My history with the 4563TSW

[18DAI]

I picked up the 4563TSW from my FFL today. I just now finished cleaning it. I don't think it was ever cleaned or lubed. The good news is I don't think it has been shot more than a hundred times.

The rails are in excellent condition with most of the finish still intact. It does need a new trigger play spring. But I bent the one in it till the click ceased. I installed a new recoil spring and a new set of Hogue grips. Lubed and it is ready for a range trip tomorrow.

Interesting , to me, the grip frame appears to be 2mm too short. Sort of like the 4503 above, but not as bad. The Hogue grips hang 2mm below theend of the grip frame. I had not encountered that before. Mags still drop free and lock in, so it is not an issue. Just unusual.

I got to meet my friend Jeppo at the FFL - thank you again for lunch my friend! Jeppo noticed it too.

Anyways, here are some pics as promised. Regards 18DAI

 

[Jeppo]

Always a treat for me

Enjoy your new shooter. What a find!

Do the new grips also extend down below the frame? So strange.

 

[18DAI]

Yes Jeppo. The new Hogues descend below the grip frame the same 2mm as the ones you saw on it today. Strange.

And it appears a factory Delrin fits the same. With the same overlap. The only thing I can think of is that being this was an LE Special order, it was done purposely, so that you can rip the mag out of the well in case of a malfunction. It does facillitate that.

Thing is, I don't recall the same happening with the other 4563TSW I owned. IIRC, the fit of the grips on it, was perfect. Which would mean a longer grip frame. Anyways, no matter. It doesn't look unsightly nor does it affect function.

Going to try to run by work tomorrow and run a couple of mags through it to confim function and see that POA = POI with Winchester RA45T.

BTW, the gun cleaned up really well. And I was able to push the trigger play spring further forward eliminating the click.

I have a prototype stainless steel trigger play spring. Maybe in the spring when I go on vacation I will send the gun to BMCM and ask him to install the steel trigger play spring. Never have to worry about it after that.

Always a pleasure to see you my friend! Lets go shooting again soon! Best regards, 18DAI

PS: Thank you again vigil617! I love the pistol!

 

[4T5GUY]

Nice, I'm glad finally it arrived safely. It does look to be in very great condition and I'm sure it will become a favorite.

Just out of curiosity and for my own interest, (without disclosing all of the serial number,) what is the three letter prefix of the serial number? I think I can make out a T, (?) maybe followed by a D or O?

Thanks to you and a few others I'm starting a list of these no railed TSW's prefixes, (and complete serial numbers when available.) As you know there is a pattern.

Jim

 

[18DAI]

4T5GUY - TDU57XX is the serial. Thanks for tracking these scarce birds! Regards 18DAI

 

[vigil617]

Here's your best photo, turned so we can see it better, 18. Nice looking pistol!

 

[18DAI]

Thank you vigil617 - for EVERYTHING!

The gun has some exterior holster wear and a few handling marks. But they are of no concern, to me, because it is going to be used - a lot!

After carrying 4566s, I had forgotten how light the 4563 feels in comparison. In fact, my friend who owns the FFL where I had it shipped, commented on how light it was. A very good feeling gun.

Now to throw some rounds through it and get it into my holster. I go on duty tomorrow and would like to have it while I am watching the "show" tomorrow night. Thanks again my friend! Best regards, 18DAI

 

[4T5GUY]

It's actually getting easier. Three of us here, you included have TDUXXXX in the 7nd no rail 4513TSW that are within very close serials of one another.

Now again TDU for a no rail 4563TSW. Hate to always jump to conclusions but there is definitely a pattern in these special run TSW's. At least in the .45's. I've got MSF in pre-railed ones of different calibers. Be interesting to see if TDU was also for different calibers of these special order TSW's.

Also by chance, although it doesn't really matter, do you have the box or spec ord #? As you know some of the other TDU's were 1999 and an overlap of the MSF 1999 pre-railed 4513TSW's.

Again thanks for your post, (s,) as always. Learning is fun.

Jim

 

[4T5GUY]

Here's your best photo, turned so we can see it better, 18. Nice looking pistol!

I thought I was the only one who "righted" 18's images.

Jim

 

[18DAI]

No box or docs 4T5GUY. Shipped in plastic wrap. I paid premium price for it. But as a friend pointed out today, "I thought you were a shooter, not a collector. Did you want it? Whens the last time you saw one? Think you will see another for less anytime soon?"

Wise fellow. I now have zero buyers remorse. And if it shoots as good as the trigger feels, it will take a jackhammer to get the smile off my face.

Range report to follow. Regards 18DAI

 

[Jeppo]

4T5GUY

You're looking for s/n prefixes on any TSW gun or just those two specific prefixes?

 

[4T5GUY]

You're looking for s/n prefixes on any TSW gun or just those two specific prefixes?

I was just noticing that these "different" no railed TSW's were sharing the same prefix. I can't imagine that this is an accident but I don't know for sure. I don't have very many non railed, (not enough,) TSW's but MSF and TDU seem to be a common prefix in the ones I have. There's a TDM there too but it's the only one I have. I do realize that some were only made for a couple of years so that explains the like prefixes.

I think it's interesting, at least to me to track these special order examples. Of course 18DAI was the reason I started down this path. I was very happy with my pre-rail examples until he shared a picture of a no rail 7rnd 4513TSW example with me. He thankfully was instrumental in me getting one. They are not just somewhat rare and difficult to find/get, but they are extremely perfectly built pistols. Slide to frame rail fit is a tight as any PC pistol I have. Really. Triggers are perfect and better than some PC's I have. They hold there own in accuracy with the Briley bushing ones I have. I'm comparing the "working" .45 PC examples I have and not the target ones.

Jim

 

[Jeppo]

Got it. I've got a TSW in each of the three flavors but they must be "normal" examples.

 

[4T5GUY]

I'm sure none of the TSW's are "normal," and a big step above their regular production counterparts. There probably is no difference in the latter ones at all, (other than a rail.)

I just don't have a railed one to compare the others to and I don't foresee myself getting one. It's just a personal preference for me and have no doubt that the TSW railed versions are top notch and put together with extra attention and skill.

Jim

 

[vigil617]

I sure hope 18 has his work schedule arranged to allow for some of that range time he's been needing for the new acquisition.

S'posed to be a pretty and unseasonably warm weekend here in North Carolina, so maybe we will get that range report he's been promising.

 

[18DAI]

vigil617 I was on duty the last 4 nights, including tonight. I am scheduled to work at the range all day tomorrow.

Either before we open or after we close, I intend to run a few mags through the 4563TSW. Not an extended range session, but enough to check function and make sure she shoots to point of aim. Sorry for the delay! Regards 18DAI

 

[18DAI]

Range Report

I finally got to shoot the 4563. We were VERY busy all day, till around 10 minutes before closing. So I had to use a lane that "broke" yesterday. Someone hit the travel rail, causing the target carrier to not go beyond the 10 yard line. But that worked, for me, as I was tired and didn't have my range bag to rest the pistol on.

So I ran 4 mags - 32 rounds - to test for function and check that POA = POI. I used 8 rounds of S&B 230 ball, 8 rounds Sig Performance 230 ball and 16 rounds of Federal HST 230 JHP Standard velocity.

The gun ran 100% as expected. I had done the "pencil test" after cleaning to check for function and it had launched it across the room. Ejection was good, throwing everything up and over my right shoulder. I ran the S&B first. It went into 4" with 1 flyer. The Sig ball did a little better ar around 3.5", again with a pulled shot, from me. The HST grouped best, as expected for premium defensive ammo. Both groups averaging around 2".

I am VERY happy with the rail free 4563TSW! -Thank you again vigil617! It will go in my holster when working the range and also get carried a lot this winter.

I may change the grips out to the thinner OEM Delrins with a rubber grip sleeve. The Hogues on it now felt....thick, to me. I had to keep adjusting my grip in between mag changes. All my 3rd gen carry guns wear OEMs with the rubber sleeve set up. It anchors them in my hands better. And enables me to shoot tighter groups, faster.

Of course the trigger is a primary considerstion in an accurate pistol, despite what you may read elsewhere. The trigger on this 4563 is great. Very smooth with a crisp let off in DA and SA. Short reset like every 3rd gen. A couple of the younger guys working with me tried the trigger and were amazed by it. Their exposure is only with plastic striker fired guns. They had never experienced a good trigger. I teased them that I was old enough to remember when manufacturers strove to give handguns a good trigger right out of the box, without having to resort to aftermarket to obtain one.

I intend to spend more range time with the 4563 when my schedule slows down......if it slows down. With the tragic election outcome I anticipate a high volume continuing at the range and many more private lesson students on my days off. Ammunition availability appears to be going to get worse. But between the police supply and the instructors ammo discount I have managed to put up enough ammo that I can still shoot a few hundred rounds a month. And the next few months will be used familiarizing myself with the superb 4563TSW. Regards 18DAI

 

[vigil617]

Fixed it for ya!

Really glad this gun has turned out to have met your expectations. It's always a bit of a risk to buy something sight unseen, but the good thing about Third Gen pistols on auction sites is that we can feel confident from the get-go that they've been manufactured well and built to last. Still, it's good to find out for sure that what you've invested in is a "keeper."

Looking forward to more updates as you're able to wring it out over time. Keep us posted!

 

[M29since14]

A lot of good points in your last post, particularly about grips and triggers. Always gratifying to find someone who reinforces opinions you have already developed on your own. I don't understand this modern business of trying to fluff off terrible triggers. A terrible trigger is a terrible trigger! Of course they are an impediment to accurate shooting. Why would anyone claim otherwise? (I guess we know the answer to that one. )

Hogue grips on S&W automatics have never felt right to me, but the Handall things cure the grip problem for me. Not pretty, but they work.

Great to know the gun has worked well and that the purchase was a good one. Congrats!

 

[18DAI]

Amen brother!

As we have discussed triggers and accurate shooting at the range that I am working at again, I and one other older fella (who carrys a TDA pistol also) realized that the younger guys, don't know what they don't know.

A few of them are young Marines, transitioning from active to reserves. All their experience has been with striker fired plastic. Glocks in their case. They have been conditioned to the "same trigger pull" is good enough. And that works, for them. To a degree.

But the other "old guy" and I routinely best them on the range. Because we both came up on revolvers, know a good trigger and how to work it and have shot just about everything out there. As far as handguns go. So these young guys have started trying other types of pistols and are discovering the benefits of a smooth crisp trigger. And they are shooting better groups.

With manufacturers pushing cheaply made guns out the door and people lining up to buy them, it is little wonder that no effort is made to provide a decent trigger on their product. And Apex tactical is probably pleased with that.

But there are a few manufacturers that are trying. We recently evaluated a few new pistols, for the rental case. The Mossberg MC2c was one of them. A thin 9mm with a GREAT feeling grip. And the trigger was not awful. Fairly smooth with a short reset. The gun shot well. For all of us. Walther also has a decent striker fired trigger on its pistols.

I don't own any striker fired plastic guns. I've no use for them. But my friendJeppo recently pointed out to me that it would behoove me to purchase a current production gun, for the sake of my private lesson customers. Most of whom have no idea how to find and purchase out of print guns online. Wise counsel.

So I may pick up one of those Mossberg MC2c pistols to teach with. Easy enough to shoot and manipulate and easily found for sale locally. For not too much money either. Regards 18DAI