Model 53 and .357 questions

[Dr Gonzo]

I recently aquired a model 53 (my first smith as luck would have it) and loving every minute of it. It is a 6" in great shape, lower serial number (446-XXX) 4 screw.

Unfortunately it did not come with a .22 long rifle cylinder. What is the best route to get my hands on one of these? I have the factory stainless inserts which seem to work fine, but are kind of a drag to use.

Second queston. I have found .22 Rem Jet ammo at Reeds, which I'm pretty excited about firing for the first time. Question is, where can I get reloading dies? Also, what is the best solvent to keep the chambers clean? From what I've read they need to be very clean and dry to prevent backing out.

The .357 Magnum question. Which model is the closest to the 53 chambered in .357?

Some ignorant questions, but I've been a 1911 man for a while. I'm a little thick when it comes to wheel guns. This revolver has captivated me however.

 

[MajorD]

closest to a 53 in 357 would be a model 19.

 

[rburg]

If you must have a 22lr cylinder, accept it will take some time. And expense. Just keep an eye on our classifieds, and post a wanted to buy ad. Yes, the inserts need to be put in a ziplock, then stapled shut. Its so you are never tempted to use them.

My advice is that if you want to shoot 22 lr, just buy yourself a nice K22. Its not hard to find them, and you'll be a whole lot happier.

As for the solvent, almost anything will work. I prefer old fashioned cigarette lighter fluid. I think its made from petroleum naptha. My reason for liking it is that it evaporates pretty quick.

One thing you need to accept from the beginning is that Jet shooters are reloaders. I guess there are the very wealthy who can just buy and shoot the overpriced ammo. Most of us don't. We also generally load less than factory duplication. You get almost as much noise with less strain on the brass. The recommended bullets are .222 which pretty much means Hornady. Just go to your LGS and get them to order either 500 or 1000 for you. You may need to pay in advance. That solves the projectile problem.

Try Midway for your brass. A couple of hundred empties will last you a long time. If you can't get virgin brass, just swallow your pride and buy Remington ammo when you can find it. The best thing to do is look for partial boxes at gun shows. Often you get a very reduced price and the box still has the fired brass.

You can make your own tapered swabs (the guns came with a tapered swab for cylinder cleaning.) You can buy 38/357 swabs. Chuck them in a drill and use a sharp chisel or razor knife to duplicate the taper. I use one to dry my cylinder prior to shooting. Its not a huge deal to make a show of. Just buy a can of lighter fluid and keep a swab on a short cleaning rod in your shooting bag. Drip some solvent on the swab and do each cylinder. Takes about as much time as it took me to key this. Then you're done with it for that day.

If you want cheap shooting ammo, you can fire cast bullets or cast gas check bullets. Just keep your velocity down to prevent leading.

 

[fyimo]

If you must have a 22lr cylinder, accept it will take some time. And expense. Just keep an eye on our classifieds, and post a wanted to buy ad. Yes, the inserts need to be put in a ziplock, then stapled shut. Its so you are never tempted to use them.

My advice is that if you want to shoot 22 lr, just buy yourself a nice K22. Its not hard to find them, and you'll be a whole lot happier.

As for the solvent, almost anything will work. I prefer old fashioned cigarette lighter fluid. I think its made from petroleum naptha. My reason for liking it is that it evaporates pretty quick.

One thing you need to accept from the beginning is that Jet shooters are reloaders. I guess there are the very wealthy who can just buy and shoot the overpriced ammo. Most of us don't. We also generally load less than factory duplication. You get almost as much noise with less strain on the brass. The recommended bullets are .222 which pretty much means Hornady. Just go to your LGS and get them to order either 500 or 1000 for you. You may need to pay in advance. That solves the projectile problem.

Try Midway for your brass. A couple of hundred empties will last you a long time. If you can't get virgin brass, just swallow your pride and buy Remington ammo when you can find it. The best thing to do is look for partial boxes at gun shows. Often you get a very reduced price and the box still has the fired brass.

You can make your own tapered swabs (the guns came with a tapered swab for cylinder cleaning.) You can buy 38/357 swabs. Chuck them in a drill and use a sharp chisel or razor knife to duplicate the taper. I use one to dry my cylinder prior to shooting. Its not a huge deal to make a show of. Just buy a can of lighter fluid and keep a swab on a short cleaning rod in your shooting bag. Drip some solvent on the swab and do each cylinder. Takes about as much time as it took me to key this. Then you're done with it for that day.

If you want cheap shooting ammo, you can fire cast bullets or cast gas check bullets. Just keep your velocity down to prevent leading.

As usual Dick is right on

 

[Dr Gonzo]

A wealth of information

Greatly appreciated.

Just a couple more questions.

Where can I find some dies? How many rounds can I expect out of the brass using a light charge before they aren't any good?

Is there any real issue using the inserts other than plucking out the spent .22 LR shells? In terms of damage to the firearm that is.

Great forum guys, thanks.

 

[BUFF]

"Where can I find some dies?"

RCBS makes them, as do others. If your large local sporting goods store that stocks reloading stuff doesn't have them, check the mail order reloading places such as Natchez or Graf & Sons.

"How many rounds can I expect out of the brass using a light charge before they aren't any good?"

It depends. If you size them too much and push the shoulder back, you will get case head separation pretty fast. If sized correctly and less-than-plutonium loads are used, I have cases with 5 or 6 loadings through them.

"Is there any real issue using the inserts other than plucking out the spent .22 LR shells? In terms of damage to the firearm that is."

No. The rimfire rounds are dirty and crud will accumulate in the chambers, but like all chamber crud, you can clean it out. Besides, the inserts also get crud build-up and will need cleaning, too.

Other than convenience, the main reason people will suggest you just buy a K-22 is that the .22 LR cylinders for the M-53 are kinda pricey and you often can buy another whole gun for not a lot more than just the Jet's auxillary cylinder costs, especialy after gunsmithing fees to fit it and shipping costs if you can't have it done locally.

One great use of the rimfire inserts is to sucker your shooting buddy. Try loading the first two chambers with inserts with rimfire cartridges, then a Jet round, then another two rimfires, then another Jet round. You shoot the first two rimfires in front of him, then discreetly flick the hammer's striker and hand the gun to them for a shot. Enjoy the surprise he get when the Jet round goes off, but be prepared to catch the gun if he drops it. When they express dismay or shock, tell them, "You wussy!" and take the revolver back. Discreetly flick the striker back to rimfire and shoot the next two rimfire rounds. Flick it back, hand the gun back and let them take another shot with a Jet round. If your friend isn't real observant, you can do this with them for quite a while and entertain yourself immensely.

Don't do this to most women. They will likely become irritated and beat you about the head with the revolver. This may hurt and blood is very corrosive and will damage the bluing.

 

[glenncal1]

If you really want a LR cylinder be prepared to pay up and be very diligent. When they come up for sale they dont last long. My 6" 53 is very accurate with the lr cylinder and the ramped front sight and ejector shroud make it "different" from the average k-22. Up to you to decide if the $$ are worth it.

 

[VM]

Greatly appreciated.

Just a couple more questions.

Where can I find some dies? How many rounds can I expect out of the brass using a light charge before they aren't any good?

Is there any real issue using the inserts other than plucking out the spent .22 LR shells? In terms of damage to the firearm that is.

Great forum guys, thanks.

Dr. G. - Welcome to the Forum!
I sent you a PM about some dies and brass.
Mike

 

[rburg]

I don't know the answer to the brass problem. Just keep shooting it "till it wears out". There are a bunch of variables. How hot you load them each cycle and your resizing practices are the biggies.

Most Jet shooters don't load full power. For a number of reasons, but having the cases back out and tying up the gun are one, and brass life maybe the most important. The Jet is fun even a grain or two lower than factory duplication. Pressure levels vary a bunch, and depending on the cast bullets you select, can go up substantially. Some people here have kind of hinted I'm behind the times (my wife isn't subtle). They've given up on .222 bullets and have moved to Hornet (.223) or even normal centerfire 22s (.224). You don't need to be a rocket surgeon to figure out that a load that is max with a .222 will probably be an overload with .224 bullets. And even if you get away with it, brass life will suffer.

There are also folks who say they resize .357 brass to Jet. Somebody (a manufacturer) once made a multi-step die to do it. I've read where others say its no problem, just ram 357s into the Jet sizing die. I can attest that it doesn't work well. Maybe they've got a trick.

Back to the question of shooting a 357 and a Jet. Mine both have magna grips, not targets. I seem to do OK with that setup. Either way is good, but I'd think you'd want the same grips on both guns. Its easy, but you may end up buying one or the other to match them.

 

[jrm53]

Jet dies and forming dies

Rcbs makes both sets of dies, I have both and have formed Jet hulls with them. Its a little more complicated than just lubing the case and running through the dies, FIRST you need to take a shallow pan with about 5/8" water in it, stand the 357 cases in it (I use new brass) take a propane torch and heat the top part of the case until they show a faint redish cast and then push it over in the water this will anneal the part that you will be forming if this is not done you will lose a good amount to telescoping back into the case. As to bullet diameters I have used .223 dia. but I have made sizing dies for my RCBS lube/sizer in .222 and .223 for sizing my lead/gas check bullets. Jeff

 

[Dr Gonzo]

Very glad I came here, info like this is hard to come by.


Thanks for all the replies

 

[nutsforsmiths]

When I reload new brass, I used about 11 grains of IMR4227 with a .222 bullet. I have no problems with ejecting cases or shooting the pistol. In fact, the most shots I have gotten out before I have had to swab out the cylinder is 36 rounds.

When I have loaded once fired brass with the same recipe as mention above, then I have extraction problems. When I drop the load down to about 9.5 grains, I have no problems at all.

I have heard from others that this is normal when reloading once fired brass.

I have no troubles of any kind when shooting the Jet bullet out of my T/C Contender with the Jet barrel. That too is a lot of fun.

 

[Dr Gonzo]

Those were going to some of my next questions when I eventually begin re-loading.

What charge is the best for all around and what is the safe max?

 

[Dr Gonzo]

Found an interesting link regarding various loads

http://http://www.reloadersnest.com/query_bw_handgun.asp?CaliberID=25&BulletWeight=40

 

[M29since14]

My advice is that if you want to shoot 22 lr, just buy yourself a nice K22. Its not hard to find them, and you'll be a whole lot happier.

Probably the best idea, especially if you are an economical sort of guy.

It can be nearly impossible to locate a .22 LR Model 53 cylinder when you are actually looking for one. Hamilton Bowen can make you a .22 LR cylinder for your Jet. He has blanks. While it will not be an S&W part, most people looking at one of his cylinders would not know the difference. Like anything of very high quality, they are not cheap. One installed in your gun and finished will probably cost what a nice K22 will cost - but you will have the fun of shooting your Jet with it's fancy switchable hammer.

A lot of discussion has taken place over the years about accuracy when firing .22 LRs in Jets. For the most part, .22 LR cylinders in Jets don't seem to shoot along with a really good K22 (in my limited experience). I am not sure why that is, but I have never seen a Jet shooting .22 LRs that would outshoot my 4-screw K22. The ones I have been around did shoot well enough, and I always wondered if they might have shot a wee bit better if the barrels had been new when tested. I suspect after a gun has been fired some with Jet ammunition the throat may start to wear and adversely affect accuracy with .22 LRs - but of course I can't prove it. Just generalizing, the Jets I have been around gave up 1/4" - 1/2" at 25-yards to a good K22.

 

[Dr Gonzo]

I just researched the Hamilton Bowen route, real nice stuff. Very pricey though, $665.... gulp. Thats over twice than paid for the gun.

The inserts are working fine (and tedious, but the price is right) and I came across a box of Jet ammo at a gun store. Looks like I'll be abandoning the .22 lr cylinder and reloading Jet. The Jet is a lot more fun to shoot anyways.

 

[M29since14]

They are a lot of fun, but they can be frustrating too.

As Dick says, the trick is not to insist on trying to duplicate factory loads. A moderate Jet load is still a lot of fun, and a little safety margin when working with your Jet is not a bad thing. Jets have been known to bend their cylinders when abused by careless handloaders, as our Forum-friend Swissman can attest. The watchword in loading a Jet is caution. Proceed slowly and keep your eyes open for signs of trouble. The guns are not powerhouses anyway, so your goal should be best accuracy, not the highest velocity.

 

[keith44spl]

Of course I fancy myself as an N frame kinda guy,
but I do keep a Jet in the truck for fun and profit.

Fun to shoot and she'll collect a yote hide every once in awhile.

Roll my own ammo for it and use it a right smart bit.

Su Amigo,
Dave

 

[Dr Gonzo]

What kind of bullets are those hollow points I see in that pic? All I can find through Hornady is the soft lead tip .222 in 40 gr, I'm leary about using .223

 

[keith44spl]

What kind of bullets are those hollow points I see in that pic? All I can find through Hornady is the soft lead tip .222 in 40 gr, I'm leary about using .223

Dr.

Those are Sierra 40 grain flat based HPs...I have a custom built swaging die to re-size .224 and .223 bullets down to .222.

That away I can load & shoot just about any brand of 40 or 45 grain flat based jacketed bullet that I run across.

Su Amigo,
Dave