MISSING 1911A1s

[Rudi]

I saw a blurb, the CMP is missing a "significant number" of 1911A1s from their Anniston facility. What is a significant number? A bunch, a ton, 1000s? Wow, I hope they turn up.

 

[LVSteve]

I've seen mutterings about this elsewhere. I find it a bit of a joke when we cannot account for billions $$$ of stuff left behind in the various sandboxes over the last 25 years.

 

[Puller]

Just under 100. Old news.

 

[ladder13]

At least some people have gone to jail unlike the Medicare Advantage scams where the govt doesn’t even want the overcharges
No wonder the insured “pay nothing”.

Government Lets Health Plans That Ripped Off Medicare Keep the Money - KFF Health News

 

[lamarw]

My random generated number was just about ready to hit when sales were frozen and possibly no further sales.

So yesterday, I won this Beretta Centurion to help my neglected feelings.

 

[Grayfox]

This has been discussed on another forum I visit. There are 98 pistols unaccounted for. There is an investigation under way.
I think they probably walked away one, maybe two, at a time over the approximately 40 years that the Army had them in storage. It wouldn't be that hard to slip one out now and then.
Also bear in mind that CMP receives these pistols in large crates full. If one was missing, they might not even notice.
Another theory is that they may have been too far gone and stripped for parts or maybe scrapped.
And lastly, there's speculation that the current administration is just looking for an excuse to shut CMP down.
All are possible, take your pick.
My guess is that we'll never know.

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

My random generated number was just about ready to hit when sales were frozen and possibly no further sales.

So yesterday, I won this Beretta Centurion to help my neglected feelings.

Too bad it did not have the "Police Special" Badge on it.

 

[Echo40]

This may be considered heresy to some, but I honest prefer the 92 Series to that of the 1911.

 

[lamarw]

Too bad it did not have the "Police Special" Badge on it.

I do know it was an LE trade-in from the Escambia, Alabama Sheriff's Office to Gulf State Distributors.

 

[stansdds]

This may be considered heresy to some, but I honest prefer the 92 Series to that of the 1911.

Heretic!!!!!

I have medium sized hands, I found many of the DA double stack 9mm pistols to not fit my hand quite as well as the M1911.


So a government agency is missing some of its inventory? Like that's never happened before!

 

[AJ]

This may be considered heresy to some, but I honest prefer the 92 Series to that of the 1911.

Heretic!!!!!

I concur!!

 

[pmanton]

Glad I got mine shortly before things shut down.
It's a nice Remington-Rand.

 

[minconrevo]

Back in the days when I ran the FFL books for a handgun manufacturer, the books were checked against the guns at least every six months. That would be done when the place was place was shut down and all guns on hand could be touched physically. The most guns were kept in a vault, to which I had the only access. Those in process were in other vaults, whose access was limited. Never had to report a "lost" firearm.

I would imagine that CMP certainly did something similar, at least when they received the 1911's from the Army.

 

[lamarw]

Too bad it did not have the "Police Special" Badge on it.

I have the box like you posted.

 

[AJ]

I do know it was an LE trade-in from the Escambia, Alabama Sheriff's Office to Gulf State Distributors.

I have what would be considered a "Police Trade-In". The local Deputies were allowed to pay the trade in value of their Beretta 92's and keep them. I bought paid for two. One was for me and the other was my Son-In-Laws, which he kept.

 

[Glynn863]

I got my Round 4 CMP pistol about 10 days before they shut the program down. Rack Grade Colt / Colt.

I'm hoping it's just an issue with S/N mistakes ( for example, transposed or missing digits) between shipping records and receiving records and reconciliation.

I got "detained" by some police once because an apparent dyslexic police officer reported the last numbers in the VIN incorrectly, that just so happened to match an identical car that was reported stolen. It took about 3 hours for someone to go verify the VIN while they were writing up the "incident - recovering a stolen vehicle". I was released with a snarky apology.

 

[stansdds]

I got my Round 4 CMP pistol about 10 days before they shut the program down. Rack Grade Colt / Colt.

I'm hoping it's just an issue with S/N mistakes ( for example, transposed digits) between shipping records and receiving records and reconciliation.

I got "detained" by some police once because an apparent dyslexic police officer reported the last numbers in the VIN incorrectly, that just so happened to match an identical car that was reported stolen. It took about 3 hours for someone to go verify the VIN while they were writing up the "incident - recovering a stolen vehicle". I was released with a snarky apology.

That's where QR codes and bar codes can come in handy. Code scanners do not suffer from dyslexia nor tired, end of shift eyes. VIN's are very long alpha-numeric deals, it would be a lot easier if all VIN's were in a QR or bar code form.

 

[steelslaver]

I have ever had my vin checked

 

[Glynn863]

I have ever had my vin checked

I forgot to mention that I had just purchased the used car a day or two earlier and didn't have a tag for it yet. They took the bill of sale (which had the VIN) and then wrote down the VIN that appears on the dash. Apparently Deputy Barney mucked up the dash VIN calling it in.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

CMP used to have a small staff and relied heavily on volunteers to handle periodic deliveries of quantities of firearms and other surplus from military depots and warehouses.

I remember a 1970s case involving disappearance of a military shipment (via common carrier truck) of M60 machineguns. A crate containing 6 weapons was missing, presumed stolen. Documentation contained only the inventory data on the crate, not individual serial numbers of the weapons. Apparently a common practice within the military supply system at that time. Last I heard was they were still trying to determine the actual serial numbers months later.

I recall a report several years ago that the FBI was missing over a thousand firearms, including automatic weapons. Another report covered a contractor retained by BATF to destroy seized weapons, and the weapons started coming up on the open market.

During the 1990s the Pueblo Depot Activity was trucking thousands of 1911-type pistols to the local steel mill for destruction in the smelters. More than a few grew legs during the process.

If a government agency can't screw things up there will always be schemers and scammers around to help out.

 

[Old cop]

I was issued a 1911 in Nam and was on the hook for that weapon until I left eleven months later. Sloppy record keeping?

 

[mikeruns]

I have the box like you posted.

I bought a Centurian at a show because I couldn’t find what I was looking for….mine is the 96 flavor and I have the full size 96 with the badge and police special markings..wonderful guns.

On the missing weapons issue, I saw at times as a Marine armourer, guns went missing (claimed to be lost) and a report was done which was sent to depot levels like Crane, Rock Island or Anniston…
An interesting one was when an M-16A2 went missing in a rain storm at the Stone Bay range (Camp Lejuene) during training somewhere near the armory….a few years later, there was some road excavation for water line repair underneath, and low and behold the rifle was found under the paving in remarkable condition. My friend was the NCOIC of the armory there and went through the gun and said it was totally serviceable and that the rifle was probably lost in the mud dropped from a young Marine in training and after the mud dried they paved the road over the rifle…it had been just a few years….
We had a pistol go missing from one of our cages in the main armory at WTBN, Quantico and it was a match pistol that we built and probably kiped by one of the overnight duty personal as in my opinion, the cages were not very secure to have non-armourer personnel access…it always amazes me that there are dip-wads out there that think they aren’t taking a huge risk by holding knowingly stolen weapons (felons), especially from federal and military installations…..

 

[lamarw]

It was 98 pistols. They now have a listing of the specific serial numbers missing on both the CMP 1911 Forum and the 1911 Forum. It will be interesting to see if any of them start showing up.

 

[diyj98]

Too bad it did not have the "Police Special" Badge on it.

I ordered a couple of these back when a batch was released.

 

[Jack Flash]

...
I think they probably walked away one, maybe two, at a time over the approximately 40 years that the Army had them in storage. It wouldn't be that hard to slip one out now and then.
Also bear in mind that CMP receives these pistols in large crates full. If one was missing, they might not even notice.
Another theory is that they may have been too far gone and stripped for parts or maybe scrapped.
And lastly, there's speculation that the current administration is just looking for an excuse to shut CMP down.
All are possible, take your pick.
My guess is that we'll never know.

My money would be on the one in bold above.

A lot of times, it's a lot easier to just go ahead and fix something by cannibalizing a junker than it is to requisition the parts, which may be on long-term backorder, prohibitively expensive, or downright non-existent.

 

[AJ]

Since the guns were shipped to CMP, I would start looking hard at who did the inventories. If the inventories were pencil whipped, they could be farther back up the chain of custody. If the inventories were done correctly, then look real hard at who had access to them.

Pieces/parts may have been stripped for other guns. However, that is not real likely as there were a gazillion spare/replacement parts in the system. The frames are the important part as they are what is serialized. All the other parts are considered consumable.

 

[UncleEd]

This may be considered heresy to some, but I honest prefer the 92 Series to that of the 1911.

Good for you. I concur.

Applause welcome.

 

[Yendor 1]

NSA Crane is 30 miles up the road from where I live. Local lore years ago was that a few M1 Garand rifles jumped over the fence. Details were always sketchy. I wouldn’t have touched one of those things with a 10 ft pole.

 

[AJ]

NSA Crane is 30 miles up the road from where I live. Local lore years ago was that a few M1 Garand rifles jumped over the fence. Details were always sketchy. I wouldn’t have touched one of those things with a 10 ft pole.

I trained the Original Naval Auxiliary Security Force at Naval Station in 1988. We ordered and received 50 M1911A1's from Crane. They had been completely rebuilt/refurbished and looked brand new. Great guns. One of those was stolen but that is another story!

 

[AJ]

This may be considered heresy to some, but I honest prefer the 92 Series to that of the 1911.

Good for you. I concur.

Applause welcome.

To each their own opinion. When the 92 has been around as long as the M1911's, I might agree.

I qualified with both in the Corps. I much prefer the 1911. I have a 92 that is a "Sheriff's Department Trade-In", it stays in the safe. Shoots well enough, but is a Safe Queen.