Humpback hammer

[ABPOS]

This has been a very informative thread. I have not seen a lot of them even lurking on here for a while now. I see that they were custom order only which makes sense as to why we don't see them all the time. Although it must've been sort of a niche thing.

I like the shot of the one on the top and you can see how flat it is. Wow. Thanks Hondo44!

 

[SAFireman]

Here is a late NRM with HBH for your viewing pleasure

This one is from 1940, probably one of the last produced before the war production ramped up fully.

 

[DWalt]

As stated, the idea was having a hammer design more easily cocked for single-action shooting. As that is a feature best suited for Bullseye target shooting (rapid and timed fire stages), an HBH is found mainly as a special order on adjustable rear sight revolvers. Not so great, and not to any advantage, for use on fixed-sight revolvers as they sort of block the rear sight when the hammer is down, making aimed DA firing difficult. There was a thread here some time ago about some M&Ps equipped with HBHs which were ordered by an Ohio police department back in the late 1930s. It would be interesting to know why any LE agency would want HBHs on its DA revolvers - and possibly that Ohio PD was the only one that ever did.

 

[bruce5781]

As stated, the idea was having a hammer design more easily cocked for single-action shooting. As that is a feature best suited for Bullseye target shooting (rapid and timed fire stages), an HBH is found mainly as a special order on adjustable rear sight revolvers. Not so great, and not to any advantage, for use on fixed-sight revolvers as they sort of block the rear sight when the hammer is down, making aimed DA firing difficult. There was a thread here some time ago about some M&Ps equipped with HBHs which were ordered by an Ohio police department back in the late 1930s. It would be interesting to know why any LE agency would want HBHs on its DA revolvers - and possibly that Ohio PD was the only one that ever did.

One of my 4" M&P's came out of Roy's collection. It was from the Boston P.D.

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[Hondo44]

As stated, the idea was having a hammer design more easily cocked for single-action shooting. As that is a feature best suited for Bullseye target shooting (rapid and timed fire stages), an HBH is found mainly as a special order on adjustable rear sight revolvers. Not so great, and not to any advantage, for use on fixed-sight revolvers as they sort of block the rear sight when the hammer is down, making aimed DA firing difficult. There was a thread here some time ago about some M&Ps equipped with HBHs which were ordered by an Ohio police department back in the late 1930s. It would be interesting to know why any LE agency would want HBHs on its DA revolvers - and possibly that Ohio PD was the only one that ever did.

No doubt the annual mandatory shooting qualifications included single action shooting. Those pre war finely checkered hammers are notoriously hard to grasp for cocking. Add sweaty thumbs and worn checkering in the mix and it's a big issue.

 

[rjb1]

It's many decades too late to do us any good, but I remember seeing in an old gun-parts catalog (Bannerman's?) individual hump-back hammers for sale as separate parts. Seems like the price was $10 or so, which isn't much, but worth more in ~1940 dollars.

Where is a time machine when you need one?

 

[DWalt]

In 1940 dollars, the $10 would translate into around $180 today. And very few in 1940 had $10 to spend on something like a HBH.

 

[SLOWBOB]

Jim S&WCA#819 You seem to be one of the most knowledgable S&W guys out there, thanks. I shot a lot of PPC while working for the Texas Dept of Corrections in the 70's, and your comment about sweaty thumbs is right on the money, a lot of guys shot dbl action only and Pythons were popular for awhile. The Lieutenant who ran the Ellis Unit range was a trigger job artist and had a 6" Highway Patrolman that was as smooth & light as a Reeves Jungkind Python that I owned for awhile. Are you Supica?

 

[Hondo44]

Jim S&WCA#819 You seem to be one of the most knowledgable S&W guys out there, thanks. I shot a lot of PPC while working for the Texas Dept of Corrections in the 70's, and your comment about sweaty thumbs is right on the money, a lot of guys shot dbl action only and Pythons were popular for awhile. The Lieutenant who ran the Ellis Unit range was a trigger job artist and had a 6" Highway Patrolman that was as smooth & light as a Reeves Jungkind Python that I owned for awhile. Are you Supica?

Thank you Bob, but I assure you many on here are more knowledgeable than me. It's just that as old as I am, and collecting/shooting/repairing Smiths as I have, one can't help but learn something. I'm not Jim Supica but do have a couple of articles in his SCSW 4th Ed. Thx again for your kind words.

 

[RKmesa]

Just a few more HBH photos...

K-22 Outsoorsman:



38/44 Outdoorsman:







Pre-war .357 Magnum (non REG):





I think that these are the only three guns that I have with HBHs.

 

[Hondo44]

Congrats, simply stunning!

 

[bwdilli]

As stated, the idea was having a hammer design more easily cocked for single-action shooting. As that is a feature best suited for Bullseye target shooting (rapid and timed fire stages), an HBH is found mainly as a special order on adjustable rear sight revolvers. Not so great, and not to any advantage, for use on fixed-sight revolvers as they sort of block the rear sight when the hammer is down, making aimed DA firing difficult. There was a thread here some time ago about some M&Ps equipped with HBHs which were ordered by an Ohio police department back in the late 1930s. It would be interesting to know why any LE agency would want HBHs on its DA revolvers - and possibly that Ohio PD was the only one that ever did.

Don't know if you were referencing the one I own from Shaker Heights PD, but it falls within the description you gave. I agree it would be interesting to know why it was ordered as such. Trying to locate more information has lead to dead ends. Might try the S&W Historical Foundation again as I have heard they now have more of the information available.

One thing that really stands out is the round butt. I haven't seen any other with that feature. Not saying it's unique, just uncommon.

The wood stocks didn't letter to the gun. But they are not serial number marked and have few use marks that make me believe they have been with the gun for a very long time.

 

[Bullet Bob]

Thread drift.

I was playing with - I mean doing maintenance on my 60-15 model 60 last night, and I noticed that the hammer has a humpback feel, and even a little bit of the look.

Maybe it's just me.

 

[Hondo44]

Good observation Bob,

That's true, the new J frame MIM hammer spur introduced in the 1997 - 98 period with frame mounted firing pin, does indeed closely resemble a downsized HBH!

 

[delta-419]

38/44 With Humpback Hammer

I have a late 1939-early 1940 38/44HD with a none grooved HBH, its the only one I have with this type hammer. The front sight was modified with a pined blade. Here are a couple of photos of the hammer.

 

[crsides]

I believe the HBH with the radial grooves on the side were used just for the Reg mags. Those used on the OD would have not been grooved.

Also the KCPD Registered Magnums were shipped with HBH.

 

[410bore]

I move them - currently have 3.

NRM
K22 OD
Pre War M&P

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[paplinker]

I believe the HBH with the radial grooves on the side were used just for the Reg mags. Those used on the OD would have not been grooved.

Also the KCPD Registered Magnums were shipped with HBH.

I know of two 38/44 ODs that have grooved HBH hammers. They letter as having a HBH but no mention of what kind.

I suppose its possible that a customer could have requested a grooved one. Or its possible its all that was in stock that week.

 

[crsides]

I know of two 38/44 ODs that have grooved HBH hammers. They letter as having a HBH but no mention of what kind.

I suppose its possible that a customer could have requested a grooved one. Or its possible its all that was in stock that week.

I found this thread, post #11, which stated that other models were equipped with HBH without concentric grooves, but thats all I have. And this is not backed up as to source.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...07-humpback-hammer.html?580107=#post140303816

 

[paplinker]

I found this thread, post #11, which stated that other models were equipped with HBH without concentric grooves, but thats all I have. And this is not backed up as to source.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...07-humpback-hammer.html?580107=#post140303816

I am sure that was the norm. I could only speculated how some ODs ended up with grooved HBHs

I do recall reading an old thread where it was mentioned that on occasion S&W did ship out some HBH ODs in 22 that were not ordered io have them. Maybe they just wanted to get some in stores? When they did there was not a extra charge for them. I will try looking for that thread.