Is This A Pre-10?
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chiefdave
US Veteran
K38 Masterpiece, and a very nice one. Some would call it a pre 15.
Actually that would be the predecessor the Model 14.
It looks like an outdoorsman
Buy buy buy
Buy buy buy
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DWalt
Member
Not even close. It is a completely different model from S&W which is called the .38/44 Outdoorsman. It is built on the N-frame which is somewhat beefier than the K-frame typical of the M&P series. It was intended to use a more heavily loaded version of the .38 Special cartridge called the .38-44. The barrel caliber stamping should be .38 S&W Special CTG, but I cannot make that out from your photo. A very desirable revolver. It later became the Model 23, so it could be called a pre-Model 23 by some. See:SMITH & WESSON Model 23 (.38-44 Outdoorsman) :: Gun Values by Gun Digest
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Baltimoreed11754
Member
Model 10 has fixed sights. Pre10's have half moon front sights and grips like these. My pre 10s. The Fitz'ed gun is pitted under the horned grips a po had on it so I didn't hurt anything. Got a deal on the nickel gun as it was so yellow the seller thought it was gold washed. Cleaned up nice.
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I see a shrouded ejectod rod, not a K38. It's an N frame 38 special Outdoorsman possibly, with that S serial number or maybe a pre 27 357. Can't tell from the pics. Is the top strap checked?
John
John
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Definitely a .38/44 Outdoorsman, from about 1954. And if the left side is as nice as the right and mechanically sound, worth about 3X of a .38 Military & Police of the same era. Hope they are pricing it as the latter.
I did not catch the ejector rod shroud. I suppose I could come up with excuses like not enough coffee this morning, or OTD.
Buy, Buy, Buy!
Buy, Buy, Buy!
I once found a pre-war Outdoorsman's in a local shop, marked as a "Special Police" no idea what that is. Anyway it was priced really low, and I negotiated it even lower and bought it.
If the pictured gun is decently priced I'd definitely jump on it.
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If the pictured gun is decently priced I'd definitely jump on it.
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mikeruns
Member
A wonderful Outdoorsman!
If they want to sell it at at "pre-10" price, grab it. Anything under $1200 would be a good price where I shop, where it is very unlikely to be labeled as a "pre-10." Good luck.
Jeff
Jeff
Those are the ones that you keep under your hat until the sale is over unless there is no way someone can find it!
Great advice! If they want to sell it as a pre-Model 10, so be it. You may get a great revolver at a big discount price! Good luck!
James, let us know how it goes with that beautiful "pre-10", or maybe let me know where it's at so I can grab it.
OP
James K
Member
James, let us know how it goes with that beautiful "pre-10", or maybe let me know where it's at so I can grab it.
Well, I successfully 'grabbed' it! Less than $1k incl. premium. 2 others bid me up a few increments but fell short of my max bid. May ship by end of week and can't wait to see it. Condition looks excellent based on the few auction pics.
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Actually, if you were to get yourself a picture book----something on the order of The Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson, you wouldn't be wasting your time asking questions like this.
On the other hand, the current edition (4th) is obsolete, so wait for the 5th edition. It'll be along in July---or at least it's supposed to be. Most everything that was not quite right in the 4th will be fixed, and anything worth talking about since it came along, 2016 or so, will be in there--even almost certainly including such lingo as "pre" this or that; never mind S&W never made anything called a "pre" whatever.
Or maybe not---hope springs eternal!
Ralph Tremaine
On the other hand, the current edition (4th) is obsolete, so wait for the 5th edition. It'll be along in July---or at least it's supposed to be. Most everything that was not quite right in the 4th will be fixed, and anything worth talking about since it came along, 2016 or so, will be in there--even almost certainly including such lingo as "pre" this or that; never mind S&W never made anything called a "pre" whatever.
Or maybe not---hope springs eternal!
Ralph Tremaine
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Model19man
Member
Wow I can't keep up. An N frame that has only a serial number. It predates Model numbers by decades. Smith and Wesson used only names in that era.
From what I can see you got yourself a heck of a deal. Congratulations.
OP
James K
Member
I asked one question that fostered a lot of response. I don't think I wasted MY time, sorry if it bothered you.
You are certainly getting a good start on having a Happy New Year !!!
Beautiful N Frame 38 Special
Awesome
Beautiful N Frame 38 Special
Awesome
You will love this gun. I have my grandfather's pre-war 38/44 Outdoorsman. I take it to the range every time I go. Everyone wants to shoot it.
You scored, big time, on this one. Congrats!
Keep us posted, once you receive it.
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The original (pre-war; that would be WWII) predates the model numbers by decades but this one is a post war example so predates model numbers by a few years, maybe only one or two years. This will grate on rct269's ears but it is what most of us would call a pre-model 23. Or, to make some happier, a .38/44 Outdoorsman Model of 1950. Great gun, whatever we call it, at a pretty good price. Maybe a really good price. I can't tell from the pictures but it looks like it might be the "bright blue" finish and, according to the Standard Catalog that's worth another 25-50%.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
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Here is a recent pick up
Pre war OD
Advertised as a 67
Gentle wear and a trigger stop installed
I suppose it's not uncommon for sellers to misidentify these ODs or HDs
Per RCT I've pre-ordered my SCSW
Pre war OD
Advertised as a 67
Gentle wear and a trigger stop installed
I suppose it's not uncommon for sellers to misidentify these ODs or HDs
Per RCT I've pre-ordered my SCSW
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Pre war OD
Advertised as a 67
Gentle wear and a trigger stop installed
I suppose it's not uncommon for sellers to misidentify these ODs or HDs
Per RCT I've pre-ordered my SCSW
Yes, it happens. This pre-war engraved HD was on an auction site with lousy pictures advertised as a M&P. And the bright blue finish pre-23 (sorry Ralph) was simply labeled "S&W 38 Special" in a shop some ten years ago.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
https://flic.kr/p/2odVMgi https://www.flickr.com/photos/194934231@N03/
https://flic.kr/p/2n6XYkk https://www.flickr.com/photos/194934231@N03/
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Model19man
Member
Maybe you would but I would and will call it what it was called when it was new.
DWalt
Member
There are many nomenclature identity terms that S&W never used that some collectors do use. Even though they don't officially exist, they are, for the most part, tolerated because they have been in use for a long time. "Pre-Model xx" is just one of them. However I believe the proper nomenclature descriptors should be what S&W itself used at the time the gun was made.
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Definitely NOT a Pre-10, which was a fixed sight K Frame. This is an N Frame with adjustable sights, and the caliber marking looks to be 38 Special, so it is an N Frame called the 38/44 Outdoorsman. The name basically means that it is a 38 Special on a 44 Frame. They made two, one called Outdoorsman, which has adjustable sights, like the one pictured, and the other called the 38/44 Heavy Duty, which the same frame, but with fixed sights. The reason for the 38/44 was to fire the 38 Special Hi Speed or 38/44 Special (a 158 grain bullet at 1100 fps, give or take), which was the forerunner of the .357 Magnum by about 4 or 5 years. The 38/44 revolvers and the cartridge came along around 1930-ish, and the Magnum cartridge with its new revolver, called simply the ".357" Magnum, or Registered Magnum by collectors about 5 years later in 1935. If you want to know what the 38/44 load felt like to shoot, Buffalo Bore still makes the ballistic equivalent, which they call the 38 Special +P Outdoorsman load, catalog number 20H20. You don't have to go around in front to figure out that it just went off!
themightyhawk
Member
i guessed wrong, i guess
i thought it was a mod. 20, silly me.
i thought it was a mod. 20, silly me.
Great looking gun.As far as theSWSC book they didn't mention the model 66-7. Only seen picture of it in my old S&W brochure, can't remember the year it was made. It didn't look as good as the 66-8. I would have bought it but never saw one in my area. Oh well never sell any S&W's or other guns.
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