Model 52, loading RN or SWC bullets

[Krogen]

First, I delight in shooting my Model 52 with HBWC bullets over WST powder. The gun is phenomenal; the shooter, not so much. I've often wondered how it would do with typical round nose or semi-wadcutter bullets. Of course, the magazine is too short to do this with .38 Special cases. It's a wadcutter gun, after all.

I thought about cutting down .38 Special cases to allow use of RN or SWC bullets and keep the required OAL. Case walls thicken toward to the base which may squeeze the bullet down too much. Then I thought of the .38 Short Colt. It looks short enough to allow seating of a "non-wadcutter" bullet within the specified .38 Special case length. .38 Short Colt loads "should" be safe in a Model 52. Whether the 52 will feed alternate bullets remains to be seen. Since it will feed wadcutters, one might think RNs or SWCs are easy-peasy. Starline conveniently makes .38 Short Colt cases.

Anybody tried this? What might I be overlooking in this (so far) thought experiment?

https://www.starlinebrass.com/38-short-colt-brass

 

[Sevens]

Years back I thought about doing this but I never got around to trying it. I think perhaps our motivation may have differed a bit — I had thought it might be a fun experiment but was probably thinking that I could save my “harder to source” HBWC bullets.

I never did do it… I suppose I probably won’t. But I must say that I think the idea of getting better results using non-HBWC bullets would seem to be folly, wouldn’t it?

What in the world could or would be MORE accurate in a wadcutter pistol than wadcutter bullets?

 

[minconrevo]

A HBWC bullet will be supported quickly by rifling. A RN or SWC will not, so accuracy might suffer. You might see if .38 Short Colt cases would work.

 

[Krogen]

What in the world could or would be MORE accurate in a wadcutter pistol than wadcutter bullets?

I agree completely! This is more of a wild hair than an expectation of improvement. It stems from some extra time and pondering, "I wonder if . . . ."

 

[Revoman]

Probably won't fit inn the magazine.

 

[Krogen]

Probably won't fit inn the magazine.

Certainly a RN or SWC in a .38 Special case won't fit. That's why I'm considering the .38 Short Colt case. Same dimensions as .38 Special except shorter so the RN and SWC bullets can stick out and presumably fit in the magazine. It remains to be seen if they will feed in the gun.

 

[taz666]

I think it could work out for you. You have to take into account the shorter case with your load. Think using lower pressure 9mm load data and match OAL with a 38 special cartridge. How much pressure can the model 52 handle? Big thing is if they will feed OK. You see those RNFP bullets that are more blunt ... acme sells that style in 125gn and 158gn.

 

[USSR]

I thought about cutting down .38 Special cases to allow use of RN or SWC bullets and keep the required OAL.

I did this. I cut down Winchester .38 Special brass to a length of .900", same as .38 Super brass. The bullet I use is a cast Lyman 358480 133gr SWC which was originally designed for the .38 Super. I seat the bullet to an OAL of 1.135, which fits and function in the magazine perfectly. I have been using 3.0gr of fast powders like Bullseye and WST, and they function just fine. I have yet to chronograph them; perhaps this summer. BTW, I call this cartridge the .38 Special K (K for Kurz - short in German). If anyone wants to play with this, contact me and we will work something out.

Don

 

[Model52guy]

Never thought about replacing 148 gr HBWC. Shot them for years. If it works, don’t fix it.

 

[RWJ]

Several years ago I did try some recent Remington manufacture .38 Short Colt out of my Model 52, and it ran without any problems in feeding or ejecting. I never did any serious accuracy work with it, but it was all 9 ring or better at 25 yards out of my gun. The .38 spl case is listed at 1.155 inches (figure flush seated HBWC would be the same), and the 38 Short Colt loaded cartridge has a OAL of 1.2 inches , but worked fine in my magazines.

One day in the future, when Model 52-2 extractors are no longer available, I may play with reaming the chamber for 9mm Magnum (1.16 case length vs 1.155 for .38 Spl.) and use a 9mm extractor with 9mm Magnum brass loaded with wadcutters/wadcutter loads as a substitute, just for fun.......

 

[Rick H.]

Several years ago I had a conversation with Dave Manson of Manson Precision Reamers regarding an issue I was having with one of my M-52's. During that conversation Dave told me he was using an alternate cartridge in his M-52 something along the line of what the OP wants to do. Unfortunately I didn't write down what he said as I didn't want to venture into the unknown with any of my M-52's, but what Dave said made complete sense to me at the time.

From the company website, Dave Manson no longer owns his company now and he has retired as of 2022, but you may still be able to get in contact with him if you contact Manson reamers and ask him to call you. Supposedly he stops in often to see how things are going. Dave was a great guy and helped me on more than a few projects back in the day, but I haven't spoken with him in several years.

Rick H.

 

[gwpercle]

Go for it ... sounds like it just might work .

also sounds like it would be fun and not very expensive .

This may have been sorta how the idea for the 38 AMU
came to be ,,, trying to improve on the 38 special feeding and functioning in a semi-auto .

Gary

 

[JiminMaine]

Have you thought about just sizing 38 S&W brass in your 38 Special dies and then loading with a .358 bullet using 38 S&W load data?

 

[Krogen]

Have you thought about just sizing 38 S&W brass in your 38 Special dies and then loading with a .358 bullet using 38 S&W load data?

That's an interesting thought. 38 S&W is a bit more rotund at the base than 38 Special, but it might be close enough. Sizing in 38 Special dies would take care of the rest of it. I have some loaded 38 S&W. I think I'll do a plunk test to see if the chamber is big enough. If it plunks, then sized to 38 Special should do it.

 

[JiminMaine]

That's an interesting thought. 38 S&W is a bit more rotund at the base than 38 Special, but it might be close enough. Sizing in 38 Special dies would take care of the rest of it. I have some loaded 38 S&W. I think I'll do a plunk test to see if the chamber is big enough. If it plunks, then sized to 38 Special should do it.

Many years ago I had a Model 33 and used to use my 38 Special dies to reload for it. They shot fine. I also shot them in my various 38 Specials. I loaded some of them pretty hot with 110 and 125 grain bullets.

Let know if it works.

 

[RebCop]

I knew a Bullseye shooter that did this with cut down .38 Special cases for more reliability and it worked fine. He also modified the magazines to 6 shot and shot PPC with it.

 

[hearth]

Have you considered "long colt"?