In praise of the 4513TSW

[18DAI]

I own many handguns. Probably like many of you here, more than I need but less than I want.

I own many different makes as I'm not one of those brand loyalists. Those folks miss out on some fine handguns, IMO.

Anyways, I think the most utilitarian handgun I own may be my 4513TSW. It is simply......"perfect" on several levels.

I own and have owned several versions of the 4513. I currently own the PC Shorty 45 MKII, an early production 4513TSW with the cut out grip frame and as of tommorow, one of the 7 round 4513TSW's made without the stupid rail. No holes in the dustcover either. I've searched for one like this for several years. The fact that S&W never made more of these is one more stupid decision on their part.

The rail free 4513TSW is the perfect carry gun, for me. The idea of placing a rail on a compact conceal carry gun makes no sense, to me. Nightstand use? Why use a compact? I prefer an 870 for nightstand use.

The 4513 combines all the desireable features in a handgun. Good caliber - 45. Light weight and slim for easy carry and concealment. Great capacity - 7+1 - same capacity as the vaunted 1911. Unlike the 1911 every 4513 I own has been 100% in function - right out of the box.

Mine are tack drivers too. Teeny tiny groups out to 20 yards or so. My 4513's are more accurate than my 50 YOA eyes. The Shorty 45 MKII variant is phenomenally accurate with its Briley bushing and match grade barrel.

So if you don't own a 4513, find one and try it. I think you will agree that it is probably the finest compact carry 45 out there. I know I won't be letting any of mine get away. Regards 18DAI.

 

[Bartman3562]

Exactly

That is exactly how I feel about the 4013. In fact, the only improvement I could think of is if it was a 10mm. Thanks to BM1, I now have one of each
4013
1013
Sadly, I used the sale of my 4513TSW to fund the comversion. It is amazing how many "best" guns there are. Also amazing how many are S&W

 

[Fastbolt]

Hey 18DAI, glad to hear you finally found that elusive non-railed standard 4513TSW.

I still like my original 4513TSW, but then I have a sufficient number of the 6-rd mags for it and I've modified a pair of Hogue grips to fit it.

I rather liked my issued 4513TSW, although I also never cared for the accessory rail being bolted on (or even being there on a compact weapon in the first place, but that's just me). I tried to carry an new 4566TSW when working my plainclothes assignment, but the weight of the all-steel gun just became annoying after working a 12-18 hour day. I'd much rather carry a lighter weight, aluminum alloy framed compact gun for that role.

I've not seen a lot of problems with the bolt-on rail, but I have seen an occasional broken one or one which became a bit loose.

While I don't have any personal use for a rail on a compact model, if they're going to make them with rails, I'd wish they'd simply make them integral rails when the frames are machined (like they do with the 4566/4006TSW's). Not that hard with a CNC machine, right?

If they'd made the late production 3913TSW with an integral rail instead of that bolted-on rail, I'd probably have gotten more interested in picking one up to supplement my late production 3913.

 

[18DAI]

Thanks Fastbolt!

I'm the happy guy! Can't wait till it gets here. Hopefully before quals on Thursday.

I too still like my original 4513TSW. Big Dog cut some Hogues for me. Makes it feel as good as my 3913.......almost.

As you may have seen me post on another board, I've had back pain/problems lately from old injuries. Carrying my 4566 or even the 4506-1 all day/night has not helped.

I will still qualify with the 4506-1 and the original 4513TSW. I plan to also qual with the 7 round rail free and the 640-1 for my ankle holster.

The 4506-1 will still be used on field investigations and the 4513TSW.....all the rest of the time! The 640-1 is always on my ankle as a BUG.

Sign me up for two of the integral rail 3913TSW's!! Regards 18DAI

 

[Fastbolt]

Sorry to hear about your back pain issues. I empathize and wish it were otherwise for you.

Yeah, the Hogues cut for the original 4513 made it a more pleasant gun. I stopped running a lot of rounds through it once they gave me an issued 4513TSW to beat up and try and wear out, though.

Well, that ... and I still kept trying to wear out my CS45 in my "on again/off again" relationship with it, trying to figure out if I really liked it as much as I thought I might, or disliked it as much as I suspected ... or simply liked the CS9 better.

Ever have one of those guns that you used a LOT, over several years, and could shoot well, but just never really could decide whether you really liked it or not? That's me and the CS45.

I just added a new M&P 340 without the internal lock (SKU# 103072) to my collection, supplementing the existing M&P 340 (with the lock) that I've been using since they were first introduced. Figured I might as well have one without the lock since I have a couple of 642-1's, a 37-2 and an older 649 Bodyguard all without the lock. I'll keep my original M&P 340 and continue trying to wear it out, though. Might as well make it my "J-frame range beater".

I still carry one of the J's more often as retirement weapons than one of my assorted subcompact, compact or full-size guns. I'll continue doing that until the day I can't shoot them well.

While I carried both a 4013TSW and a 4513TSW at various times for my plainclothes assignment, if I'd had the opportunity I'd have chosen to carry a 3913TSW. I simply liked the slightly thinner and lighter compact 9. (For that matter, if they'd let me continue to carry an issued 6906 I'd have retired carrying one. )

Hope you're feeling better soon. I'll try to visit the other forum more often.

 

[18DAI]

Thanks Fastbolt!

Fastbolt I still have one of "those" guns. It isn't a S&W though, its my HK USP 40 compact. I suspect I hate it......but haven't confirmed that yet!

If you can believe this, the agency I qualify with has prohibited 9mm duty guns!! Even stranger, you CAN use 9mm off duty. A loophole in NC law enables me to carry my 3913 on court days as I have a CCW permit.

I got the permit to avoid the NC pistol purchase permit laws. With a CCW you don't need to get the purchase permits. Saves me about $80 per year. A fortunate side benefit is that it enables me to carry whatever I wish on my own time - agency qualified or not!

I may have to look again at the lock free 340. That 640 gets a little like an ankle weight at the end of the day. Or I might have to look at one of those cheap Uncle Mikes vest holsters..........dunno.

Nice to "see" you here Fastbolt! Best regards, 18DAI

 

[buckwheat01]

Congrats
Nice compact 45

 

[Fastbolt]

I may have to look again at the lock free 340.

There's something about the way the standard size XS dot night sight aligns in the U-shaped rear notch that allows me to shoot that little J faster, and yet just as accurately, as my other J-'s with the older narrow and newer wider sights.

Since I already had an older Ashley Big Dot sight set on my CS45 I was already familiar with the POA/POI being the center of the front dot out to 10+ yards (and being the top edge of the front dot at 25 yards).

My thoughts are that it's the distinctive U-shaped notch the front dot is lowered into that makes it work so much better and faster for me on the M&P 340, than when using the CS45 with the really wide rear express V-notch and vertical paint stripe. Even painting different colors on the front ramps of my other Airweights (and Bodyguard) doesn't seem to help nearly as much as the bright white, slightly larger (than normal white dot) front night sight being set within the U-notch when it comes to holding fast shot strings on-target.

Maybe it's just my "nudging 60" eyes. I still have what the eye doctor called "soft" 20/20 distance vision (charitably stated), but it's the front sight that becomes fuzzy. Maybe it's just the standard XS front dot and it's bright plastic ring that helps things along for me.

Whatever the case, I now own a pair of M&P 340's (one sans the ILS), as well as a pair of no-lock 642-1's. They're definitely lighter to carry for hours on end than my older stainless Bodyguard, but then I pocket carry.

If you like the Centennial in lighter weight, you might find the no-lock M&P to be something which interests you.

FWIW, while I've found at least a couple of Magnum lads which don't exhibit any indication of bullet-pull in my gun, in my hands (and a couple which did), aside from using Magnum loads for some quals, training & practice I mostly use a mix of standard pressure & +P loads for most practice (for reason of cost), and carry +P loads (by preference) The Magnums are a bit brutal in the sub 14oz M&P 340, and while I've demonstrated the ability to make fast & accurate doubles & triples out to 10 yards with Magnum loads, I simply prefer the same +P loads I carry in my other +P-rated Airweights.

They offer the no-lock M&P 340 in both standard and CT (laser) models, and the standard M&P 340 no-lock was currently in production at the time I recently ordered mine. A bit pricey, but if you have a S&W LE distributor anywhere nearby you can probably get one for discounted individual officer sale pricing.

 

[Ranger98]

That is exactly how I feel about the 4013. In fact, the only improvement I could think of is if it was a 10mm. Thanks to BM1, I now have one of each
4013
1013
Sadly, I used the sale of my 4513TSW to fund the comversion. It is amazing how many "best" guns there are. Also amazing how many are S&W

(Glad you did )

 

[KPSqured]

 

[Martya]

Can't agree more, 18DAI. This is my second semi-auto, my first was a new M&P45 FS, I have to say it is easy to carry, easy to hand and easy to shoot, and it shoots well. Best of all, it was a birthday present this year from my baby brother, a duty weapon trade from his department. (It was not a daily user, this one sat on the shelf for approx 6 of its 10 year life.) Came with 4 mags, a holster, and night sights.

 

[18DAI]

Beautiful 4513 Martya! Congrats!

Mine looks just like that. Best regards, 18DAI

 

[Cashdog]

I've been very pleased with my 457, but I've been trying to add a 4513 for quite a while. Never can seem to find one at the right time. Hoping my patience will pay off one of these days.

 

[ericlw]

i happen to like my 4513tsw with rail.

 

[Ranger98]

i happen to like my 4513tsw with rail.

me too ! It goes well with my other TSW's

 

[Martya]

Terrific collection Ranger98!
There are 3 lines of text above your triggers, mine has only 2. Is that some sort of version indicator or is that common to the TSW's with rails?

 

[Ranger98]

Terrific collection Ranger98!
There are 3 lines of text above your triggers, mine has only 2. Is that some sort of version indicator or is that common to the TSW's with rails?

I never noticed that before,however I have a 6906 (Non TSW) that also has the three lines of text.
I have a CS9 that has the three lines,but my CS40 & CS45 do not Go Figure

 

[18DAI]

The three lines of text on the frame above the trigger are indicative of very late production, 2008 to present IIRC.

Personally I prefer the standard two line - model number/serial number. Its Rugers Schtick to write all over nice guns. Regards 18DAI.

 

[KPSqured]

The three lines of text on the frame above the trigger are indicative of very late production, 2008 to present IIRC.

Personally I prefer the standard two line - model number/serial number. Its Rugers Schtick to write all over nice guns. Regards 18DAI.

Maybe a little earlier. My 4513TSW was made in 2006 with three lines of text, and I have a 4586 made in 2005 with three lines of text.

 

[18DAI]

I noticed yesterday that this rail free 4513TSW I picked up has a product code not listed in the SCSW.

Product code 149112. Anyone know anything about 149 prefix product codes? Regards 18DAI

 

[kcode]

My 4513TSW with rail has the three lines of text and it is a 8/04 production, based on the date of the spent shell casing package. The rail has been removed for a much better looking pistol.

 

[Martya]

I noticed yesterday that this rail free 4513TSW I picked up has a product code not listed in the SCSW.

Product code 149112. Anyone know anything about 149 prefix product codes? Regards 18DAI

Mine has the same product code.

 

[Babalooie]

It could have been a special order by a police department. I have a 4003TSW without the rail. It was originally sold to the Atlanta Police Department.

I currently own a 4513TSW with the rail and have one without the rail coming. The one with the rail doesn't fit in my standard holster.

Previously, I had a six shot version. It was too small for my hand and I got rid of it.