How Do I Carry Without A Round Chambered?

[HCA]

I've been strictly a wheel gun guy until this week (686+), but I've purchased a full size M&P40. This is my first semi-auto, and I have a very basic question. I've seen discussions about whether or not to carry with a round chambered. In order to get a better feel for my new weapon, I wanted to carry without chambering a round, at least for a few days. My question is, how can I do that?

I loaded one magazine with the full 15 round capacity, but cannot insert it into the gun with the slide closed. I had thought that I would be able to insert the magazine and THEN rack a round, but that doesn't seem possible. Everything works fine if the slide is locked back and then the magazine is inserted, but of course, that chambers a round. Is there a way to insert a full magazine without chambering a round in this gun?

Sorry if this seems like a stupid question, but as I said, up to now, I have been strictly a wheel gun guy. Just trying to move into the 21st century...

 

[kbm6893]

Give it a good whack on the baseplate. It will swat. Or just load 14 rounds and it will go in easy. If you're nervous about carrying a semi with the round chambered you should probably not have gotten a semi especially a striker fired gun with no hammer. The gun has a manual safety model. Did you get that one?

 

[UncaGrunny]

Try loading the mag one round short, and see if it will then seat properly with the slide already closed.

My understanding from reading here is that, especially with new mags fully packed, the mag springs can be too tight to let the mag seat without the chamber open. Same reason loading that last round takes so much more effort.

Others can probably tell you more, but that's what I'd try in your situation.

 

[bp231986]

don't worry about "hurting" your gun and insert that mag in with a little bit of force. You could also try going with one less round to reduce the tension. Just insert your mag and give it a good slap with your palm of your hand, you wont hurt anything.

 

[mag318]

There are no stupid questions so not to worry. A fully loaded magazine should seat though it may require some force to do so. Or you can just load it one round shy of capacity and it will be easier to seat. These mag springs are tight when new. The M&Ps were designed to be carried with a chambered round are are basically just as safe as a double action revolver. The only way to have an AD or ND is to pull the trigger.

 

[HCA]

Give it a good whack on the baseplate. It will swat. Or just load 14 rounds and it will go in easy. If you're nervous about carrying a semi with the round chambered you should probably not have gotten a semi especially a striker fired gun with no hammer. The gun has a manual safety model. Did you get that one?

I just figured that out. After I posted this, I tried it with 14 rounds, and it goes right in. I'm not particularly nervous about carrying with a round chambered, but I wanted to spend an hour or two at the range with it and get a little used to it before I do. I won't be going to the range until later this week. And no, no manual safety.

 

[HCA]

Try loading the mag one round short, and see if it will then seat properly with the slide already closed.

My understanding from reading here is that, especially with new mags fully packed, the mag springs can be too tight to let the mag seat without the chamber open. Same reason loading that last round takes so much more effort.

Others can probably tell you more, but that's what I'd try in your situation.

Yep, the mag springs probably could have been used in a mattress! After fighting with those mags, I decided to try a LULA loader. We'll have to see how that works when it gets here later in the week.

 

[Deadeye Dick]

Modern semi-autos have various and sundry safety devices which block the striker from hitting the firing pin unless the trigger is engaged coupled with a long usually relatively stiff trigger pull.

What makes a revolver with a round in the chamber under the hammer inherently safer? Is it the various and sundry hammer blocking devices and a long relatively heavy trigger pull present in most modern production revolvers? Wait...what?

If you're more comfortable with an empty chamber that's your parogative. Just be aware of the handy cap this may create should you ever need to get your weapon into play quickly. Practice presenting the weapon from this condition often so that clambering a round becomes second nature. Practice the many possible scenarios that may come up. Can you rack the slide one handed, how about with your weak hand? You didn't have to think about all this with your wheelgun with a full cylinder.

I'm at a loss as to why experienced wheelgunners have no problem with a fully loaded cylinder in a revolver but have reservations about a chambered round in a modern semi-automatic?

 

[forrestinmathews]

Good stuff. You'll get comfortable with it. I carried my M&P with an empty chamber for a little bit until I had assured myself that the super light trigger wasn't going to get fouled up with the holster or clothes. It'll be fine. I'm a revolver guy also.

 

[HCA]

I never could figure out why an old wheelgun guy would be uncomfortable with a chambered round in a semi-auto.

Modern semi-autos have various and sundry safety devices which block the striker from hitting the firing pin unless the trigger is engaged coupled with a long usually relatively stiff trigger pull.

What makes a revolver with a round in the chamber under the hammer inherently safer? Is it the various and sundry hammer blocking devices and a long relatively heavy trigger pull present in most modern production revolvers? Wait...what?

No, I understand about the long trigger engagement, etc. I just wanted to actually handle the weapon at the range and get used to it before I start carrying with a round chambered. A friend of mine who is a competition shooter went through the blocks, etc with me, so it isn't a fear of having a chambered round, it;s just my personal desire to become a little more familiar with this gun first.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

Of course, you might consider carrying a revolver until you get a little more familiar with that deadly weapon you're planning to carry.

 

[Deadeye Dick]

No, I understand about the long trigger engagement, etc. I just wanted to actually handle the weapon at the range and get used to it before I start carrying with a round chambered. A friend of mine who is a competition shooter went through the blocks, etc with me, so it isn't a fear of having a chambered round, it;s just my personal desire to become a little more familiar with this gun first.

That's cool. And certainly a good idea to fully familiarize yourself with your weapon.

Hope my previous post didn't come off sounding like a personal attack. It was not meant as such. I've been shooting handguns of both ilks for nearly 4 decades so my thought pattern on revolver vs loaded semi-auto is somewhat jaded by years of personal experience.

 

[HCA]

Of course, you might consider carrying a revolver until you get a little more familiar with that deadly weapon you're planning to carry.

I've been carrying a S&W 686+, .357 magnum, for almost 5 years, and still do. I'm just transitioning to the M&P40. I'll be spending a few hours on the range this coming week, and things will be fine...

 

[HCA]

That's cool. And certainly a good idea to fully familiarize yourself with your weapon.

Hope my previous post didn't come off sounding like a personal attack. It was not meant as such. I've been shooting handguns of both ilks for nearly 4 decades so my thought pattern on revolver vs loaded semi-auto is somewhat jaded by years of personal experience.

Nope, not at all. I just like to be real familiar with any weapon before I start carrying it. Did the same with my 686. Didn't really get into the carry mode until I had spent some time at the range with it. The primary reason for carrying the M&P right now was just to get used to carrying it, determining how it feels, does it impede any normal body movements, etc, and I wanted a full mag since it affects the weight (although after carrying that 686+, weight probably won't be an issue). I didn't take your response as an attack at all.

 

[Comrad]

Seems to me a pistol in condition 1 could be negligently discharged a lot easier than a revolver. For me the equivalent condition in a revolver would be to have the hammer cocked and I am sure nobody thinks that's a good idea. IMHO, we don't carry in NJ so I may be full of beans here but that's how I see it.

 

[HCA]

Seems to me a pistol in condition 1 could be negligently discharged a lot easier than a revolver. For me the equivalent condition in a revolver would be to have the hammer cocked and I am sure nobody thinks that's a good idea. IMHO, we don't carry in NJ so I may be full of beans here but that's how I see it.

Well, the trigger on my 686 takes much less pressure when it is fired single action, and certainly less than my M&P, so I'm not sure that is a good comparison. Sorry for you guys up there in NJ. I lived there for 3 years back in the 70s (McGuire Air Force Base), but I see the gun situation has gotten far worse. I'll never travel to or through a state that has such restrictive gun laws.

 

[kbm6893]

Modern semi-autos have various and sundry safety devices which block the striker from hitting the firing pin unless the trigger is engaged coupled with a long usually relatively stiff trigger pull.

What makes a revolver with a round in the chamber under the hammer inherently safer? Is it the various and sundry hammer blocking devices and a long relatively heavy trigger pull present in most modern production revolvers? Wait...what?

If you're more comfortable with an empty chamber that's your parogative. Just be aware of the handy cap this may create should you ever need to get your weapon into play quickly. Practice presenting the weapon from this condition often so that clambering a round becomes second nature. Practice the many possible scenarios that may come up. Can you rack the slide one handed, how about with your weak hand? You didn't have to think about all this with your wheelgun with a full cylinder.

I'm at a loss as to why experienced wheelgunners have no problem with a fully loaded cylinder in a revolver but have reservations about a chambered round in a modern semi-automatic?

Comparing a DA revolver to a striker fired semi auto is a total crock. What's the double action pull on a revolver, about 8-9 pounds? What's the trigger pull on an M&P, about 6 pounds? Glocks ship with a 5.5 pound trigger. No to mention the hammer on a revolver has to come back and then down again before firing, where the striker is invisible on a semi and cannot be prevented from firing with a thumb on the back of the slide like you can with a hammer. Striker fired guns MUST be carried holstered with trigger covered. PLENTY of revolver holsters (many worn by cops) had the trigger exposed. Anybody here ever consider carrying an M&P with the trigger exposed?

If you wanna compare revolver to semi auto, how about a cocked and holstered 1911 to an M&P? A lot closer.

 

[Doug M.]

Do not carry that pistol until you are comfortable carrying it with the round chambered. Period. Stick with the revolver with which you are familiar and comfortable.

From a purely mechanical perspective, one of the safest handguns to carry ready to use (round chambered, cocked, safety engaged) is a 1911. You have the mechanical safety, the grip safety, and the one between your ears that helps you keep the booger hook off the loud switch. One has to be really really dumb and really really clumsy (more than I am, which is a feat) to have an ND with a 1911. I carried one as a duty weapon off and on for several years and it is a very user friendly weapon and quite safe if one is properly trained.

It is not all that hard to have an ND with a revolver, if one is careless. It might be a little harder to do than with a pistol, but the level of negligence required either way is indicative of needing a guardianship far more than a pistol, a car, or a real knife. If you have gone 5 years without being that careless with a revolver, you should easily transition to the pistol without any real risk as long as get a little help with the transition in terms of psychomotor skill training.

 

[HCA]

a
It is not all that hard to have an ND with a revolver, if one is careless. It might be a little harder to do than with a pistol, but the level of negligence required either way is indicative of needing a guardianship far more than a pistol, a car, or a real knife. If you have gone 5 years without being that careless with a revolver, you should easily transition to the pistol without any real risk as long as get a little help with the transition in terms of psychomotor skill training.

I think the main difference in my mind between my revolver and my M&P is clearing the weapon. With the revolver, you just swing open the cylinder and dump all 7 rounds. With the M&P you have to remember that in addition to ejecting the magazine, you need to rack it back and clear that chambered round as well. It's that attention to the little details that makes all the difference...

 

[shawn mccarver]

Load one round down, i.e. 14 rounds in a 15 round magazine. That will allow enough room between the top round, which is under a great deal of spring pressure, and the pick up rail, to allow the mag to lock in and to rack the slide.