Model 27-2 4" P&R

[444 Magnum]

I picked this pistol up around Christmas. As the title states, it has a 4" pinned barrel and recessed cylinder.

I read the order for the 4" guns came out in 1979 which subsequently dropped the 3 1/2" and 5" models. The order dropping the P&R features around 1982.

Assuming S&W continued using up existing barrel stock, how long was this overlap of 4" pistols with P&R features?

Are they common?

Thanks for any information.

 

[Model29-26.5]

Very nice!!

 

[Model29-26.5]

As far as I have become aware In my one year of collecting and going down the S&W history rabbit hole, The “transition” guns were either recessed or pinned, but not both?
I’m not sure if barrel length has anything to do with the term “ Transition gun”, but maybe there is more to it than I have gathered.
Waiting for more answers….

 

[AudieMurphy]

P&R they were both at the same time and stopped about 1980-81...they were never seperate as far as I know

 

[alwslate]

The 4" 27-2s were only made for a few years. They all had recessed chambers and pinned barrels I believe. Nickel ones are more common than blued guns. I have two blued 4" 27-2s. I think the transition guns are 27-3s, I believe without recessed chambers or barrel pins but may have one or the other as the 27-3s features became standard.

 

[boykinlp]

As far as I have become aware In my one year of collecting and going down the S&W history rabbit hole, The “transition” guns were either recessed or pinned, but not both?
I’m not sure if barrel length has anything to do with the term “ Transition gun”, but maybe there is more to it than I have gathered.
Waiting for more answers….

The 4" 27-2s were only made for a few years. They all had recessed chambers and pinned barrels I believe. Nickel ones are more common than blued guns. I have two blued 4" 27-2s. I think the transition guns are 27-3s, I believe without recessed chambers or barrel pins but may have one or the other as the 27-3s features became standard.

I have always understood “transition guns” to have either/or but not both features. I have a transitional 66-2 that is pinned but not recessed.
Larry

 

[hkcavalier]

Those transition to non-P&R guns (have one feature but not the other) are at best interesting curiosities. I've never known anyone to pay extra for one over an actual P&R example. From what I understand, the change from recessed cylinders was given an engineering change, but not the pinned barrels.

 

[444 Magnum]

Is this considered a transition gun? ...Assuming S&W continued using up existing barrel stock, how long was this overlap of 4" pistols with P&R features?

Are they common?

Thanks for any information.

Everyone seems to be focusing on the "transition" part of my questions. I deleted that part because I'm more interested in the latter two questions--how long was this combination manufactured and are they common?

Thanks for any information.

 

[Retired W4]

Everyone seems to be focusing on the "transition" part of my questions. I deleted that part because I'm more interested in the latter two questions--how long was this combination manufactured and are they common?

Thanks for any information.

I'm betting no one knows, including the folks in Springfield, MA. Five bucks, on the barrel head, right now.

 

[BAM-BAM]

In 1979 the 27-2 w/ 4" barrel was introduced....the 27-3 w/out P&R was introduced in 1982.

Nice gun...... and a nice find!

I've got a "transition" 4" 27-2 with a recessed cylinder but the barrel is not pinned. Mine is about 95%; so nice enough to be proud of, but not so nice it doesn't get carried and shot!!
N886xxx...... per SCS&W 4th ........ N800000 guns.... 1980-83

S&W is famous for not throwing anything away....... so IMHO if they found a recessed cylinder in 1986 or 90 it would be used to build a 27.

S&W kept track of "shipped dates" not "build" dates...... so a gun could be found and shipped months or years after it was built! 27/28s were slow movers after S&W introduced the L-frame in 1980

 

[Model29-26.5]

I see them on GunBroker quite often.
The 6 inch seems to be the most common. 5 inch not so much and 4 inch about the same I guess?
I’ll go on there right now and check.
There are three for sale. One of them is nickel.
Quite a few 8 inch divas majority 6 inch and a few 5 inches.
That seems to be the general case Most of the time from what I have seen over the last year.

 

[murphydog]

Everyone seems to be focusing on the "transition" part of my questions. I deleted that part because I'm more interested in the latter two questions--how long was this combination manufactured and are they common?

Thanks for any information.

Perhaps 2 -3 years with both features. They are fairly commonly seen for sale but as noted the production numbers are buried in the factory records and not accessible. That said, I’d be surprised if there were more than a few thousand 4” P & R 27-2s.

 

[bananaman]

Fantastic 27! Who could ask for more? Bob

 

[lrb1200]

When I was on the hunt for one,
it had to be blue.

I haven't ever seen actual numbers of how many
blue were made as opposed to nickel, but it seems the
nickel guns are seen more frequently.

 

[woodsltc]

Very nice find 444 Magnum & thanks for the pics.

I bought this one from Cabela's quite a few years ago. Per a call to S&W right after I got it I was told it was made in 1981. This is one of the few revolvers in my safe that I have never personally fired (too many other .357's for me to play with ). Don

 

[Bald1]

I don’t know if it has extra value to the members here (I think it should). But if it was written up properly online, with a lot of adjectives I think it would take off.

 

[Engine49guy]

To clear up the confusion the advancement in a revision number generally ( not always) means a part changed that is different so won't work on the previous revision ( not always).

In the case of the late production 27-2's if the order came down to cease pinning the barrels and recessing the cylinders at the same time but they had a quantity of recessed cylinders on hand they would stop pinning the barrel first and continue using up the recessed cylinders until they were gone then advance the revision.
Since no part "Changed" with just deleting the pin the revision did not advance so late production non pinned 27-2's or 66-1's etc are found.
Once the supply of recessed cylinders was depleted the revision advanced denoting the new part ( in this case the cylinder).

From my notes:
Model 27-2 ,.357 Magnum, 4" Barrel,
Blue ,   Serial  N 762052      Shipped June    1982 pinned and recessed.

 Model 27-2 ,.357 Magnum, 4" Barrel, Nickel,    Serial  N 941017  Shipped Feb      1984 recessed but not pinned.

Your serial being between the two I'd suspect Shipped between the two but thats a guess not a fact.

 

[rbmac52]

If I am not mistaken, the engineering change from -2 to -3 was necessitated because the cylinder had to be shortened to accommodate the exposed case heads. The deletion of the pinned barrel did not require an engineering change.

 

[Engine49guy]

If they didn't shorten the new non recessed cylinder at the rear the case heads would be further back and the cylinder wouldnt close ,

The cylinder was shortened to cut production costs.
On a side note a 27-2 recessed cylinder will work on a 27-3 frame and visa versa.

 

[imakmst]

I picked this pistol up around Christmas.

Since Christmas huh? How does it shoot?