Model 41 Chow?

[GaryO732]

One common thread that seems to course through the internet when it comes to reasonably priced ammo for the S&W Model 41 is CCI Standard Velocity. Can you folks think of any others to sort through before I go to the premium blends? I need lots of practice ammo for my grown daughter who adores the used 41 that followed me home. Thanks...

 

[rbert0005]

It would pay for itself to get a less expensive 22 (Ruger) for practice. The cost of the ammo would more than pay for it.

I have found many brands of ammo that will run, but the PC Model 41 guru says to use CCI SV in it, so I do.

It's your gun , so you can do what you please.

Enjoy,
Bob

 

[fyimo]

I got lucky and picked up 500 rounds of CCI SV recently but it's really hard to find it around here in Arkansas. I shoot whatever my Model 41 will eat without feeding problems and there are a few others so that's what I do.

 

[butchd]

I, too, can not find the reccomended load in AR. A friend of mine went to PA a few weeks ago and while there he went to Grice's. He picked up a 5,000 round case which we split. For less than $150.00 for my part, I thought it reasonable. I don't know if Grice's would deal by the internet, nor if they have any left.

 

[oldRoger]

I have had good luck ordering it on-line, the shipping costs are not bad and you can beat local prices if you order a case.
My last case took four months, so when I get to the halfway mark I will order another.

I was having a problem shooting the “take-what-you-can-get” stuff in my M17, I was cleaning the cylinder and forcing cone face every 50-75 shots, I switched to CCI SV and its much cleaner.

 

[H Richard]

Another brand to try is Aguila SE, 40 Gr. Standard Velocity. (If you can find it). It is usually priced at around $225 for a 5000 Rd Case, or $2.35 a box of 50. We've been using it at our pistol club and a great variety of target pistols (inc. 41's) seem to like it just fine. Winchester T22 is usually available and more reasonably priced also. Stay away form Remington, the number of misfires you get will increase the price 10-15%.

In my Mod 17, I have had good luck also with Federal bulk pack, which is a 33 Gr H V.

 

[VonFatman]

Federal Auto-Match

This ammo seems to work best in every single semi-auto rim-fire I own (41, 4-Ruger(s), Sig Trailside).

It's about 15.00/325 at Wally...if you can find it. I've had 20 boxes on order from Grafs since February so it's hit and miss.

Bob

 

[Jimmymac46]

This ammo seems to work best in every single semi-auto rim-fire I own (41, 4-Ruger(s), Sig Trailside).

It's about 15.00/325 at Wally...if you can find it. I've had 20 boxes on order from Grafs since February so it's hit and miss.

Bob

I agree, the Federal Auto Match works very well in my 41 and my 17's. Unfortunately, in this day and age, it is difficult to find, even at Wal-mart. The alternative, as mention by another, is get a Ruger Mark II or III, it will feed nearly anything, is reasonably priced and you can't break it. A great gun for a novice or young person as a learner.

 

[keitht]

CCI high velocity is common here. I have never seen the standard velocity. Should I stay away from the high velocity?

 

[oldRoger]

Keith;
This has been the topic of many discussions. To summarize;
A poll would say the majority is against it, but that leaves a large minority who use HV.
You will not get much if any increase in vel out of pistol barrels with HV.
CCI SV is the lowest cost (usually) of the target ammunition, taking into account price vs. accuracy. For many of us the combination of CCI-SV and the M41 works well and is far more acccurate than we can hold.

Over the very long haul the HV will wear the pistol more than SV.

IMO the hyper stuff especially should be avoided, it won’t help the velocity from pistol barrels and slams the 41 more than necessary.
Roger

 

[GaryO732]

HV springs

My understanding is that if you use a steady diet of HV, you should re-spring for that use. What say you?

 

[oldRoger]

Respringing is a complicated question; there is a discussion on the topic going on right now in this forum about it. If you go to the 1911 forums you can see pages written about it pro and con, mostly con.
Assuming friction to be the same, there is a balance of recoil spring, firing pin spring, hammer spring (main spring), magazine spring, (and arguably, mag follower design) and slide weight.
Changing one of the springs a bit doesn’t make much difference so say the experts.

Here is one thing to consider, the slide starts back after firing and your recoil spring compresses, we assume a stiffer spring slows down the rear ward travel, but then the slide starts forward and because of the stiffer spring pushes it closed faster. So what we gained in the opening slam to a stop, we lose in the closing slam to a stop.

 

[axon]

My understanding is that if you use a steady diet of HV, you should re-spring for that use. What say you?

I would think that is the case.

I just ordered a spring set from Wolf because the recent ammo I have purchased is relatively unreliable and anything rated below 1150fps will not reliably cycle the action (with a clean, wet gun).

What I ordered:

Reduced Power...: 6, 6.5 and 7 Lb.
Factory Standard.: 7.5 Lb.*
Extra Power.........: 8 Lb


What I found with "My" 41 [TFM prefix] and factory spring:

Reliable with Rem Target* and Win T22, both at 1150fps

OK with Rem HV at 1255fps

OK with Winchester Super X at 1255fps

OK with Rem Golden Bullet at 1380 (but I don't liket to shoot this, any HV with the factory spring)

Semi Reliable (but not for a match) with CCI SV 1070fps

Semi reliable (but not for a match) with Eley Club at 1085fps

Not reliable with: (due to jams, misfires or failure to cycle)

Aguila Rifle Target at 1080fps

CCI Pistol match at 1070fps

Eley Match at 1085fps

Eley Pistol Standard at 1030fps

Eley Standard at 1085fps

Eley Tenex at 1085fps

YMMV

axon

 

[Rick-F]

It would pay for itself to get a less expensive 22 (Ruger) for practice. The cost of the ammo would more than pay for it.

I have found many brands of ammo that will run, but the PC Model 41 guru says to use CCI SV in it, so I do.

It's your gun , so you can do what you please.

Enjoy,
Bob

Might a S&W Mod. 22A for under $200 be worthy of consideration also?

 

[HAWKEYE10]

I shoot Federal Bulk in my model 41. Order a spring
fron Wolff Springs, it will work fine. Don

 

[oldRoger]

I have never chronographed.22 ammunition,but most of the manufacturers figures are for a 16” rifle barrel, or so I have been told. I have seen figures out of 5-7” barrels which are considerably slower than the same ammo in rifles.

I too have had little good luck with the high end Lapua and Eley ammunition, mostly bad feeding, I seem to get a wax build-up on the ramp.
Each pistol seems to have some quirks about feeding, all you can do is try to find out what works for you.

I have two 41s, 76XXX & 79XXX mid 60s pistols. . I keep them lubed with Slide Glide Lite which stays on the rails well.

This week I had to replace a worn mag catch in one and while doing that I put new Wolff std. recoil and firing pin springs in both and test fired them afterward.
I fired 70 shots of CCI-SV from each w/one failure to eject, it didn’t clear the barrel extension on the Clark Barrel.

 

[axon]

I have never chronographed.22 ammunition,but most of the manufacturers figures are for a 16” rifle barrel, or so I have been told. I have seen figures out of 5-7” barrels which are considerably slower than the same ammo in rifles.

I too have had little good luck with the high end Lapua and Eley ammunition, mostly bad feeding, I seem to get a wax build-up on the ramp.
Each pistol seems to have some quirks about feeding, all you can do is try to find out what works for you.

I have two 41s, 76XXX & 79XXX mid 60s pistols. . I keep them lubed with Slide Glide Lite which stays on the rails well.

This week I had to replace a worn mag catch in one and while doing that I put new Wolff std. recoil and firing pin springs in both and test fired them afterward.
I fired 70 shots of CCI-SV from each w/one failure to eject, it didn’t clear the barrel extension on the Clark Barrel.

Hi Roger

Agreed, I was just using the factory numbers as a reference point. Probably a lot slower out of my 5 1/2in barrel.

Shot a NRA club match tonight against a team from NJ. Got a 256 with iron sights, factory spring and Remington Target ammo. Not great, but not embarrassing either and no alibis.

Got a notice that Wolf shipped the springs, so in a few days I'll be able to try out those light rounds again.

Saw a lot of 41s at the match and everyone of them had red dot sights. Apparently no one shoots with iron sights any more.

One of the guys gave me a box of Federal Premium Gold Medal to try. Anyone have any data on that round?

Regards

axon

 

[axon]

I shoot Federal Bulk in my model 41. Order a spring
fron Wolff Springs, it will work fine. Don

Hey Hawkeye

What weight spring are you using?

axon

 

[axon]

Here's an update on the Aguila Target Rifle, CCI Standard Velocity and Federal Premium Gold Medal Match.

Aguila:

The Wolf springs for the 41 arrived today and I headed down to the range to see if the Aguila was going to shoot with a reduced power spring.

Big surprise. It functioned with the the 6lb spring.

I had one failure to extract and one failure to feed, but the other 75 rounds I shot functioned acceptably, literally bouncing off my hand as they fell out of the gun. (I probably could clip a coil or two and end up with normal ejection) The accuracy was very very good.

I'm going to continue shooting Aguila as a practice round to see if it has any potential.

A brick costs about $27.

CCI SV:

I didn't think it would function with the factory spring because it is only rated at 1070, but it cycled without a hitch and was very accurate, although not quite as accurate as the Aguila....

A brick costs about $35. (Green Tag costs about $75)

Federal Gold Match:

This is very nice ammo although I found it a little on the smokey side. Cycled well with the factory spring and accuracy was about the same as the CCI (in my 41 with me shooting).

A brick costs about $39.

The really interesting thing was that toward the end of the session I was putting one target directly on top of the other. When I was finished with the last 2 strings, at the bottom was a composite of Slow Fire, Timed Fire and Rapid Fire at 25yds, (all shot with different ammo) that looked like a shotgun pattern. So, aside from reliability issues, it looks like all the ammo brands are capable of tighter groups than I can hold for.

axon

 

[oldRoger]

I almost always shoot with Red Dots on the M41s anymore.
What I try to do is shoot about 50 rounds with new ammunition from a clean barrel (fouling shots) then I shoot two magazines from a rest to check for accuracy.
RWS had a Pistol Match which was the best combo for accuracy and reliability in my pistols, it was expensive and I have not seen it for ages.
I do not see much dif. between Green Tag and SV for accuracy in my pistols, rifles are something else.
If you are willing to buy a case you can get CCI-SV for less than $7/100 but not a whole lot, especially now.