I see S&W copied ...
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HPHooked
Member
Bodyguard = updated Chief's special. If anything, Ruger infringed on S&W's patents.
Just my $.02. YOMV.
Just my $.02. YOMV.
Texas Star
US Veteran
Basically, yes, with improvements. But the Bodyguard goes back to 1955.
NFrameFred
Member
Hate to break it to you, but there's been very little in the way of "original design" that didn't build on someone else's accomplishments since John Moses Browning.
The word "Glock" comes to mind ( and even a lot of that was established design/technology), but in revolvers or autos most of the offerings today still operate from parts and concepts developed long ago . . . .
You have to pretty much rip off verbatim an original concept to get successfully sued.
The word "Glock" comes to mind ( and even a lot of that was established design/technology), but in revolvers or autos most of the offerings today still operate from parts and concepts developed long ago . . . .
You have to pretty much rip off verbatim an original concept to get successfully sued.
Pisgah
Member
NFrameFred is right on. Patents are good for, I think, 17 years and one 17-year renewal. I doubt there is one element of any of the guns mentioned that is covered by an in-force patent. If there's anything truly new under the sun in the gun-design world, it ain't much.
Grog
Member
Sigma anyone? 
The Ruger LCR is now coming out in 357 mag. Being introduced at the NRA Annual Meeting. I shot one last week, and it has brutal recoil. Even with the very nice absorbing grips. It's just too light to make shooting anything very powerful a pleasant experience.
Not to be a know-it-all, but I do know a little about intellectual property, including patents, and the above comments are generally on track, there is precious little in these revolvers that would be subject to patent protection, other than minor refinements that compertitors could most likely design around. Patentability requires inventiveness over all "prior art" (ie, everything that has ever been done--that's a lot.)
However, apart from "utility" patents (which relate to the structure and function of inventions), there are also "design" patents, relating to the "ornamental" aspect of an article of manufacture. Not surprisingly, Ruger does have at least one design patent on the LCR, see link below to the U.S. Patent Office. (almost forgot, you need a TIFF reader to see it.) Design patents can be useful for preventing "Chinese copies" of articles (or "engineering with cameras", as I call it.)
Of course, our free enterprise system is set up to permit copying of products, so long as any patent coverage has expired, and the goods are not "palmed off" as those of another. This promotes competition and benefits us a consumers.
As we say in my business, "I work both sides of the street", on behalf originators and "emulators", so to speak. I believe in the system.
BTW, utility patents now have a 20-year term from filing, no longer 17 years from issue, which cannot be renewed; upon expiration the subject matter enters the public domain and is free for use by anybody. Design patents have a 14-year term.
Sorry for the dissertation, but I've been saving this since everybody was talking about Colt going after Sig for their P238.
Patent Images
However, apart from "utility" patents (which relate to the structure and function of inventions), there are also "design" patents, relating to the "ornamental" aspect of an article of manufacture. Not surprisingly, Ruger does have at least one design patent on the LCR, see link below to the U.S. Patent Office. (almost forgot, you need a TIFF reader to see it.) Design patents can be useful for preventing "Chinese copies" of articles (or "engineering with cameras", as I call it.)
Of course, our free enterprise system is set up to permit copying of products, so long as any patent coverage has expired, and the goods are not "palmed off" as those of another. This promotes competition and benefits us a consumers.
As we say in my business, "I work both sides of the street", on behalf originators and "emulators", so to speak. I believe in the system.
BTW, utility patents now have a 20-year term from filing, no longer 17 years from issue, which cannot be renewed; upon expiration the subject matter enters the public domain and is free for use by anybody. Design patents have a 14-year term.
Sorry for the dissertation, but I've been saving this since everybody was talking about Colt going after Sig for their P238.
Patent Images
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$2Ray
Member
Think I'll pass on that one....
Wee Hooker
Member
Exactly, I've owned a sweet mod 49 for 20+ years myself. if anything Ruger has been asleep at the wheel on this one. This Juror is still out on teh polymer frame idea too.
Sorry. This was a rhetorical question. Saying S&W copied the LCP is a statement I found funny. Ruger copied the P3AT first.
OP
zero10mm
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Well let's not forget that the LCR in .357 will have the ability to shoot .38spcl - so at the range you shoot .38spcl - and carry the man-stopper .357 mag when CCW -
I think you can hold back the tears when firing to save your but yes/no...?
I think you can hold back the tears when firing to save your but yes/no...?
Gary7
Member
The 357 LCR weighs 17 ounces. If shooting 357s in it is brutal, what must it be like to shoot the S&W 360PD which weighs 11.5 ounces?
My everyday carry gun is a 38 LCR. Shooting +P in it isn't bad at all. I've gone through a box of 50 at the range in less than 20 minutes with no ill effects on my hand.
OP
zero10mm
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what must it be like to shoot the S&W 360PD which weighs 11.5 ounces?
Yup - I wonder what the Boo Birds will say about that
New 2 the J
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to the OP, I think you have your stories switched... S&W has been making the "bodyguard" variant of their revolvers for a long time, as stated above, cerca 1955... Ruger recently started making their LCR.... How exactly do you mean that S&W is copying Ruger in design and appearance?
I agree with those that have stated that there is little to nothing worth attempting to claim as patent worthy in the design of revolvers now-a-days. But for the sake of accuracy, lets be honest... S&W's Bodyguard made first, Ruger's LCR made second... So no, S&W isnt copying Ruger!
I agree with those that have stated that there is little to nothing worth attempting to claim as patent worthy in the design of revolvers now-a-days. But for the sake of accuracy, lets be honest... S&W's Bodyguard made first, Ruger's LCR made second... So no, S&W isnt copying Ruger!
Combat_Diver
US Veteran
I also don't get how the OP states that Smith copied the Ruger LCR? Cylinder latch is ambi, internal laser, lighter, different frame, cylinder etc. Haven't seen the lock work but I'm sure Smith didn't copy Ruger.
CD
CD
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zero10mm
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Ruger first to manufacture a Poly revolver - S&W second, enough said, as far as patent infringement - whatever, who cares... just sayin'
I'm merely talking about the idea of a poly revolver it was Rugers idea and they made one FIRST period...!!!
I'm merely talking about the idea of a poly revolver it was Rugers idea and they made one FIRST period...!!!
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