M&P 9 2.0 failure to extract causing double feed - solutions?

[LoneStarWings]

I have a 2.0 9mm full size.

I have fired 2,337 round through the pistol over 60 days.

At rounds number 1,985 and 2,093 I had malfunctions. They have been the only two malfunctions of the firearm so far.

The malfunctions were identical. A fired case was extracted only about halfway from the chamber, preventing the subsequent round from making it all the way up the feed ramp. The malfunction is cleared by releasing the magazine and racking the slide, which removes the partially extracted case.

Malfunction at 1985 was a Federal HST P9HST2 147gr. Malfunction at 2,093 was a Winchester White Box 124gr FMJ.

Pistol has been cleaned 3 times so far, including a fresh cleaning at round 2,000. All ammo has been factory, a variety of makes including Am. Eagle, WWB, Blazer Brass, Federal HST, and Atlanta Arms.

Should I be considering corrective action yet or take a "wait and see" approach if keeps happening?

Thanks.

 

[Lee's Landing Billy]

Don't be disturbed....that's what "they" do.

 

[Tyrod]

At one point, many years ago, autoloaders were expected to malfunction. At least once in a while. The rate of malfunction was a calculable statistic. I admit with the advent of the "wonder plastic" starting with the introduction of gun that rhymes with clock, autoloaders became more reliable. Even expectations of older design, all metal, autoloaders began to change. Still, your failure rate is not very high. 2 out 2000+ rounds is a failure rate that at one time would have been the envy of any autoloader manufacturer.

Assuming your extractor isn't broken, then perhaps a thorough and regular cleaning of your magazines may effect some change. Sometimes a deeper than just a field strip cleaning is necessary. In particular tiny brass particles can migrate into the striker channel which can cause a "lazy" striker. This can lead to a multitude of issues.

The M&P 2.0 hasn't been around very long and the knowledge base isn't quite where it needs to be yet.

 

[Bonephish]

I have a 2.0 9mm full size.

I have fired 2,337 round through the pistol over 60 days.

At rounds number 1,985 and 2,093 I had malfunctions. They have been the only two malfunctions of the firearm so far.

Pistol has been cleaned 3 times so far, including a fresh cleaning at round 2,000.

First malfunction at 1,985 rounds fired, leads me to believe you should clean more often. I'm thinking the problem is carbon in the extractor channel. Remove the extractor and spring, soak them, and brush the channel.

 

[LoneStarWings]

First malfunction at 1,985 rounds fired, leads me to believe you should clean more often. I'm thinking the problem is carbon in the extractor channel. Remove the extractor and spring, soak them, and brush the channel.

Thanks, I have tried to clean the extractor well by brushing the area and running a wet pipe cleaner through the claw, but I'll try disassembling it to be more through.

 

[Welshman]

You may also try holding off shooting the Federals and Winchesters for a while to see if there is any correlation between the problem and those rounds.

 

[Bkreutz]

Thanks, I have tried to clean the extractor well by brushing the area and running a wet pipe cleaner through the claw, but I'll try disassembling it to be more through.

A dental pick works best for removing carbon from behind the extractor claw, easier than taking the extractor out.

 

[Wee Hooker]

I have a 2.0 9mm full size.

I have fired 2,337 round through the pistol over 60 days.

At rounds number 1,985 and 2,093 I had malfunctions.


Thanks.

Wow, you keep that level of records of every round fired????

 

[Rastoff]

I have fired 2,337 round through the pistol over 60 days.

At rounds number 1,985 and 2,093 I had malfunctions. They have been the only two malfunctions of the firearm so far.

Hmmm, one malfunction at 1,985, then another 108 rounds later. Then nothing for 244 more rounds? I suspect they are random errors. I agree with inspecting the extractor claw more closely and cleaning it more thoroughly.

It could be chipped as well. Can you post close up pics of the extractor?

Wow, you keep that level of records of every round fired????

You don't? I keep close records of every shot I fire in every gun. I have one gun with 8,462 and another with 17,555 rounds fired. My M&P 45 has 2,372 without malfunction.

 

[palmettostate1]

I don't and can't keep track of all rounds many times I take extra shots at matches. I can guess at an average but nothing exact.

How do you keep exact counts when you shoot matches?

 

[LoneStarWings]

I don't and can't keep track of all rounds many times I take extra shots at matches. I can guess at an average but nothing exact.

How do you keep exact counts when you shoot matches?

When I shoot matches I just make a note of how many shots I fired after each stage. I mostly shoot IDPA so round counts are relatively low, can't require more than 18 rounds.

I generally only keep detailed records when I'm evaluating a new gun for reliability and accuracy, as I'm trying to do with this 9mm 2.0. I'm not going to say my counts are 100% accurate, but probably within +/- 1%.

 

[Rastoff]

I don't and can't keep track of all rounds many times I take extra shots at matches. I can guess at an average but nothing exact.

How do you keep exact counts when you shoot matches?

Keeping track of rounds is easy. How many rounds did you leave the house with? How many are left when you get home? The difference is how many you shot. See how easy?

I'm not suggesting that everyone do this, but it is helpful. By keeping track of rounds it helps with maintenance. I know when to change springs or other wear parts before they fail. For example, I change my recoil springs at about 1,500 rounds and I clean the bore every 500 rounds. Because I shoot several different guns, this helps me keep track of each one.

 

[LoneStarWings]

Well, I tried shooting it a few more times, this time with Speer lawman 147.

Total round count is now 2598 with two more malfunctions of the same kind at round 2437 and 2581 with Speer lawman 147.

Now I'm deep cleaning the extractor, it was pretty dirty. I wonder why my 1.0 .40s never had this problem in 10s of thousands of rounds without detail stripping the extractor.

 

[Rastoff]

That extractor looks OK. Thanks for the pics.

When my M&P 45 was new I had some feeding issues. I got a new extractor from S&W and all my issues went away.

How was the channel the extractor sits in? If it was dirty, that could have prevented it from making quality contact with the rim of the cartridge.

I do find this issue strange. The extraction and ejection function should be exactly the same as the original model.

 

[Bkreutz]

Well, I tried shooting it a few more times, this time with Speer lawman 147.

Total round count is now 2598 with two more malfunctions of the same kind at round 2437 and 2581 with Speer lawman 147.

Now I'm deep cleaning the extractor, it was pretty dirty. I wonder why my 1.0 .40s never had this problem in 10s of thousands of rounds without detail stripping the extractor.

Something looks odd to me in those pictures, none of my extractors have those shiny spots on the tip of the claw and the area immediately behind it. I don't have a 2.0 but unless they made a radical change in design, something looks wrong. It kinda looks like the round is going into the chamber without the extractor being engaged in the groove on the round, and then when it gets to the point when the round is in the chamber, the extractor pops over the rim of the case into the groove. I've got extractors with over 50k rounds on them and they are completely black on those areas where yours are shiny. Just a thought and something to look at.

 

[LoneStarWings]

Something looks odd to me in those pictures, none of my extractors have those shiny spots on the tip of the claw and the area immediately behind it. I don't have a 2.0 but unless they made a radical change in design, something looks wrong. It kinda looks like the round is going into the chamber without the extractor being engaged in the groove on the round, and then when it gets to the point when the round is in the chamber, the extractor pops over the rim of the case into the groove. I've got extractors with over 50k rounds on them and they are completely black on those areas where yours are shiny. Just a thought and something to look at.

I was kind of concerned about those wear marks too. The extractor appears to be indexing correctly on the cases. Either way, if it keeps doing it even after a thorough extractor cleaning, I'll probably return it to S&W.

 

[LoneStarWings]

That extractor looks OK. Thanks for the pics.

When my M&P 45 was new I had some feeding issues. I got a new extractor from S&W and all my issues went away.

How was the channel the extractor sits in? If it was dirty, that could have prevented it from making quality contact with the rim of the cartridge.

I do find this issue strange. The extraction and ejection function should be exactly the same as the original model.

The extractor and the channel were moderately dirty. The first half dozen q tips I ran through the channel came out completely black. The extractor reminded me of an AR-15 extractor that had seen a few thousand rounds w/o cleaning.

 

[LoneStarWings]

So after the cleaning it functioned OK for about 300 rounds. It had the same type of failure to extract at round 2,973 and 3,080 with Speer Lawman 147gr FMJ.

It was cleaned after round 2,598 including extractor removal and thorough cleaning.

That makes 6 times in a roughly 1,000 round stretch where it has failed to extract in the exact same way with 3 different brands of quality factory brass cased ammunition..

I just got a return label and will give S&W a chance to make it right.

 

[Rastoff]

I just got a return label and will give S&W a chance to make it right.

I think this is the right way to go, but if you haven't sent it yet, make at least one measurement.

If you have a micrometer or calipers, measure this distance:

Then when the new one comes in, you can compare to see if there is significant wear. This will be valuable information to all of us.

 

[macadamia]

I applaud your record keeping. I shoot at least 250 rounds each week and have put over 4k rounds through my 2.0 FDE w/ 5" barrel since purchasing it on 2.24.17. I clean it after each trip to the range.

I see that you are only shooting new rounds. I have yet to have a failure with new rounds, but have had a few FTEs and a couple of type 3 failures (FTF with another round trying to load) when using the reman rounds that the range sells.

From my very limited experience, I recommend cleaning your pistol more often.