Is the .380 enough?

[Old cop]

I was a cop for 30 years and survived three deadly encounters with my issued .38 so that's where my comfort level lies. I've tried a variety of .380 pistols and all of them failed, one way or another over time, so I gave up on that platform. That said I witnessed people shot w/all sorts of calibers and what I learned is shot placement is the only thing that really matters. Guns carried for self defense are usually small and difficult to shoot so regular range time is a must. Safe & accurate gun handling is a perishable skill. Always be aware of your surroundings and stay safe.

 

[hostler]

Ballistics of the modern .380 are very similar to a modern 38. Practically speaking there's not enough difference to be of consequence. 38 is a little heavier and 380 is a little faster, their energy is basically the same. I know everyone has an idea in their head where they draw the line on minimum defensive rounds but I think the line between 38 and 380 is cobweb thin. That line would be better drawn between 380 and 32 or between 38 and 38+P. Yes, I said it, I think there's a bigger energy gap between 38+P and 38 than there is between 38 and 380.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

Ballistics of the modern .380 are very similar to a modern 38. Practically speaking there's not enough difference to be of consequence. 38 is a little heavier and 380 is a little faster, their energy is basically the same. I know everyone has an idea in their head where they draw the line on minimum defensive rounds but I think the line between 38 and 380 is cobweb thin. That line would be better drawn between 380 and 32 or between 38 and 38+P. Yes, I said it, I think there's a bigger energy gap between 38+P and 38 than there is between 38 and 380.

I agree with this. Looking at muzzle energy with my defensive loads .38 special is about 225 ft/lb and .380 auto is around 200 ft/lb (Speer Gold Dot).
To answer the OP question, I think the .380 or .38 is the minimum and I carry both of these on a regular basis.

 

[03hemi]

You can kill someone with a 22, so with the right ammo 380 is just as deadly as anything else.

 

[Kanewpadle]

It depends on your perceived needs. For some a 380 may be enough. For others it may not be.

I've owned several small 380 guns. Tried to like them but they just don't work for me.

If one lived in small town USA a small 380 is probably enough. In major metropolitan areas it may not be. But quite often the caliber of the gun is not a factor when buying. The size of the gun is often the most important factor.

 

[RGVshooter]

Little known fact, the ArchDuke was wearing a really excellent (for it's time) bulletproof vest. As he was hit in the neck it did him little good. The U. S. Secret Service thought so much of it they special ordered one for William McKinley. It arrived two weeks after he was shot to death. His successor, Teddy Roosevelt, was the victim of at least one assassination attempt. A folded up bunch of paper in his inside coat pocket (speech notes) saved him from a significant injury. Anemic cartridge.

Little known facts.

1. Roosevelt was shot once by john schrank with a Colt Police Positive chambered in 38 S&W. A well known weak round.

2. The Archduke Ferdinand was killed by Gavrilo Princip with a FN model 1910 380, he was shot once in the neck, wife shot once in the stomach, both died within minutes. He was not wearing a bulletproof vest and I'm not sure where you got that from, perhaps it was because his aides had to use scissors to remove his jacket and the story changed over time. the outer lapel had been sewn to the inner front of the jacket to make for a smoother appearance when out in public. That's why they had to cut his coat off of him. Which again, is immaterial because the guy was shot in the neck...

3. William McKinley was shot twice in the gut by a .32 Iver Johnson revolver hiding under a handkerchief by Leon Czolgosz at point blank range and died a week or so later of gangrene. Mckinley was also very obese just saying...Oh and he was not wearing a bulletproof vest & again, not sure where you're getting your info from.

Point is, the objective in a self defense shooting is to stop the attacker, not to kill.. I mean C'mon guys... We're trying to defend ourselves from a violent attack, we're not Bear hunting..

 

[URIT]

I recently read a study of 1700 gun fatalities that examined the different caliber firearms effectiveness. The 380 held its own against its bigger brothers, far better than its little brothers, with being fatal in nearly (IIRC) 14% of the time. That said, I wouldn't want to be shot with a 380, but I'll stick with one of my big brothers for my PD.

 

[wnderr]

Yeppers! To steal something from them gator hunters in Louisiana, "choot 'em till they stop!"

 

[DevilDog72]

well...….just my humble opine...… n o

 

[malph]

Not attempting to start a war, (pun intented). just some food for thought.

On page 100 of the September edition The American Rifleman is the monthly article called: "I have this old gun...." And in the issue that I received yesterday the featured firearm is a FN Browning Model 1922. This is the same model that arguably started WWI on June 28, 1014. The Bosnian nationalist "fired twice at Franz Ferdinand and his wife Sophie, mortally wounding them."
I see "experts" saying the .380 is not a good carry arm, the minimum is ?????. In this case it was more than enough, and a .22 LR is more than enough a lot of times.
I'm not an expert, but I think it safe to say that whatever caliber that a person can handle safely and shoot well is the best carry gun for him or her.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

P.S. If you are not a member of the NRA and like to read about old firearms, now is a good time to join.

Copyright for the above mentioned article is owned by the National Rifle Association, 11250 Waples Mill Road, Fairfax, VA 22030-9400

Is .380acp enough? The answer is a definite "sometimes". If you like the odds, go for it.

No handgun caliber is a definite "always" though the .380acp is generally acknowledged to be on the low end of the acceptable spectrum.

Once you get out of the pocket gun category and come to grips with wearing a holster, there are definitely better options that increase the odds of bullet effectiveness.

Even in the pocket gun category, I am personally more comfortable with the power of a stoutly loaded J frame .38 or mid-range .357.

 

[Well Armed]

I carry 38 special, 380 acp, 9mm, and 45... They all are good enough imho... I don't waste my time with all the speculative bro science from so call experts... All that matters to me is if I like the gun, if it's reliable, and if I can hit the broad side of barn with it...

 

[mrchuck]

The women bring these little "cuties"in 32 and 380 caliber for their Concealed Carry Licence Class.
After shooting 50 rounds, ALL of the ladies with this tiny pistol have "slide cuts in the web between thumb and index finger,
YES,,,,All of them.
They grip tightly,and the web gets cut by the slide recoiling back!
Remember this.

 

[YouGotTheJuiceNowMan]

The way I look at this is that more then likely if I ever had to pull my CCW the threat will be pretty close to me, close enough that pull and fire is a very likely scenario. Shooting from the hip with one hand or aiming with one hand. I personally feel like at a self defense distance just about any hand gun caliber is enough to STOP a threat. However personal preference plays a roll into whatever I or you feel like is enough stopping power. I carry some form of .38 special most of the time (K or J frame Smith) and will carry .380 sometimes (ppk/s) I personally would not carry anything less. So for me .380 is the minimum for my self defense standards. Most likely us non LEOs will never have to pull or use our CCWs so carry what makes you happy and your comfortable wearing all day. This is all just my 2 cents, I am not trying to argue or disagree with anyone on here.

 

[S&W629]

I was not a fan of 380...till Browning introduced the 1911-380.
the longer barrel increased velocity a bit...yet the gun is extremely concealable. very light..and the locked breech took away the snap of a light weight pistol. I need to confess, it was my wife who wanted the 1911-22, followed by the matching 1911-380. the pair fit her hand as if designed for her small hand. the 1911-380 has been 100% reliable, and is now wifes CCW. she can and does shoot extremely tight groups with it.

I should add, wife does have a full size SA Loaded 1911 45, shoots it well, but the size and weight make it a range/truck pistol...and she likes the common controls of the 1911 and the 1911-380

 

[haywood]

I have read more than my share on what is the best caliber. I have also read that hitting the correct spot or accuracy is more important than caliber.

 

[eb07]

I'll stick with good old 38 special as primary but have no issue carrying 380 from time to time.

 

[JayFramer]

Yes.

Not only is it "enough", but it is right in line with the major service calibers (.38 special, 9mm, .357 magnum, .40 S&W, .45 ACP) in real-world street results. Don't believe me? Check this out:

YouTube

The .380 is shown in that study to be much more effective than the "mouse" calibers such as .22LR, .25 ACP, and .32 ACP. And with today's hollow-point technology, there are .380 loads that both expand AND meet the FBI recommended 12" penetration factors.

The .380 is a worthy defensive caliber. The numbers and street results agree. Shot placement above everything but the .380 can and will get it done. Really it's the guns that fire .380 that can be somewhat limiting. While guns like the Ruger LCP and S&W Bodyguard are very small and compact, they aren't particularly "shootable" for the average person and magazine capacity is often limited.

With a larger gun like the Beretta 84 or CZ-83, both mid-size double-stack .380s, you can have an EXCELLENT fighting handgun that can be highly effective. Again, the data and real world performance show the .380 is as potent as any standard duty caliber. With the tiny pocket .380s, it takes more training to "get there" but they too can be really great guns for personal protection.

 

[Darkenfast]

Over a hundred years ago, something like the FN 1910 was state-of-the-art in concealable defense. The 1922 was a brilliant answer to giving countries on a budget a service pistol that would be a lot easier to shoot than the 1910. There were police agencies carrying them up into the 80's. The Dutch Politie Troepen (I believe they still exist), carried .380 1922s with SIX 8-round magazines! Here's an interesting topic for debate: who was better armed during the 30s-50s'? 1. The Dutch Trooper with a 4.4 inch barreled .380 and 48 rounds in quickly-changed magazines? 2. A typical American cop with a six-shot revolver and .38 Special, with reloads in dump pouches or loops? It's not so-clear cut, of course. Differences in training would trump the differences in guns, and most police users of the 1922 went with .32ACP. So did the Nazis, who had over 400,000 made during the war (that was the pistol showcased in the National Rifleman). For me, I would go with the Dutch choice! I wish I had one of those 1922s! Today, I would probably go with a compact 9mm Parabellum for concealed carry. With lighter ammo (like Critical Defense), a locked breech gun doesn't kick that much.

 

[Sebring Pop]

I carry a 380 and the way I see is is the bullet is powerful enough to penetrate one side of the skull
but not the other so the bullet ricochets around inside the skull scrambling the brain.

Good enough for me.

 

[LVSteve]

I used to carry a .32 PP clone, and not once have I managed to find a volunteer willing to prove how inadequate a caliber that is by letting me shoot at them. People don't like being shot, so a .380 will always beat a pointy stick or yelling for help.

Concealability and recoil are big factors when it comes to carrying a gun. HAVING a gun is the key.