Light strikes with 686 Competitor

[smithra_66]

I would like to get some input on light strikes with a 686 Competitor model. I was in an event that requires about 100 rounds. Maybe five of my rounds didn't fire. Some of those fired with a second stroke. One wouldn't fire at all.

If it matters, I was shooting double action.

The revolver is quite new, purchased new earlier this year, and probably has less than 300 round total fired through it.

These are rounds I made myself with CCI primers, Starline brass, and Accurate #5 powder. I showed the FTF round to someone with more experience and he pointed out that the dent from the firing pin looked shallow compared to rounds that fired normally.

I am rather new to revolvers and their inner workings. What I would like to know is can anything be done to improve the firing reliability? Harder strike? Longer strike? Is there an adjustment that can be made? Do I need a different firing pin? Different spring somewhere? The gun is completely stock and I have never taken it apart.

Edit: I did a search and found some videos about the tension screw being loose. I took the grip off and the screw was fully tight. So that won't help in my case.

Has the gun been altered in any way from factory?

 

[rhodesengr]

The ribbed mainspring is the #1 from Wolff.

So S&W builds the Comp with the Wolfe spring?

 

[rhodesengr]

Has the gun been altered in any way from factory?

No changes. Never even opened it till yesterday. It is completely stock and less than 300 total rounds.

 

[Pizza Bob]

To answer some of the OP's questions, yes, S&W uses the Wolff ribbed (for your pleasure?) mainsprings in some PC offerings. The problem with that is that the strain screw bears on the spring in the recess created by the rib, effectively lessening the amount of tension that can be exerted.

Before you change a bunch of parts, just go to your local hardware store and buy some 8x32 allen head set screws. I believe you want .5" long. Use one of these in place of the strain screw and tighten in down until you get reliable ignition with whatever ammo you wish to use. Mark the set screw and then use purple Loc-Tite to secure it at the marked depth. Should cure your problem.

The extended firing pin won't hurt, but probably unnecessary with the longer strain screw. Also, if you seat your primers below flush, this pre-loads the anvil and thus takes a lighter strike to effect ignition.

Good luck.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

 

[minconrevo]

Before you burn too much time on your new revolver first try two simple things.
1) Make sure the strain screw is fully seated.
2) Run 100-200 rounds loaded with Federal SP primers. Make sure they are seated slightly below flush; maybe .002 to .005" below flush. If everything else is okay gun will run 100%.

If not, you get to go down the revolver not reliable rabbit hole.

 

[3rdgeargrndrr]

1) strain screw loose.
2) inappropriate firing pin length
3) primers problem/ too proud/ exposed to elements and expired.
4) hammer drag. not centered to its raceway Needing shims. Or burr on the frame or sideplate.
5) SW's issue. Send back

 

[Paul105]

As mentioned there can be various reason for light strikes but far & away the marginal length firing pins that get installed at the factory have been the problem in my revolvers.

I have some revolvers with "short" firing pins & they work happily along. Others won't.

The Apex FPs run about .501" & the C&S run about .510" long.

In one revolver I pre-emptively installed a C&S FP which would occasionally get stuck in the fired primer. A factory FP ended up working just fine in it.

I use CCI primers exclusively & I have the factory installed hammer springs in all my revolvers, with an occasional APEX or C&S FP, and I don't have any problems igniting the CCI primers.

.

I installed a C&S long firing pin in a 329 and it stuck in the primers every time.

FWIW,

Paul

 

[mscampbell2734]

Before you burn too much time on your new revolver first try two simple things.
1) Make sure the strain screw is fully seated.
2) Run 100-200 rounds loaded with Federal SP primers. Make sure they are seated slightly below flush; maybe .002 to .005" below flush. If everything else is okay gun will run 100%.

If not, you get to go down the revolver not reliable rabbit hole.

Actually NO.

The first thing you should do is shoot 100 rounds of factory ammo. If the gun functions fine with factory ammo then you need to look at your loading process. If the gun does NOT function 100% send it back, it's a new gun. Don't waste your time and money fixing a factory defect.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

I installed a C&S long firing pin in a 329 and it stuck in the primers every time.

FWIW,

Paul

LOL, funny coincidence, I shot my 625PC today at the range & in (3) out of (5) of my 45 Super handloads the C&S firing pin stuck in the primer.

Turned around & then shot (50) 45ACP +P handloads just fine.

I've shot 100s of 45ACP/45AR though it with this same configuration without this problem for years.

All CCI-300 primers.

Weird.

.

 

[Northern67]

I think you probably had a few primers that weren't fully seated. Are you loading with a Dillon? There are two socket cap screws which bind the primer punch support boss to the frame. loosen these two screws and push up on the punch support and re-torque. This alone should give you a full depth primer seat.

Honestly, the factory Wolff spring in my competitor is super stiff enough to shoot any and every factory magnum load ever put through it. Every time I've had FTF on my handloads, its come down to primer seating. If the press is mounted to a bench that is moving around a bit, that slop can translate to a not fully set primer. I love my Competitor. Use it for Service Match with 38sp loads. 100gn swc with 2.4g of just about any pistol powder for regular matchs and then up it to 2.9gn and a 135g bnwc to make a 120 power factor.

I use it in single action for the Field Pistol Silhouette with full house +++++PP 158gn semi jacketed 357 mag. Its a versatile gun.

 

[Protocall_Design]

Using CCI primers is also not helping the cause. Going to Federal or Winchester will work better.

 

[Vanderbilt]

A few weeks back at my local range a friend had a new model 66-8 which failed to fire about 1% of the reloaded ammo, with CCI primers. First he shimmed the Strain Screw and it fired 100% CCI primers but the trigger pull was excessive. He then changed the stock (S&W) hammer spring for a Wilson Combat main spring and used the stock S&W strain screw. The result was just dandy, 100% reliability with CCI, Winchester & Remington primers, all with a better than original double action trigger pull.

I didn't think the Wilson main spring would have solved the problem as I'd assumed Wilsons would be lighter and thus be worse, but that was not the case, just the opposite. That 66 has fired many 100's of rounds since, with no problems, many of which were CCI primed.

Before you rush out & change the firing pin or file anything, try the easy cures first. That way you can go back to original, if necessary.

As a note, a few days later, another shooting mate had a 686 from the S&W Pro Shop and he experienced failures to fire with CCI primers. He put a Wilson main spring in and it also cured his issues.

Wilsons might not cure all revolver failure to fire problems but they are reversible should you change your mind. It's your revolver, you make the choice.

 

[photoman]

Most of your PC guns are just regular production guns with XLT trim. Your gun is a gun that probably left the factory with light weight springs instead of anyone actually paying any attention to any kind of trigger work.

You more than likely have a light weight mainspring, and those are known for light primer strikes.

This.

All of the PC guns I've bought in the past had Wolff reduced power main springs in them. And all had failures to fire except with Federal primers.

The Wolff RP springs are wonderful shortcut to a "good" trigger but not reliable. Definitely not for self defense.

 

[rockquarry]

I've had many S&W and Colt revolvers in the last fifty years. I've used most, maybe all American-made primers but about 90% or more have been CCI. None of my revolvers have been tampered with and they ignite CCI primers (and all others) with 100% reliability. Primers must be fully seated to work perfectly.

Your gun is apparently new. Consider sending it to S&W.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

There's a myriad of reasons why revolvers can have FTF/light strikes but to me it should never be what brand of primers you're using.

Any quality pistol primer should function reliably in any properly functioning revolver/pistol no matter what brand the primer is.

I'd never stand for one of my pistols functioning with a select brand(s) only.

People like to give CCI primers a bad rap in this area but I've used CCI exclusively for decades.

All of my S&W revolvers have factory mainsprings (with tuned triggers & rebound springs) & I don't have any FTF/light strike issues.

Some have needed to have the factory firing pin replaced because S&W still, for reasons unknown, have short ones in the parts bin that "usually" prove to be problematic.

Replacing a firing pin that's not reliable isn't a sin, it's good sense. Limiting yourself to a select primer brand only isn't.

.

 

[minconrevo]

The ultimate goal is to have a revolver 100% reliable with any properly seated factory primer. Also part of that is to have the lightest, smoothest reliable DA trigger pull. I find a little careful work inside the revolver, likely including some of Power's hammer and trigger shims, goes a long way to the goal. The ribbed mainspring kit, which includes a selection of rebound slide springs, is part of my standard process.

If the revolver is going to be carried it's best to test it out in the coldest temps you will use it in. Springs loose power in colder temps. Test and be sure.

Please use only proper methods, including specialized screw drivers, to do work on your S&W. Brownells sells a S&W revolver screw driver kit. Ditto for proper method to remove side plate.

Now for competitive purposes I run Federal primers as a matter of choice for consistency. I know that they will go bang 100% with any of my "game" revolvers.

Sounds like your revolver is factory new. You can roll the dice by sending it back to the mother ship for some warranty work.

 

[armorer951]

I know this is a "range gun", but use caution when installing Cylinder and Slide firing pins. They are prone to breakage, even in revolvers typically used for competition.

Opinion follows......my recommendation would be Power Custom firing pins, which are much more reliable. Power Custom pins are typically .510" in length.

S&W Extra Length Firing Pin [S&W Firing pin] - $14.95 : GrandMasters L.L.C., Gunsmithing, Ruger 10-22, AK-47, Ruger, AR-15, Ruger Accessories, Gunsmithing Tools and Gun Accessories

 

[BLUEDOT37]

Apex & C&S firing pins

I don't know if C&S used to have a breakage problem but I just checked & I have their extended firing pin in three revolvers, 327TRR8, 329PD & 625PC, none of which have broken with hundreds of rounds thru them & plenty of dry firing.

As I mentioned previously in this thread, one thing to be aware of with the C&S firing pins is that they measure ~.510" long. In some cases this may be too long causing the firing pin to get hung up in the fired primer & slow to retract.

Apex firing pins run ~.501" & to date I've never experienced that problem with them & I have them in as many revolvers.

For a while Apex changed from making their firing pins with a broad rounded nose to ones more pointed, which I didn't find as effective. I haven't bought one recently but I believe they changed back to the broad rounded noses like factory S&W pins have.

Some factory S&W firing pins run .484"-.490" long & are the ones likely to cause a problem (**). Their others run .495"-.499" & have been fine for me. The two factory S&W F/Ps I most recently ordered from MidwayUSA were .498" long & had the broad rounded nose.

.

(**): I pulled the sideplate off of several of my other S&W revolvers recently (adding reduced power rebound slide springs) & checked their F/Ps while in there. A couple had .486", .489" long F/Ps. Those guns have over a thousand rounds thru each & never had a misfire, or light strike, in them.

.



.