My Trophy Gun Thesis gets noticed

RM Vivas

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In this post: http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...trophy-guns-update.html?662944=#post141292204 I explained how the senior level capstone class in my pursuit of a BA in history required me to come up with some sort of thesis.

I chose to look at NYPD Trophy Guns, the Bloomingdale Trophy in particular, and determine whether Trophy Gun winners were more likely than their peers to advance faster and higher up the Department ladder.

I wrote the thesis, handed it in and got an A in the class.

That was Fall 2021.

Earlier this month I received this email from my class instructor:
sympemailinvite.jpg


Now, you have to understand that public speaking is a bit scary for me.

Against my better judgement though, I figured I'd do it. I'm contemplating an MA in History and this might be good application fodder.

I said I'd do it and a few days later these showed up in my email:

sympflyer.jpg


sympprogram.jpg


Oh ****; now I'm committed to this!

So I buckled down and banged out a 13-minute or so presentation, ginned up some powerpoint slides and hoped for the best.

Title card of my slideshow:

sympopeningslide.jpg


So I sat at the podium, watched the other presentations and politely clapped when they were done. As each presenter sat down it was one presenter closer to being my turn.

Finally I got introduced, did my presentation, didn't poop, puke or pee myself and sat down.

Somewhat surprisingly, most of the Q&A's directed to the presenters were directed at me.

Here is a shot of me pontificating:

symppontificating.jpg


The Q&A went pretty well I thought.

Someone asked me about how the whole Trophy Gun project came to be and I thought my telling of the story was pretty good. If I can trim the video and figure how to post/link it I'll do so; I think I came across halfway decent and it is kind of a funny story.

Anyway, the symposium ended, I wiped out the snack buffet and slipped out the fire exit with my computer case loaded with bags of chips and 8-ounce mini-cans of soda.

Fast forward to Monday.

I swing by the History department and the first thing the secretary says to me is "Congratulations!".
"Huh? For what?"
"Have you checked your email?"
"Uh, no."
"Go check it, you won."
I set up my laptop, hit my university email account, and.......:

sympwinners.jpg


Hey, how about that!

There is an award ceremony Thursday that I'm going to.

I'm hoping that this will be a little blurb I can put in my Master application that might help. Also, I'm hoping it'll catch the eyes of someone who might be able to steer my towards some kind of grant/scholarship/foundation sort of thing.

And for people wondering, yes the award comes with a check but I am donating that back to the History Department; I'm financially more secure than I was when I started college decades ago so maybe they can get that money to some guy who is in the sort of straits I once was as a freshman.

RM Vivas
 
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I add my congratulations on your superior research, presentation, and win.

Now, then. What strikes me most is the sincere interest in guns among the academics: both profs and seminar attendees. Anymore that's an arena generally considered as part of the anti-gun crowd. It's truly heartening to see the professor's invitation for you to present your thesis and the response you've received.

A hearty well-done for bringing the topic into the public light.
 
What a great topic and an interesting bit of research thanks for sharing it with us.Congratulations RMVivas.
 
RM
I knew you could do it!!!!!!!
Have you thought about doing it at the Annual in Concord, NC this June?

Severely tempting.

If I was going to go and do presentation I think I'd try to keep it S&W specific; either NYPD Policewomens M36-1 HB revolvers or NYPD Victory revolvers. Added benefit to these topics would be that I have organized the serial number data nd could generate letters and supporting documents on site in exchange for drinks.

Unfortunately work wont let me -this- year but next year..........
 
This is heartening, not just for the success you had but that a theme involving firearms would be so well received in the usually anti-gun world of academia. In my 46 years in education, interest in guns of all types was somewhat of a dirty little secret. While many of us were actually pro-gun, we had to keep it to ourselves and our known associates since the liberal contingent would be so vocally against all things "gunnish". It's gratifying to see your work so well received. Congratulations and best of luck as you continue your studies.
Green Frog
 
That's very impressive. Congratulations on your award.
I too am surprised how well it was received, would never guessed that it would be. Gives me hope in todays world.
Very well done!
 
Very excited for you. Really enjoyed my one sociology course. I would tend to think that competition in one category leads to a more competitive nature in general.
 
Congratulations!

This is very much the path I walked for my history degree, which I finally earned in December 2018. Like you, I did a few of these seminars and always had a good time. Defending my thesis was another story (there's a two drink minimum if I'm going to recount that debacle), but all's well that ended well and I ended up getting my defense committee's signatures.

Good on you if you can handle a graduate degree. I don't have the stomach for it right now.

Mike
 
Congratulations!

It's something I always wanted to do, but was afraid to due to the hyper competitive nature of the history field, many bright individuals, few jobs (this was the early '90's).

What are your plans now? More out of curiosity than anything.

I'm pleased to see that a firearms related thesis was not scorned. Maybe times are changing. In anything that had to do with creative writing or history in college, I never mentioned firearms whatsoever, as I felt the need to actually graduate. Never mind that if it wasn't for firearms, the United States would not exist in its present form today.
 
If you won't be able to make the symposium.. Have you considered an article for the "JOURNAL"????
JIM...................

Oh yes! I'm working on a piece on NYCPD Victory revolvers that will list about 950 by serial number and list their date of sale and t whom they were sold.

I have a short piece on NYCPD 2 inch Model 10's (about 400 pieces) with similar data.

Ditto the outline for a piece on PoliceWomens Bureau guns.

Lots of stuff under construction right now.
 
Congratulations!

A question. Were the guns awarded for firearms proficiency or for outstanding proficiency in training overall?

Bloomingdale Trophy - Highest overall average
Police Commissioners Trophy - 2nd highest overall average
Chief Inspectors Trophy - 3rd highest overall acerage
Mayors Trophy - Best act of police work while still in training
Hershfield Trophy - Best score in physical training
Masback Trophy - marksmanship
Kelrick Trophy - Most deserving Poliocewoman
Celia Relin Trophy - same as Kelrick, only awarded a few times
Keeler Trophy - Dont recall. Only awarded a couple times.
 
OP, I think it was Steve Jobs that said: "What would you do if you had no fear." Very cool. It is great that you are paying it forward; history does not get the donations (and sciences, et cetera) as sports, for example.
 
Robert

Congratulations on winning, and hope you do well in your graduate studies.

I have two questions regarding the data. First, is it possible to discern where, in the progression of promotions, winning a trophy is the most significant? Ie, in terms of promotion to CPT and above, is it more important to win while at the patrolman level, or at the DET level, for example? Second, which of the five levels has the highest percentage of trophy winners, winning while at that level? Ie, do patrolman win more trophy's than detectives? This might be synonymous with asking which of the five levels has the best shooters?

Regards, Mike Priwer
 
Robert

Congratulations on winning, and hope you do well in your graduate studies.

I have two questions regarding the data. First, is it possible to discern where, in the progression of promotions, winning a trophy is the most significant? Ie, in terms of promotion to CPT and above, is it more important to win while at the patrolman level, or at the DET level, for example? Second, which of the five levels has the highest percentage of trophy winners, winning while at that level? Ie, do patrolman win more trophy's than detectives? This might be synonymous with asking which of the five levels has the best shooters?

Regards, Mike Priwer

Absolutely excellent question.

The ranks of SGT, LT and CPT were based on civil service exams. A Trophy Gun (and certain other awards) granted a recipient a few extra points on that civil service exam.

Once you get above CPT promotions were based on appointment. While one was supposed to receive appointment on merit, undoubtedly there was a 'who you know' element.

I think Trophy Guns were most useful in getting a man up from PTLMN to one of the civil service exam ranks simply because if there were 75 SGT slots open and you scored the 80th position, the 'bonus points' might have bumped you up to the 74th position and you squeak by.

At the higher levels, I think that the Trophy Gun contributed less materially (no points were needed) but added to the cachet of a mans reputation/career biography.

These are just my opinions. Your mileage may vary.

Enough people have asked me about this that I have been meaning to go back and re-evaluate the ranks attained. The problem is the department manning charts lump CPT and above as a single catagory. Even if I broke down the actual numbers of Deputy Inspectors, Inspectors, Deputy Chief Inspectors, etc. I'd have nothing to compare them to because the manning charts cut off at CPT.

RM Vivas
 
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