Missouri Bullet Co. experience

In my last 2 calls to MBC I asked for some guidelines on a specific bullet they make because I was having trouble finding a load. Both times I was told they have no load data for there bullets. And worst was no one there reloads.

They make a great product,, but if they do not reload how do they test their bullets?

When a company like MBC produces millions of cast bullets
of generally proven designs over a period of years I seriously
doubt they feel the need to "test" their bullets in handloads.
I'm sure they have their own quality control measures that
pertain to their operations. As they have no control over a
customer's loading practices they are not likely going to
recommend load data. They probably assume anyone buying
cast bullets can find load data somewhere or better yet
has data at hand before ordering their product.
 
Such an angry person... :rolleyes:

I wish you a very nice day, be happy and chill on the anger. :D

It's not anger its passion. Passion that comes from hard work in doing what one has driven to do well at for over 30 years. Its your continued anger over a long delay on an order that you supposedly had with us some years back is the source that cause the problems. A minor issue that you continually use to attack the company.
Your the one that needs the chill pill.
I don't even know who you are and if you were ever a real customer of ours.

Your attempts at sly quips and aspersions will not go unanswered.

I will provide load data and reloading guidance to any who need it for our products.
 
Last edited:
In my last 2 calls to MBC I asked for some guidelines on a specific bullet they make because I was having trouble finding a load. Both times I was told they have no load data for there bullets. And worst was no one there reloads.

They make a great product,, but if they do not reload how do they test their bullets?

There are hundreds of cast bullet suppliers. Not many provide load data. MBC may not, but they have thousands of customers that do, You are limited here on this reloading forum as it is not as active as some others, There is lots and lots of data out there but you may have to exert some effort to find it. A 158 gr hard lead cast bullet is just that, there is no magic formula between different makers, Could be Penn, MBC, TVB etc the data is the same.

Get the Lyman CAST reloading manual.
 
Stop attacking me in this thread there RP. I said nothing about your company or load data as it pertains to you. You are coming very close if not already there to breaking the rules. Your anger seems to be coming from you, not me because I did nothing wrong here. (I'm betting he has been bothering Lee the whole time with this silliness)
 
Stop attacking me in this thread there RP. I said nothing about your company or load data as it pertains to you. You are coming very close if not already there to breaking the rules. Your anger seems to be coming from you, not me because I did nothing wrong here. (I'm betting he has been bothering Lee the whole time with this silliness)

You started this in Post #53 and now you can't handle it? Then next time don't start something you can't finish.
As I said before this is not anger but you are attacking my passion of my lifes work. Perhaps that is something you can't understand because you probably were never driven to excell at anything in your life.

If you can't remember what the Mod told you let me refresh your memory. He said he did not have a problem with us hashing it out on the forum but to stick to facts and no name calling.
I also notice in the absence of your last reply that you are confirming my belief that you ever were a customer of mine. I believe now that you are just another one of those schill hacks that look to smear the company just for the heck of it.

You come into this thread with a sly sarcastic comment and think I am just going to sit idly by and take it every time you feel like doing so?

I don't think so and you would lose that bet as you are 100% wrong. I have not bothered any Mod about this thread. I prefer a good open fight to state my postion.
I asked you to do the honorable thing and let it go as all you do is create a tempest in a teapot with your attacks.
Get over it or be prepared for the next round.
 
Last edited:
Come on you guys. This is a reloading forum not a Hen house. Take it to to PM or something. Clearly there is a conflict between you two but enough is enough. Nothing is going to be solved here.

Move on, the past is the past.

Lets all say the Serenity Prayer or something:)

I agree and don't have a problem with that but the last time we did take it to PM with a Mod involved and I mistakenly believed the issue as the Mod stated was that maybe now it will just fade away. Apparently he and I were mistaken in our belief. I am willing to let it end here if he wants it to end But if not.......
 
I don't have a dog in this fight, but it is going on in my yard.

So, I have a suggestion-
ArchAngel, state your case.
Be factual and unemotional.

RobertP can then reply, factually and unemotionally.

MAYBE each of you will need one rebuttal.

Then, we will all be DONE.
I'm sure of that. ;)
 
Missouri Bullets work great for me. I've had no problem with excessive leading in plinking and heavier loads even with the "Keith Style" bullet and their service has beeen outstanding with shipping prices reasonable and fast delivery. I would not hesitate to buy from them and can't believe I'm talking them up for fear of encountering delays on orders from all the new buisness! Great Company!
 
You started this in Post #53 and now you can't handle it? Then next time don't start something you can't finish.
As I said before this is not anger but you are attacking my passion of my lifes work. Perhaps that is something you can't understand because you probably were never driven to excell at anything in your life.

If you can't remember what the Mod told you let me refresh your memory. He said he did not have a problem with us hashing it out on the forum but to stick to facts and no name calling.
I also notice in the absence of your last reply that you are confirming my belief that you ever were a customer of mine. I believe now that you are just another one of those schill hacks that look to smear the company just for the heck of it.

You come into this thread with a sly sarcastic comment and think I am just going to sit idly by and take it every time you feel like doing so?

I don't think so and you would lose that bet as you are 100% wrong. I have not bothered any Mod about this thread. I prefer a good open fight to state my postion.
I asked you to do the honorable thing and let it go as all you do is create a tempest in a teapot with your attacks.
Get over it or be prepared for the next round.
My lack of comment was not for any other reason that respect for this forum. This thread is no place for your personal fight and I was trying to let it go away. In your post you said the mods didn't want personal attacks yet you still made a comment on my abilities to work or understand words. Shame on you for that and for being disrespectful to this forum.

All I said was I couldn't comment on you because last time you cried to the mods, which is a fact. If that fact bothers you it's not my fault.
 
My lack of comment was not for any other reason that respect for this forum. This thread is no place for your personal fight and I was trying to let it go away. In your post you said the mods didn't want personal attacks yet you still made a comment on my abilities to work or understand words. Shame on you for that and for being disrespectful to this forum.

All I said was I couldn't comment on you because last time you cried to the mods, which is a fact. If that fact bothers you it's not my fault.

Spare me your pseudo concern for the forum because I am not buying it and neither is anyone else. Your comments were removed from the last thread by the Mods and you said in your PM to me you agreed that they should have been removed. (I still have the PMs)
Your statement now in post #53 that you could not comment about something bad was in fact a bad comment against me and the company.
Such a statement is a declaration by you that there is a bad problem but you can't comment on it. What can others who read such statements take from them anything but the negative?
The fact that you said that you tried to let it go away apparently is a lie because if it were true you would not have made another crack at me here at post #53. If you had let it go after our last PM exchange or even after the #53 post when I answed Rule 3 in detail then we would have been done. But I guess you just can't help yourself. You just had to put another zinger in with the angry person comment and once again you are wrong as I am not angry but your portrayal of me as such is just an ongoing series of trying to continually show me and the company in a bad light.
Just how deep must your hatred be that you can't leave well enough alone.
Why should I be put in a position to continually have to defend myself against your comments?

No, No, you don't get to be clever and then fein that you are the victim when in fact you have always been the instigator of these attacks.

I'll tell you how to put period to this once and for all. You PM me your real name and e-mail and the date of your order and I'll bring up all the info and e-mail correspondence that transpired from the time your order was placed to when it was recieved and I'll place in an accurate summary of everything that transpired between us and how I handled the order and resolved your complaint and let the Forum decide who is telling the truth here and whether or not you were treated badly that justifies your ongoing attacks.

Otherwise you keep your comments to yourself and never bother another posting that I place here ever again.
 
Last edited:
My lack of comment was not for any other reason that respect for this forum. This thread is no place for your personal fight and I was trying to let it go away.

AA, you did bring it up again in Post 53.
So, more than 4 hours before you posted this, I posted this in Post # 68-


I don't have a dog in this fight, but it is going on in my yard.

So, I have a suggestion-
ArchAngel, state your case.
Be factual and unemotional.

RobertP can then reply, factually and unemotionally.

MAYBE each of you will need one rebuttal.

Then, we will all be DONE.
I'm sure of that. ;)

So, let's hear it. You have been told you can state your case.

For now, this is between AA and RP.
Others should refrain from comment at present.

For the record, both you guys can expect a PM from me directing you to this post and Post #68.
That way, we all know that we all know how this should play out. ;)
 
Last edited:
We had a bad business transaction and then I took offense to his trying to change history with a ton of excuses. I don't understand why he calls me a shill. I don't have a personal relationship with any of the bullet makers who sell here or other forums. He makes a lot of accusations without basis and seems to escalate every discussion to a fever pitch.

I really didn't think saying I couldn't comment on him or I would get yelled at again would have started all this "stuff" over again. I really didn't say anything to or about him to warrant this lever of craziness.

Lee, as for posting 4 hours after you made your post, I was replying to his post with quotes before I read your post. I seriously didn't think he would go ballistic by me saying what I said in Post #53. I didn't say anything about his bullets in this thread but he seems to like fighting with me...

Disrupting this forum was not my intent and for that I am sorry...
 
Last edited:
We had a bad business transaction and then I took offense to his trying to change history with a ton of excuses. I don't understand why he calls me a shill. I don't have a personal relationship with any of the bullet makers who sell here or other forums. He makes a lot of accusations without basis and seems to escalate every discussion to a fever pitch.

I really didn't think saying I couldn't comment on him or I would get yelled at again would have started all this "stuff" over again. I really didn't say anything to or about him to warrant this lever of craziness.

Lee, as for posting 4 hours after you made your post, I was replying to his post with quotes before I read your post. I seriously didn't think he would go ballistic by me saying what I said in Post #53. I didn't say anything about his bullets in this thread but he seems to like fighting with me...

Disrupting this forum was not my intent and for that I am sorry...

You say you had a bad buisness transaction but you never say what that bad transaction is or provide any proof that there ever was a transaction. The only thing you ever said to me in the PM was that your order took almost a year to get.
I really doubt that but as I have stated on the web site from day one was that certain speciality bullets may only be run once a year so if that was the case it wasn't a bad transaction just a long one.
If it upset you that much then you most certainly could have e-mailed me and requested a date of production or you could have cancelled the order or even if you forgot about it and changed your mind after you got it I would have taken it back and credited your account. No muss or fuss.

I seriously question that you ever did buisness with me as the one common theme of complaints against the company has been the length of time some orders took to get filled. While that would have been an easy factual thing to say thats not what you say. Instead you make genralised negative remarks over and over and over again.
Your continued harrasing here is also done on other forums as well with two other posters that are schills and have never done buisness with me but never pass up the chance to post whatever deragotory remarks whenever they can and they are strong supporters of another company. Most recently the last incident which happened within the last two months on another forum was ended by the mod who told one of these posters they would be banned if they ever did it again. He has slammed the door on that one.
It points to a pattern that indicates you are just one of them with an agenda to hurt me and the company. Thats why I don't believe you.

Many of the issues of lateness were addressed by seperating the speciality bullets from the regular production line and producing and shipping them seperate from the orders with regular production bullets. In addtion a 1500 ft expansion and relocation of the foundry next to the production shop last year and the purchase of new truck and addtional employees have increased our speed of orders to where the number of orders that are in long delays is down to literally less than 10 orders per 6 months out of thousands of orders. The most common three words that new customers say when they get their bullets---"Worth the wait"

I also find it curious that when primers could not be had for almost a year by many or certain bullets were unavailable from Hornaday for 8 months nobody started posting derogatory statements about them.
Does this mean I am held to some different standard?

I have said it many times before but no one wants to believe it. Its not an excuse and I'm not changing history.
The number of closings of bullet casters across the country a few years back left a huge shortfall of cast bullets in the marketplace and as one of the major players in the field as it were we got slammed. I addresed those issues as I outlined above and when you couple that with the general gun buying panic that we have been going thru the last few years it hasn't gotten any better.
Even MB got so slammed that it eventually happend to them and they closed to new customers untill they could address the situation yet at the same time I only saw a few threads that questioned the delays and none of them were filled with the comments like you post here.

Previously in this thread someone said that there are hundreds of bullet casters out there. Really? I'll tell you what, I doubt you could list even a hundred out there right now.

I am passionate about what I do and I am just as passionate now as when I first started actually more so today.
No one wants to see 30 years of very hard work be attacked by careless indiscriminate comments.
If you got a complaint with me, then you bring it to my attention personally in an e- mail or a phone call before you go running off to the internet to post some bad comments. I'll resolve the issue if you will let me resolve it.
 
Last edited:
I really didn't think saying I couldn't comment on him or I would get yelled at again would have started all this "stuff" over again. I really didn't say anything to or about him to warrant this lever of craziness.
A vague statement like that is akin to telling a man "I know something about your wife" and then refusing to elaborate further. People being people, they will eventually imagine the worst.
As I said, I don't have a dog in this fight.
I don't know either party.
I simply hate to see anyone damaged by vague aspersions.
Always state specifics.



We had a bad business transaction and then I took offense to his trying to change history with a ton of excuses.
That is remarkably UNinformative.
I'm giving you a chance here to describe the "bad transaction", yet you seem content to keep dancing around in vagueness.
Spell it out, NOW, or never make another comment about ANY business on this board again.
 
As per Lee's request.

I placed a bullet order with Penn bullets. After several weeks I tried to contact the company and I got no replies. Email was not returned, messages were not answered. I would not have cared be my credit card was charged before the bullets were shipped. It took a very long time to get my charge card credited (about 9 months) and I never did take delivery of the bullets. About a year later Mr Penn Bullets came back to another forum claiming it wasn't his fault because of everything ranging from the price of lead, to broken equipment, to him trying to take up the slack of those who went out of business to his health. All may have been true but a simple email or notice on his web site telling everyone the problems would have made everything better, but that did not happen. This didn't only happen to me but to at least a half doze other members on that other forum and all agreed the problems were not handled well at all.

He also claims he has no idea why I'm upset but that's also not true. I spelled all of this out on that other forum back them and so did all the others. I think (but I'm not positive) because of what he was doing and saying he was banned from that other forum. He knows full well why I'm upset even though he claims not to know. (changing history) It seems that Mr Penn Bullets has done a good job changing history and making it seem like I'm the bad guy. I must admit, I may have aided him in his quest.

As for me telling him my real name and email address, I don't think so!! Why, so he can look me up on his server and know where I live. I refuse to let him use the personal information about me on his server to possibly harm me. I have no idea what he's capable of doing but the way he's been acting causes me to worry. For all I know he could call the police and claim I did something to him just to make a problem for me or my family. He's been acting crazy and I won't expose myself or my family to his anger. It's too bad the others who know what happened to all of us are not on this forum so they could testify to my statements. (although there are a few on this forum that might or might not want to comment)

Regardless of how this works out I will not comment on any post he makes from now on because I placed him on my ignore list. Out of sight is out of mind so it's better I don't see his posts.

Again, I apologize for any disruption I caused on this forum. Like I said, it was not my intention.
 
As per Lee's request.

I placed a bullet order with Penn bullets. After several weeks I tried to contact the company and I got no replies. Email was not returned, messages were not answered. I would not have cared be my credit card was charged before the bullets were shipped. It took a very long time to get my charge card credited (about 9 months) and I never did take delivery of the bullets. About a year later Mr Penn Bullets came back to another forum claiming it wasn't his fault because of everything ranging from the price of lead, to broken equipment, to him trying to take up the slack of those who went out of business to his health. All may have been true but a simple email or notice on his web site telling everyone the problems would have made everything better, but that did not happen. This didn't only happen to me but to at least a half doze other members on that other forum and all agreed the problems were not handled well at all.

He also claims he has no idea why I'm upset but that's also not true. I spelled all of this out on that other forum back them and so did all the others. I think (but I'm not positive) because of what he was doing and saying he was banned from that other forum. He knows full well why I'm upset even though he claims not to know. (changing history) It seems that Mr Penn Bullets has done a good job changing history and making it seem like I'm the bad guy. I must admit, I may have aided him in his quest.

As for me telling him my real name and email address, I don't think so!! Why, so he can look me up on his server and know where I live. I refuse to let him use the personal information about me on his server to possibly harm me. I have no idea what he's capable of doing but the way he's been acting causes me to worry. For all I know he could call the police and claim I did something to him just to make a problem for me or my family. He's been acting crazy and I won't expose myself or my family to his anger. It's too bad the others who know what happened to all of us are not on this forum so they could testify to my statements. (although there are a few on this forum that might or might not want to comment)

Regardless of how this works out I will not comment on any post he makes from now on because I placed him on my ignore list. Out of sight is out of mind so it's better I don't see his posts.

Again, I apologize for any disruption I caused on this forum. Like I said, it was not my intention.

Final comment.
You did not say when this took place so the time period would have been a help. This is not what you told me in the PM previously where you claimed that it took you almost a year to get your bullets only here to say that you never got them. Was that a lie then or is it a lie now? Don't answer as the question is rhetorical.

You claim that I never responded to you by e-mail or by phone but apparently we must have connected otherwise I would have never known to issue a credit. In addition no credit takes months to process an you cannot dispute a charge usually past 3-6 months so I had to have dealt with you and issued the credit. Even if it was a dispute then I can find you by the credit or the dispute as I have a very limited number of those over the years. So are you telling the truth or is this whole thing a continued fabrication that you and your associates have taken a long time to finally come up with this reply. So I am still not buying it without real proof.
As to a simple notification on the web site that was and is still being done to this day thru the PENNBULLETIN which gives a running update on a variety of things within the operation and now even a FaceBook page.
You never gave this much detail (and this isn't that much) on the other forum about the problem and even then I did not rewrite history but explained in detail as I do here the problems that was transpiring at that time and that was several years ago when I was transitioning from a gun show/ dealer market to an all mail order system. In addition you are right that I had health issues but they were major with open heart surgery and cancer and loss of one kidney during that time but I explained all that on the other forum as well and if you had read the BULLETINS you would have known that.
This still did not stop the organised attack by you and your associates on that forum.
Yes a percentage of orders were long in being processed and that still continues (although far less so ) to this day because of the process that I use to get the price/ performance that our customers enjoy.
Its been said before: Quality,Price,Speed. Pick two. I am quality and price and have always been that way and I am not changing what works for the company and its customers. One only has to look on the web site to see the ever increasing favorable customer comments that just keep comming in from top competitors to regular shooters and hunters.

Despite my explanations there and here and despite the many changes I have made in the operation from that time, your continued assaults over this issue over the years is definetly not warranted. We hashed this out the last time in PMs with Lee and it should have ended there but once again you started it all up all over again and that points to something far more than a cancelled transaction. Nobody goes to that length to damage a company unless they have an ulterior motive.

Even now in your explanation as a last ditch parting shot you try to portray me as some angry crazy lunatic hellbent on your destruction. That is why you come across as a schill trying to be clever and pretending to be a victim. If you truly are in my data base I could find you with some work but you are just not worth it.
The fact that I won't see your deragotory comments anymore against me and the company is fine by me. That is untill your little group gets another new name to intiate these attacks again. That's OK I'll be watching and be ever vigilent.
I can deal with real complaints and get them resolved but this certainly has been something else.

Lee, I hope this ends here and deeply appreciate the opportunity you have given in this platform for us to air our sides to this issue.
 
Last edited:
I too like Missouri bullets but the lack of lead bullet diameter kills me. I buy my 357 bullets from them but I need .431" diameter bullets for my 44 mag! Most companies offer at least two diameters of lead. I am sure making one saves in cost but is costing them some business too.
 
That mold set as well as several others have been retired and replaced with new sets. Something that happens with all commercial molds after a period from wear and tear.
Our time frames have improved quite bit over the past year with the relocation and addtion of the new foundry. High demand right now has caused some long delays on specialty bullets but most of those are just about caught up now.

Hi Bob,

I'm currently buying bullets from both Penn and Missouri, and have noticed just as much variation in sprue lines and lube muck with both companies. Missouri tends to show dry spots, whereas you tend to overdo the lube ;^)
All the bullets that I've been shooting from both companies (I manage to shoot about 1000 rounds each month - I realize that I'm not a huge customer) have been very consistent and accurate. I noticed that the softer grade of 200gr 45 SWC's are 206 grains, but I attributed that to higher alloy density.

There is significant difference between the profiles of Missouri and Penn bullets of the same basic design, which should put an end to speculation that Missouri copies Penn's bullets, as some have suggested.

The one really obvious difference, and I know this has been said a hundred times, is lead-time for delivery. Because it takes Missouri bullets only 2-3 days to get to me, I order about twice as many bullets from Missouri.

There is a point in Penn's favor that I must mention. Penn offers multiple alloys directly, whereas Missouri requires an extra query to request a different alloy. This would be awfully easy for Missouri to remedy, however.

I am also looking forward to seeing what Mike at Mastercast has up his sleeve, since he recently announced more and better things ;^)

Sorry it took so long for me to notice your post, I've been away for a while. Hope your kidneys are not getting you down, I've had a couple of stones myself, and it's an awful, awful thing to go through.
 
Last edited:
Hi Bob,

I'm currently buying bullets from both Penn and Missouri, and have noticed just as much variation in sprue lines and lube muck with both companies. Missouri tends to show dry spots, whereas you tend to overdo the lube ;^)
All the bullets that I've been shooting from both companies (I manage to shoot about 1000 rounds each month - I realize that I'm not a huge customer) have been very consistent and accurate. I noticed that the softer grade of 200gr 45 SWC's are 206 grains, but I attributed that to higher alloy density.

There is significant difference between the profiles of Missouri and Penn bullets of the same basic design, which should put an end to speculation that Missouri copies Penn's bullets, as some have suggested.

The one really obvious difference, and I know this has been said a hundred times, is lead-time for delivery. Because it takes Missouri bullets only 2-3 days to get to me, I order about twice as many bullets from Missouri.

There is a point in Penn's favor that I must mention. Penn offers multiple alloys directly, whereas Missouri requires an extra query to request a different alloy. This would be awfully easy for Missouri to remedy, however.

I am also looking forward to seeing what Mike at Mastercast has up his sleeve, since he recently announced more and better things ;^)

Sorry it took so long for me to notice your post, I've been away for a while. Hope your kidneys are not getting you down, I've had a couple of stones myself, and it's an awful, awful thing to go through.


The one kidney is doing fine and thanks for asking. Everything in that regard is doing well with the aid of the excellent doctors in the region.

Improvements in the lube process have been implemented resulting in a cleaner tighter application of the lube. Along with some training of the new guys that let some things thru with too much lube when they get in a hurry. Theres some work being done in some new lube developments that may yield some interesting improvements as well.

A new tracking system is underway in its implementation to keep some orders from falling behind too far. The increase in custom sizing/and alloys is very big now so that has been taking some addtional time as well.

Mike at Mastercast has been busy as well and should have some new things coming up as well. Its been a busy season for all of us.
 
Back
Top