K-32 Serial Number K2244 - new info from Roy in posts #29 and #39

[bullmack]

Early last week I jumped on GB and a K-32 had just been posted. Starting price of $800 with a Buy it Now of $1300. 4 crappy pictures but a 3 day inspection. I hemmed and hawed for about 5 minutes and bought it. Sent the seller an email and asked for the s/n - answer came back as 86610. Ok, right in a known range, which Roy later verified as June 1950. The gun shipped UPS standard out of FL so truck all the way - then it got hung up in Montana due to a trail derailment and avalanche detours.

A day or 2 after I bought it I posted it on one of the member forums with pictures. 410bore spotted the fact that the gun was wearing very rare stocks made for a very short time around 1950 using a grip adapter (thanks Kris). Cool - I didn't even know they existed! (non-relieved diamond checkered target stocks)

The gun arrived today. The 86610 that I thought was the s/n is the assembly number on the yoke. The correct s/n is K2244 and it matches everywhere - including both the left and right stocks! Both stocks are also stamped with the initials J B G.

The gun has a single line Made in USA address. I have a communication into Roy via email about it. This s/n is way lower then any number I've seen published.

It has a fair amount of honest wear. Tomorrow I will go over it with Flitz. My daughter will come by Saturday to get me a full set of good, detailed, pictures. Of course these will be posted and will any further information from Roy.

Sure will be interesting to see how this one letters.

 

[bamabiker]

Congrats on what looks to be a big score.

 

[DCWilson]

That is potentially an early K-32 prototype. Production K-32s did not start leaving the factory until early 1949 (well, a bare handful shipped in December 1948) with serial numbers in the K56xxx and above range, at which time the frames presumably all had four-line addresses. A single-line K-32 with a four-digit serial number has got to be vanishingly rare. The photos don't show it, so I have to ask: does the ejector rod have a fixed diameter all along its length, or does it have a large prewar style ejector rod knob?

The earliest known K-32 I have seen referenced is K2143, a salesman's sample in blue that was refinished in nickel at the factory before being sold some time later. The reference you sometimes see to K2137 as the first K-32 is apparently incorrect. Mike Priwer has established that that gun is a K-38.

The plastic spacer grip adapter is a great score.

The hammer looks like a later semi-target hammer to me. Maybe not original to the gun. If the gun is as early as I think it may be, the hammer and stocks were probably added later as improvements.

I wonder if JBG was a S&W employee or outside sales rep.

Please keep us posted on what you learn. This one has caught my attention.

AFTERTHOUGHT: I may be wrong about the hammer. The low angle of the photo may have led me to misunderstand its shape.

 

[CptCurl]

Wow! That is an interesting K32. You are going to get some attention with that.

Curl

 

[gjamison]

Looking forward to better pics.

Love it when S&W's like this get un-earthed. This should be fun!!

 

[bullmack]

That is potentially an early K-32 prototype. Production K-32s did not start leaving the factory until early 1949 (well, a bare handful shipped in December 1948) with serial numbers in the K56xxx and above range, at which time the frames presumably all had four-line addresses. A single-line K-32 with a four-digit serial number has got to be vanishingly rare. The photos don't show it, so I have to ask: does the ejector rod have a fixed diameter all along its length, or does it have a large prewar style ejector rod knob?

The earliest known K-32 I have seen referenced is K2143, a salesman's sample in blue that was refinished in nickel at the factory before being sold some time later. The reference you sometimes see to K2137 as the first K-32 is apparently incorrect. Mike Priwer has established that that gun is a K-38.

The plastic spacer grip adapter is a great score.

The hammer looks like a later semi-target hammer to me. Maybe not original to the gun. If the gun is as early as I think it may be, the hammer and stocks were probably added later as improvements.

I wonder if JBG was a S&W employee or outside sales rep.

Please keep us posted on what you learn. This one has caught my attention.

AFTERTHOUGHT: I may be wrong about the hammer. The low angle of the photo may have led me to misunderstand its shape.

David,

Thank you for the info. I will have better pictures up late tomorrow. In the meantime here is some additional info.

The ejector rod is of the LERK style.
The hammer measures .500"
The trigger measures approx. .250"
The right side barrel markings is 32 LONG CTG.
The barrel is 6" and narrow ribbed.
Front Patridge sight.

I have sent Roy an email with all of the info asking for his input. I will update this post as information is developed. Keep the questions coming - I'll do my best to answer them.

 

[murphydog]

It's nice to see a happy mystery! Hopefully the letter will shed more light on its origins. Congratulations!

 

[410bore]

Very nice, early K-32! I'm with David on the Target Hammer and Stocks; the revolver predates those features by 3 years or so.

 

[peyton]

Your Gunbroker skills must be well honed!! I search for k-32's every day!! What was the GB number for it (since it is closed now).

 

[Green Frog]

Wow, just WOW! That has to be one of the most exciting finds of the year! I can't believe that anything that great is still out there lurking on the auction scene... I thought they had all been snapped up by now. I guess there is still a chance for me, and that's what keeps me searching! This model has now reached "#1 with a bullet" on my Bucket List.

Froggie

 

[bullmack]

info from Roy Jinks

This is from an email exchange with Roy a few minutes ago.

"Dennis, this is a neat revolver it was shipped as a K-32 in March 1948. The type of target grips on the revolver are the very early type of target grips produced by the factory. There were also 5 K-38 in this serial range and most of them were shipped in 1948. These guns may have been made earlier as the factory were beginning to test production of the center fire K target series revolvers. To get more information on the handgun I would have to check out the invoice at the museum. In reference to the serial number K-2137 that you were told about the shipping records list it as a k-38 shipped in June 1946 so it was a very early shipment of that Model and it was listed as going to a distributor. Hope this helps. Roy"

 

[glenncal1]

I think for $1300 with this history you definitely scored. We are all jealous. If you haven't shot a K32 you are in for a treat. enjoy

 

[bullmack]

Your Gunbroker skills must be well honed!! I search for k-32's every day!! What was the GB number for it (since it is closed now).

I have a custom search on GB that I try and perform 4-5 times per day otherwise there's too many new listings to scroll through. All of the auction re-posts seem to happen early evening (PDT) so there's always a bunch of auctions every evening. I was just lucky on this one and logged on soon after it had first been posted!

Auction # is 395362665

 

[DCWilson]

Keep the questions coming - I'll do my best to answer them.

Here's a question: Wanna sell it?

Seriously, big time congratulations on the score. March 1948 is extremely early for a K-32; that's in the time frame when they were finally beginning to ship the K-38 in commercial quantities, and that was a little over a year after they let the K-22 out the door. The reference to a K-38 going to a distributor in mid-1946 confirms that the company was producing a few short-action centerfire target revolvers for review and evaluation at the same time they were trying to catch up with the demand backlog for non-Victory M&Ps. It would be nice to know how many such preview pieces in .32 Long and .38 Special were sent out. Not more than a few dozen, I would guess. Which gives us all something to look for.

Again, congratulations on a terrific acquisition.

 

[H Richard]

Go buy a lottery ticket while you luck us holding! I'm looking forward to the "cleaned up" pictures your daughter will take. But you must do yourself a favor, take it out and shoot it.

 

[bullmack]

Here's a question: Wanna sell it?

It would be nice to know how many such preview pieces in .32 Long and .38 Special were sent out. Not more than a few dozen, I would guess. Which gives us all something to look for.

Again, congratulations on a terrific acquisition.

I'm trying to get as much history as possible from the seller. The guy I bought it from sold it for his brother. The brother bought it from a lady whose husband had owned it in New York State. The seller will inquire further on my behalf. It's history is getting closer to Springfield!

 

[gjamison]

See if you can find out where in NY.

 

[raljr1]

Very neat story and great find. I didn't know that the K32 existed till about 6 months ago and have wanted one since. Congratulations on a terrific find.

 

[peyton]

I am simply amazed at the quanity of information that you all have! Now the most important question, how does it shoot??

 

[RKmesa]

Dennis:

Lee had a set of grips like that at the Tucson Collectors' Assn. annual meeting several years ago. I think that he also posted some of his great photos here somewhere. Here's a link to the post - unfortunately the photos did not come up, but I think they were similar to the ones on your gun.

The RAREST Target Stocks

Can't wait for your daughter's additional photos....

 

[VM]

Dennis:

Lee had a set of grips like that at the Tucson Collectors' Assn. annual meeting several years ago. I think that he also posted some of his great photos here somewhere. Here's a link to the post - unfortunately the photos did not come up, but I think they were similar to the ones on your gun.

The RAREST Target Stocks

Can't wait for your daughter's additional photos....

Richard/Dennis-
Lee's grips were exactly the same.
Lee eventually sold them on Ebay with some of his other amazing grips and accessories. For memory they brought $700-$800.

 

[bullmack]

Richard/Dennis-
Lee's grips were exactly the same.
Lee eventually sold them on Ebay with some of his other amazing grips and accessories. For memory they brought $700-$800.

Richard/VM - I had a brief post on the gun on the members forum prior to this post and 410bore (Kris) sent me the link to Lee's post - the pictures were still coming up. I saved Lee's post complete with pictures as a pdf file. Scoring these grips was a double bonus. I knew nothing about them till the heads up from Kris. In fact I had not even spotted the adapter from the sellers pictures. I can see why they made so few pairs - they were an ill-fated attempt to cut costs that looked way better on paper then in execution!

When we take pictures later today I will get several shots of the stocks in various stages of install.

 

[rburg]

Keep in mind this isn't just an early shipment, it means the first K32 shipped about 6 months before the first K22. The world of S&W is kind of odd. Consider that K101 or K102 or whichever went out in December of 46 and now we hear K2,000+ was out in June.

 

[bullmack]

Keep in mind this isn't just an early shipment, it means the first K32 shipped about 6 months before the first K22. The world of S&W is kind of odd. Consider that K101 or K102 or whichever went out in December of 46 and now we hear K2,000+ was out in June.

Dick - The database says the K102-K103 shipped in the 1st 3 months of 1947. This K-32 shipped March 1948 according to Roy - so the K-22's preceded the K-32's - at least based upon what we know so far.

 

[bullmack]

New Pictures - Upload #1

I am uploading the pictures we took today. The pictures show the condition much worse than does the eye. Nevertheless it is far from a +90% gun.

I have also created an album in the Albums and Pictures section that has all of these pictures in one group, a narrative on what we know so far about the gun, and the features.

 

[bullmack]

Upload #2

Close ups of LERK, caliber stamping, and hammer. Also of the right side of the frame showing there are no rework stamps.

 

[bullmack]

Upload #3 - the ugly!

The scuffing/marring on the side plate is interesting. It almost looks like it occurred with the side plate off as the damage doesn't really cross onto the frame! The cylinder has an overall dullness to the blueing to the extent it's mostly patina. Again, it looks far worse with the camera then it does with the eye.

 

[bullmack]

Last one - Upload #4 - the stocks

Until I am able to obtain more info from Roy I think we have to assume these stocks may not be original to the gun. The literature shows the non relieved Diamond Checkered Targets with Adapter becoming available in 1950 - yet this is a March 1948 gun.

As you can see both stock panels are stamped 2244. This could have been done anytime. Be nice to find out what J B G stands for.

The stocks and adapter actually go on/off real easy. Lee must have been on a caffeine high when he did his write up on the set he had

 

[bullmack]

I received the following email from Roy this morning regarding this gun. Obviously I'm delighted

Dennis, I just finished your letter on the K-32 and it is a very exciting gun in my opinion. The first place it is a very early K-32, but to me what is exciting about it is that it was ordered by E. F. Warner, Publisher of field & Stream Magazine, Madison Avenue, New York City, NY. It is not very often that I get to letter a revolver to such an important person, Mr. Warner also ordered a K-38 Masterpiece, a .357 Magnum, and a 38-44 Outdoorsman. The grips on your gun are very important as they are the very early supper rare S&W Target grips. They were added to your revolver probably in 1950 after they became available. It is a great gun and you are luck to own it in my opinion. Your letter will go out in tomorrow's mail. Roy G. Jinks, S&W Historian

 

[JayCeeNC]

The provenance on this gun just gets better and better!