Model 581 a few questions about it

[KeithFL]

I just found this forum a few days ago but it is chock-full of great info on wheelguns. This is my first post, and up until recently I've been mainly purchasing blackrifles and semis.

But lately I've been drawn to the pleasures of fine revolvers!

Last year a friend sold me this 581 but didn't know a lot about it. This was exactly what I was looking for (4" barrel, full underlug, .357, large 'trooper style' grips) but I haven't seen a ton of info about these models. Maybe you guys can help?

1- Why isn't the barrel pinned in place? When/why did S&W stop doing this and what is holding the barrel on?

2- It's hard to tell in the photo but the barrel on mine is a noticeably different color than the rest of the frame (the barrel is slightly more 'purple' in tone). What is the significance of this?

3- I compared it side-by-side to a model 10-8 I bought for a friend and can't tell much difference in dimensions or frame size (in fact the .38Special marekd 10-8 actually has a thicker barrel!) What was 'beefed up' on the L frame?

Thanks in advance, Keith

Let's try this photo (click for larger pic)....

 

[KeithFL]

I just found this forum a few days ago but it is chock-full of great info on wheelguns. This is my first post, and up until recently I've been mainly purchasing blackrifles and semis.

But lately I've been drawn to the pleasures of fine revolvers!

Last year a friend sold me this 581 but didn't know a lot about it. This was exactly what I was looking for (4" barrel, full underlug, .357, large 'trooper style' grips) but I haven't seen a ton of info about these models. Maybe you guys can help?

1- Why isn't the barrel pinned in place? When/why did S&W stop doing this and what is holding the barrel on?

2- It's hard to tell in the photo but the barrel on mine is a noticeably different color than the rest of the frame (the barrel is slightly more 'purple' in tone). What is the significance of this?

3- I compared it side-by-side to a model 10-8 I bought for a friend and can't tell much difference in dimensions or frame size (in fact the .38Special marekd 10-8 actually has a thicker barrel!) What was 'beefed up' on the L frame?

Thanks in advance, Keith

Let's try this photo (click for larger pic)....

 

[arfmel]

The root of the barrel where it threads thru the frame is bigger on the 581. The smaller K Frame guns had a flat spot machined on the bottom of the barrel to clear the yoke, this is where the K Frame guns crack with extensive use of hot 125 grain 357 loads.

The topstrap is heavier on the L Frame too, I believe. S&W quit the pinned barrels as a cost cutting move. Your revolver's barrel is "crush fitted" (screwed in tight) like Colt and Ruger have been using all along.

The purple bluing means your revolver may be unsafe to use and you should send it to me for testing.

 

[Jack Flash]

The M581 seems to be a little hard to come by. You are lucky to have found one.

S&W made a lot of manufacturing changes over the years to reduce costs. The pinned barrel disappeared in the early '80s. If this made any practical difference (accuracy, durability) I haven't heard of it.

 

[stevieboy]

The slight purplish shade of your barrel means simply that the blueing on that part has changed chemically over time. It happens not infrequently with blued guns. There are several threads on this forum about guns that have "gone plum." Believe me, it has no effect on the gun's performance nor should it affect your enjoyment of it!

 

[KeithFL]

Gentlemen, thanks for the prompt responses.

Good to know about the bluing, I was afraid it meant something had been changed out or goofed up at some point in the past.

Certainly it's a very accurate pistol to shoot, and the weight really helps with introducing new shooters without scaring them off from recoil.

It seems most people here don't care for the full underlug barrel profile (personally I like it best) but I recognize that 'good looking' is subjective. Other than looking somewhat 'non-traditional', why did this model have such a relatively short lifespan?

The closest current production I can find is the model 686. I can understand the advantage of stainless steel, but do they no longer make any fixed sight models of the same frame/caliber/profile?

 

[RobO]

The closest current production I can find is the model 686. I can understand the advantage of stainless steel, but do they no longer make any fixed sight models of the same frame/caliber/profile?

It is not a current production, but the 681 was the same as your 581, only stainless, and naturally, fixed sighted.

I believe there is an aftermarket rear sight you can buy to make an adjustable sighted gun into a fixed sighted one.

 

[Bullseye Smith]

Here is the one that I have:

 

[blairgarber]

Keith,

For god's sake don't alter your 581! Fixed sight L frames are at a premium having been produced in far smaller numbers than the adjustable sight 586 and very common 686.

I'm sure you could sell or trade your 581 for a 686 and some cash in a heartbeat.

here are a few L frames with a 581 and a 681 in the middle

They are 3 inch 686 CS-1 (made for the US Customs Service), 4 inch 581, 4 inch 681, 4 inch 686 (Millett rear sight, factory patridge front, action job, Sidowski combat trigger and checkered trigger guard), and a 2.5 inch 686+ 7 shot. All wearing PC magna grips (service stocks) with Tyler T-Grip adapters.

/b

 

[carguychris]

Originally posted by KeithFL:
3- I compared it side-by-side to a model 10-8 I bought for a friend and can't tell much difference in dimensions or frame size (in fact the .38Special marekd 10-8 actually has a thicker barrel!) What was 'beefed up' on the L frame?

Asides from what arfmel said, the L frame cylinder is larger in diameter, which is why S&W is able to offer it in a 7-shot configuration. If you flip open the cylinders of a K frame and an L frame and hold them side-by-side, the difference is readily apparent. (Please resist the temptation to simultaneously flick the cylinders shut with your wrists, aim the guns, and spout some Hollywood-action-hero one-liner.*)

The L frame was purposefully designed to duplicate the ergonomics of the K frame. Everything from the cylinder shield back is basically the same, as is the relationship of the trigger to the grip frame. Even the stocks are the same; they will interchange perfectly. Consequently, when you pick up an L frame, you won't necessarily get a "this gun is bigger!" feeling like going from a K frame to an N frame.

However, if you take a caliper and start measuring the frame dimensions, you're going to find that almost everything on an L frame from the recoil shield forwards is at least a smidgeon bigger than the same part on a K frame.

{EDIT} *If you must... IMHO the one-liner should be: "You think that 9mm is high-capacity? I'll show you high capacity!" BLAM-BLAM-BLAM-BLAM x 12...

 

[carguychris]

Originally posted by blairgarber:
For god's sake don't alter your 581! Fixed sight L frames are at a premium having been produced in far smaller numbers than the adjustable sight 586 and very common 686.

+1; even though the books say the 581 and 681 sell for a slightly lower price than the 586 and 686, my observation at gun shows and gun dealers is that the reverse is true!

BTW blairgarber, your photo is making me jealous... I love wood stocks and T-grips.

 

[Bullseye Smith]

You are right carguy, you can get more for a 581 or 681 than the others. Less were made and more what them, I guess that is the way she goes.

 

[sadp40]

i loves my 681. i just wish i could find out more about it. i is a 4-incher w/dark rosewood grips slightly smaller than the big target grips, the weird thing is the finish is kinda more like rugers target gray. but i loves my weird 681.

 

[shawn mccarver]

Originally posted by KeithFL:
I just found this forum a few days ago but it is chock-full of great info on wheelguns. This is my first post, and up until recently I've been mainly purchasing blackrifles and semis.

But lately I've been drawn to the pleasures of fine revolvers!

Last year a friend sold me this 581 but didn't know a lot about it. This was exactly what I was looking for (4" barrel, full underlug, .357, large 'trooper style' grips) but I haven't seen a ton of info about these models. Maybe you guys can help?

1- Why isn't the barrel pinned in place? When/why did S&W stop doing this and what is holding the barrel on?

They stopped to cut costs and it was not necessary. Colt and Ruger have never done it with their DA revolvers.

2- It's hard to tell in the photo but the barrel on mine is a noticeably different color than the rest of the frame (the barrel is slightly more 'purple' in tone). What is the significance of this?

Sometimes blueing does this. No biggie. If you don't like it, send it to S&W for re-blue. They do a great job and it is not expensive.

3- I compared it side-by-side to a model 10-8 I bought for a friend and can't tell much difference in dimensions or frame size (in fact the .38Special marekd 10-8 actually has a thicker barrel!) What was 'beefed up' on the L frame?

The frame on the L frame is slightly "taller" to allow more room under the barrel for thicker threads and forcing cone area. The L frame guns are incredibly strong, perhaps not as much as an N frame .357, but they are far more comfortable as the L frame grips are the same as the K frame.

Thanks in advance, Keith

Let's try this photo (click for larger pic)....

 

[Jazman]

That's a beauty, I agree about not changing it or the sights. 581's are a rare find and great guns.

 

[ServiceGun]

Other than looking somewhat 'non-traditional', why did this model have such a relatively short lifespan?

The 581 was introduced in the 80's as a fixed sight gun for the police market. Unfortunately this was just about the time police departments started to switch to hi-cap 9mm auto's. It didn't have the adjustable sights most target shooters want and was priced higher than the Models 10/13/64/65, which made it less popular with the budget minded home defense buyer who didn't mind fixed sights.

 

[bodyarmorguy]

Keith,

For god's sake don't alter your 581! Fixed sight L frames are at a premium having been produced in far smaller numbers than the adjustable sight 586 and very common 686.

So.....you are saying that I should not consider sending my 581 to the Performance Center and request that they put the same sights and finish as the Night Guard series?

 

[johnny3]

Interesting thread, this m581 appears unfired.

 

[WVfishguy]

So.....you are saying that I should not consider sending my 581 to the Performance Center and request that they put the same sights and finish as the Night Guard series?

To quote Fred Sanford: "This is the big one! I'm comin' to join you Elizabeth!"

Here's a shot of our 586 no dash (a 581 with adjustable sites) and it's a better shooter than our 1968 vintage Colt Python.

The wife and I go to a lot of gun shows. We've seen a total of one 581, and had to pass it by (they would not sell to an out-of-stater). To screw up a classic (and great shooter) like a 581 is sacrilege at best, a mortal sin at worst.

 

[deanodog]

Here is the stainless version of the 581. 681