degrees. If in actuality this Heiser 459 holster is a FBI style holster, the Franz-Loc clip doesn't allow for that forward carry angle the way it is installed.
Larry

 

[turnerriver]

I believe, without any evidence, that the single digit numbers were makers' numbers-maker number 9 made this holster. I've never found a better explanation or even a poor one-so my guess is as good as any, right ? Now let me hear what you all think.
Here's something else to think about. I've posted these through the years asking what they were made for, it's been awhile so let's try again. There is no space for a butt to protrude, there are 2 marks in one holster that look like something to be grasped between 2 fingers, the last photo shows a comparison with a Lawrence Broomhandle Mauser holster.

Regards,

 

[rednichols]

I believe, without any evidence, that the single digit numbers were makers' numbers-maker number 9 made this holster. I've never found a better explanation or even a poor one-so my guess is as good as any, right ? Now let me hear what you all think.
Here's something else to think about. I've posted these through the years asking what they were made for, it's been awhile so let's try again. There is no space for a butt to protrude, there are 2 marks in one holster that look like something to be grasped between 2 fingers, the last photo shows a comparison with a Lawrence Broomhandle Mauser holster.

Regards,

I've told you a decade ago what I think they're for but you've not ever done the homework to check me. I don't have the resources to do it myself but you likely do . I have a primo track record on my deductions notably identifying the NYC shooting pistol type.

I also see the backside of these pouches for the first time, and see that the belt loops were changed in the factory and before the main seam was sewn, from being for a narrow belt to being for a wide 'field' belt. A main seam is VERY difficult to restitch on the needle & awl harness machines used by Heiser (but dead easy on the modern 'needle-only' machines of the Adler type) because the old machines want to make new holes while the modern machines insist on following the old holes.

 

[boykinlp]

I believe, without any evidence, that the single digit numbers were makers' numbers-maker number 9 made this holster. I've never found a better explanation or even a poor one-so my guess is as good as any, right ? Now let me hear what you all think.
Here's something else to think about. I've posted these through the years asking what they were made for, it's been awhile so let's try again. There is no space for a butt to protrude, there are 2 marks in one holster that look like something to be grasped between 2 fingers, the last photo shows a comparison with a Lawrence Broomhandle Mauser holster.

Regards,

I find it very strange that the only thing to really identify John's 2 items as being made by Heiser is the black enamel Heiser snap. I wonder why there isn't a normal Heiser maker's mark or numbering that we usually see?
Larry

 

[rednichols]

I find it very strange that the only thing to really identify John's 2 items as being made by Heiser is the black enamel Heiser snap. I wonder why there isn't a normal Heiser maker's mark or numbering that we usually see?
Larry

Maybe it's under the relocated belt loops. Ask him .

 

[boykinlp]

Maybe it's under the relocated belt loops. Ask him .

I feel sure that he would've checked all over them, but we'll see.
Larry

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

I believe, without any evidence, that the single digit numbers were makers' numbers-maker number 9 made this holster. I've never found a better explanation or even a poor one-so my guess is as good as any, right ? Now let me hear what you all think.
Here's something else to think about. I've posted these through the years asking what they were made for, it's been awhile so let's try again. There is no space for a butt to protrude, there are 2 marks in one holster that look like something to be grasped between 2 fingers, the last photo shows a comparison with a Lawrence Broomhandle Mauser holster.

Regards,

Comparing these Heiser holsters for Mauser C96 or similar, absolutely confirms that the two you posted who knows what they were supposed to contain?
Furthermore they are thin and do not seem able to contain a pistol, perhaps a very flat stock, similar to that of the Luger Artillery, but they are too small and short for this use...
In the last two photos together with the Heiser holster there is an Excelsior holster very similar in shape but not in size to your two, this holster has the cut to let the broom handle out which is not present in yours

 

[rednichols]

Comparing these Heiser holsters for Mauser C96 or similar, absolutely confirms that the two you posted who knows what they were supposed to contain?
Furthermore they are thin and do not seem able to contain a pistol, perhaps a very flat stock, similar to that of the Luger Artillery, but they are too small and short for this use...
In the last two photos together with the Heiser holster there is an Excelsior holster very similar in shape but not in size to your two, this holster has the cut to let the broom handle out which is not present in yours

You've hit the nail on the head! For the 1896 Mauser but too small for the entire pistol . . .. What's left for them to fit, then?

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

Heiser knife sheaths

I came across these photos yesterday, and here I ask to Red the permission to use them, of this GORGEOUS Heiser knife sheath, I have to say it is one of the most desirable items I have seen, if I could I would buy it immediately.
Aside from the Randall collaboration, Heiser has produced several knife sheaths, if you own any, please post some photos.

 

[turnerriver]

I found the carved sheath at the Tulsa gun show years ago, my good friend ordnanceguy gave me the knife to fit it.
The plain sheath belonged to a Heiser sales rep, it wasn't ever cataloged that I can find.

Regards,

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

other Heiser sheaths

 

[boykinlp]

other Heiser sheaths

Like many of the other Heiser items in this thread, the basketweave stamped ones must be the most rare, it seems. The pictured basketweave one above is beautiful, as are the floral carved ones. In all my years of collecting leather items, I've NEVER even seen a Heiser knife sheath for sale anywhere, even though the major online sites. I've seen pictures of John's gem's before and they are very, very nice!
Larry

 

[turnerriver]

I've told you a decade ago what I think they're for but you've not ever done the homework to check me. I don't have the resources to do it myself but you likely do . I have a primo track record on my deductions notably identifying the NYC shooting pistol type.

I also see the backside of these pouches for the first time, and see that the belt loops were changed in the factory and before the main seam was sewn, from being for a narrow belt to being for a wide 'field' belt. A main seam is VERY difficult to restitch on the needle & awl harness machines used by Heiser (but dead easy on the modern 'needle-only' machines of the Adler type) because the old machines want to make new holes while the modern machines insist on following the old holes.

I did the homework then and probably neglected to post it or I likely equivocated, one of my many failings. I have 2 Broomhandle Mausers brought back by grandfathers and fathers many decades ago. The body of the holsters are too small and narrow for them to fit the Broomhandle receiver and the visible marks don't match up to the Broomhandle. The rails on either side of the receiver would leave a visible mark, there aren't any signs of them. There are no visible marks inside from front or rear sights of any kind. No Heiser logos under the resewn belt loops. I keep hoping for a definitive answer but don't have one that matches all the evidence yet.
Regards,

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

More sheaths

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

I did the homework then and probably neglected to post it or I likely equivocated, one of my many failings. I have 2 Broomhandle Mausers brought back by grandfathers and fathers many decades ago. The body of the holsters are too small and narrow for them to fit the Broomhandle receiver and the visible marks don't match up to the Broomhandle. The rails on either side of the receiver would leave a visible mark, there aren't any signs of them. There are no visible marks inside from front or rear sights of any kind. No Heiser logos under the resewn belt loops. I keep hoping for a definitive answer but don't have one that matches all the evidence yet.
Regards,

In fact it is clear that these are sheaths for some tool,
Not necessarily dedicated to handguns, maybe something used in the management of livestock/horses or some technical tool.
As it is clear that the extraction of this unknown tool from this sheath must be done with two fingers given its shape and not with the classic extraction of a weapon where it is necessary to firmly grasp the butt of the gun.
In the photos you can see:
RIDGID plumber's wrench
Part of the Mauser C96 stripped
where it is clear that the receiver is excluded in this discussion.
An "IDEAL" metal stock for Luger and a similar holster/stock "classified as TOY"
Even though I do not have years of experience in the matter, I am inclined to a holster/sheath for tools...

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

Like many of the other Heiser items in this thread, the basketweave stamped ones must be the most rare, it seems. The pictured basketweave one above is beautiful, as are the floral carved ones. In all my years of collecting leather items, I've NEVER even seen a Heiser knife sheath for sale anywhere, even though the major online sites. I've seen pictures of John's gem's before and they are very, very nice!
Larry

Ciao Larry
Yes, I have a real obsession with basketweave but look at this pair of hand carved flowers and tell me that isn't a AWESOME combination?

 

[boykinlp]

Larry
is true, I have a real fixation for basketweave but look at this pair of floral hand carved and tell me if it isn't a FANTASTIC combination

Definitely a fantastic combination Marcello! I've seen a holster like in your picture before, but never a knife sheath. I wonder how many years Heiser made knife sheaths and how many they actually sold? I suspect most people who buy a fixed blade knife get a pretty nice sheath with it, and make do with it, therefore don't buy a "fancy" Heiser sheath for it just for the looks. OMG, isn't that the most hypocritical statement ever written, especially by a guy like me who doesn't follow that nonsense with leather holsters, at all?!
Larry

 

[rednichols]

I did the homework then and probably neglected to post it or I likely equivocated, one of my many failings. I have 2 Broomhandle Mausers brought back by grandfathers and fathers many decades ago. The body of the holsters are too small and narrow for them to fit the Broomhandle receiver and the visible marks don't match up to the Broomhandle. The rails on either side of the receiver would leave a visible mark, there aren't any signs of them. There are no visible marks inside from front or rear sights of any kind. No Heiser logos under the resewn belt loops. I keep hoping for a definitive answer but don't have one that matches all the evidence yet.
Regards,

Meaning my thinking that they were for the fully automatic receiver of the Mauser, while the semiautomatic receiver was on the pistol itself (and vice versa) was wrong. Thanks for checking this. I no longer have the images of the actions themselves, from which I created my theory. It has been years, after all, and I don't keep everything.

 

[rednichols]

I believe, without any evidence, that the single digit numbers were makers' numbers-maker number 9 made this holster. I've never found a better explanation or even a poor one-so my guess is as good as any, right ? Now let me hear what you all think.

Regards,

As to the numbers, I operate on the belief that these are from this chart of Heiser's after Keyston Bros bought them. KB made many other efforts to minimise their stocking units, including their Sportsman line of the same era.

For that reason I segregate my Heiser holster images as (1) with the ornate snap button, as 1905 to 1940 (2) with plain but lettered snap button as 1940 onwards (3) same, but with that little number as 1950 onwards. KB ceased to be a gunleather maker by 1968.

I'm posting too much, a side effect of knowing too much about holstory.

 

[ENNE-FRAME]

Scope sheaths

Maybe I'm taking back all my fanciful theories about what these mysterious sheaths carried published by John "turnerriver"
Even if unmarked and with signs of "second thoughts" such as the moved seams, by the maker, which perhaps indicate that they were prototype studies.
The shape matches almost perfectly with a rifle scope with mount, one chosen at random from the web.

I would really like to hear an authoritative opinion from John, Lee and other gunleather experts who frequent this forum.