Modernizing a Model 59 or 459 - Questions

[BigBoss3006]

Hey all,

This is my first real post here, hopefully this doesnt ruffle too many feathers.

I picked up a 39-2 a while ago for the purposes of cloning a Mk22 Mod 0 hushpuppy. I absolutely fell in love with the 39, and i decided i'd like to take on another project, which is to modernize a 59 series. This includes a rail for a light (SF X300), a threaded and compensated barrel, and an optics cut slide.

I feel like i've worked out solutions to most of these, but now im stuck on which base gun to use. I like the first gen guns, and parts seem very plentiful compared to the second gen guns, however i like the firing pin safety on the second gen guns and the fact that you can make third gen parts work on them.

My questions are as follows:

1. Is the lack of firing pin safety a legitimate concern for the 59's? I plan to shoot this frankengun a fair amount.

2. What parts between the 59 and 459 are not compatible?

I would love to get some opinions on this, and if anyone has some insight as to which model they would use for such a project. I understand that older S&W autos are collectable, and i'm not going to do this to any gun that is in good condition to start with, so as not to desecrate the collectability of one

 

[VASCAR2]

I own a model 39-2 a 439 and was issued a 439, 6904 and 5904. I also owned an early 469. In my opinion the second generation 459 is more reliable than the model 59. I've never seen an optics cut done to a S&W 59, 459 or 659. If there is a will there is a way but I think the fixed sight 459 slide would have more room for a red dot sight.

I think S&W changed the barrel feed ramp geometry to improve feeding in the Gen 2 pistols. The Gen 2 pistols could be ordered with an ambidextrous safety/decocker whereas I never saw a 59 with the ambi safety. When I went through a Police Academy Officers encountered more issues with model 59 that I saw with the second generation S&W 9 mm pistols.



S&W Performance center had a rail they attached to the dust cover on some frames until a design with a pic rail was machined in manufacture on some PC models.

 

[BigBoss3006]

Having done the measurements, i believe the 59 slide or either model of 459 slide would leave enough room to be milled for an RMR or ACRO plate. Its not as good as a dedicated footprint but it will be better than the only other options i've come across. I've got a competent machine shop ready for the work too thankfully, and they have lots of experience doing cuts on harder slides like CZ75's.

A rail being contoured and mounted to the dust cover seems reasonably straight forward, either being screwed into embedded timeserts or by being cold welded in some manner.

I really wanted a 59 just because i think they have more charm, but i think now the 459 makes more sense for a project gun thats destined to be shot a lot. If it ends up being reliable, i may make it a carry gun, and i would strongly prefer the firing pin safety in that case

 

[S-W4EVER]

I guess I'm a dinosaur. I bought my Model 59 new in 1977. I sent it back to the factory in response to a couple recalls and I now khave several other autopistols but none are any better, without any modification than that old 59.

 

[VASCAR2]

I have shot a couple different model 59's and was around several different 59's in the Academy. A Friend has a nickel 59 and it is as reliable and accurate as any pistol I've shot. Everyone who shoots that 59 wants to buy it. Several Deputies I knew carried model 59's and were satisfied with their performance.

Some 59's just seemed to be less reliable and the ones used by the Academy had who knows how many thousands of rounds through them. Some functioning issues could've been ammunition related. Back in 1977 the 9 mm wasn't near as popular as it is today. I think a lot ammo shot at the academy were reloads.

I don't remember there being much difference in the grip of a model 59 compared to a 459. Overall I think on average the second generation 9's are better than first generation. I think first generation S&W might be more collectable than second generation.

 

[murphydog]

I think you could do the modifications as you described, but getting a factory rail equipped pistol and having the optic cut done might be a more direct route.

 

[BigBoss3006]

I ended up getting a 459 in great mechanical condition thats missing half of its finish on the frame. Its got the short XM9 trials extractor, making milling for an optic a bit easier. At 380 out the door, i feel i got a good deal.

I believe i found the best solution to the light rail. I've opted to use a Dawson style 1911 rail and have it fitted to the 459. Having seen another user here fit a Novak 1911 rail to a 3rd Gen, i believe it shouldnt be an issue. The Dawson rails are much lower profile and look far more original than the Novak 1913 rails. Only downside is it only works with the X300's, but the X300U and X300T are still the best pistol lights on the market in my opinion. Picture below of the Dawson style rail

 

[Sevens]

At no point did you consider doing this on a 559 to start with a steel frame?

 

[BigBoss3006]

At no point did you consider doing this on a 559 to start with a steel frame?

I considered it. 559's are a fair amount heavier and also generally more collectable. I didnt want to mess with something that had a lot of collectors value.

Dawson rails are also aluminum, and being bedded to the gun at both the dustcover and trigger guard should eliminate any additional stress being added to the frame. Theoretically, it would have been easier with a 559 and just welding the steel Novak rail

 

[stansdds]

Good luck finding a threaded barrel for any generation of the S&W metal receiver 9mm pistols. Personally, given all the modern pistols out there with threaded barrels, accessory rails, night or fiber optic sights, I would not butcher an old S&W pistol.

 

[BigBoss3006]

Good luck finding a threaded barrel for any generation of the S&W metal receiver 9mm pistols. Personally, given all the modern pistols out there with threaded barrels, accessory rails, night or fiber optic sights, I would not butcher an old S&W pistol.

ADCO can do threaded extensions for these, they've done them for a while. The 459 i got is reasonably rough, so i dont feel uncomfortable breathing new life into it. Its not for everyone, and i totally understand that perspective

 

[stansdds]

ADCO can do threaded extensions for these, they've done them for a while. The 459 i got is reasonably rough, so i dont feel uncomfortable breathing new life into it. Its not for everyone, and i totally understand that perspective

If it's in rough shape, ok. I suppose we will soon be seeing some gun p0rn...errrr... pictures?

 

[Borderboss]

I'm interested to see what you end up doing on the slide cut for the RMR. I have a 5906 that I want to do that to, but haven't pursued it yet.