Nervous about Concealed carry

Most folks let their (varied) experiences inform their opinions; not everyone needs to agree.

Perhaps, however, the Constitution is pretty clear, “… the right to own and bare arms shall not be infringed.”

No right is absolute, and there is your debate. Far better to side with the citizenry than the government, imo.
 
Find and read your state's weapon laws. Read them again, rinse and repeat 'till they make sense.

I could look them up (or not) and tell you what they were but you'd be a damn fool to believe me. You have to understand them. There are fools, some of them well meaning, that will spout chapter and verse about what you can do but often they are wrong. It's your butt on the line, not theirs.

Get a copy of The Law of Self Defense by Andrew F. Branca, read it. If you can't find that, Deadly Force by Massad Ayoob covers much of the same material.

Check your ego at the door. When carrying you have to make every effort to avoid conflict.
 
I like a model 36 for pocket carry. Yes,
all 5 chambers are loaded.
 

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If you are nervous about CC, AND live in a repressive state, you should not be carrying.
You will be feeling around touching the gun and holster like a newbie every few seconds, and those actions will be a dead giveaway to even a not so observant cop that you are armed. And, depending on the jurisdiction, you may be roughed up a little and detained until they can determine that you are legal.
You don’t need that.
 
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You’ll be fine. If you’re not comfortable with a round in the chamber, don’t load one until you are comfortable.

You’ve presumably lived your whole life up to this point without needing to do a quick draw and gun down some hoodlums. The odds are astronomically in your favor you’ll go the rest without doing it either.

Good on you for preparing for it, anyway. Go at your own speed. Find a trusted friend or relative to help you out. Beware of professional “instructors” who are really just trying to sell you insurance you don’t need.

Good luck!
 
Unfortunatly?
What makes it unfortunate that law abiding citizens can legally do what criminals are doing illegally? Even if they are not vetted to YOUR comfort and trained to YOUR standards.

"some yahoo with poor judgement"
JMHO you're the one with "poor judgement" and self-righteous to boot. What makes you think that everyone that avails themselves to constitutional carry has poor judgement? Oh thats right they haven't ask your (or someone like you) permission to exercise "mah rights…”

"who has not (yet) been convicted of a crime"
I could very well be wrong, but I suspect you're a LEO (someone that ENFORCES the law/ US VS THEM) as opposed to a Police officer (someone that helps police the community.) That sir is a pretty G.D. arrogant statement. May I not so politely say bugger off.:mad:

Ironically enough I left law enforcement as it was clear it was moving away from what i felt it needed to be. Instead of order maintenance and values based on the concept of law enforcement existing to “to serve and protect” I saw it going down the rat hole of militarizing with attitudes of “us versus the civilians” and “whatever it takes to get home tonight”, with a increasingly frequent sprinkling of “we write the reports”.

The “Unfortunately” in my previous post was just a much a reflection on the changing values I’ve seen in this country over the last 40 years. Way too many Americans have become increasingly less tolerant of those different than themselves, and many of those same individuals as well as others have forgotten that each and every right we have is accompanied by a commensurate degree of responsibility to wield that right in a manner that does not infringe on the rights of others.

Now, we are overlaying constitutional carry on to values that show ever diminishing respect for the rights of others.

I was born and raised in SD and spent about half my adult life there. About 1 in 11 adults had a concealed carry permit, even before they adopted Constituional carry. The permit fee was $5 for decades and then double to $10. It took about a week from application to permit.

SD added a couple of advanced permits with greater fees and training requirements, but those were tailored for residents who wanted improved reciprocity with other states and in particular it’s neighbor MN. But the basic $10 permit was still available.

SD didn’t need a Constitutional carry permit. Now and in the near future, I don’t think it will be a problem in SD as it’s still a state where personal responsibility and getting along with your neighbors are still fairly strong values. That’s ironically because of the high probability of the person someone provokes being armed. Not surprisingly crime rates, outside the two major metropolitan areas and a couple of the reservations, are still low.

That’s not the case in some other state where Constitutional carry has become the law. In those states the simple reality is that Constitutional carry increases the potential for some one to be carrying a gun who might a lot be less responsible than someone with a concealed carry permit.

The saving grace for concealed carry permit holder will be the data base connections in many states between concealed carry permits, VDLs, and vehicle tags. It’ll give officers a heads up that the driver might have a concealed carry permit and be less of a risk of he or she is carrying a gun.

I accurately called the ball on where law enforcement was headed and I don’t like here it’s at as a profession or what it’s become in many departments - but don’t for a minute think I don’t fully support officer safety and take a hard looked at increase threats to officers.
 
BB57,

I left law enforcement 3 decades ago when the militarization of Police Departments started rearing it’s ugly head. Departments started higher in bullies and giving them badges. A couple of times it was hard not to arrest a cop for stepping over, hell, well past the line, so I turned in my badge and revolver. I have not regretted it one moment.

Is carrying a firearm a God given right? I am not sure. Is it a Constitutional right? Yes, BUT RIGHTS COME WITH RESPONSIBILITIES. Too often Yahoo!’s make the rest of us look bad.

Kevin
 
Ironically enough I left law enforcement as it was clear it was moving away from what i felt it needed to be. Instead of order maintenance and values based on the concept of law enforcement existing to “to serve and protect” I saw it going down the rat hole of militarizing with attitudes of “us versus the civilians” and “whatever it takes to get home tonight”, with a increasingly frequent sprinkling of “we write the reports”.

The “Unfortunately” in my previous post was just a much a reflection on the changing values I’ve seen in this country over the last 40 years. Way too many Americans have become increasingly less tolerant of those different than themselves, and many of those same individuals as well as others have forgotten that each and every right we have is accompanied by a commensurate degree of responsibility to wield that right in a manner that does not infringe on the rights of others.

Now, we are overlaying constitutional carry on to values that show ever diminishing respect for the rights of others.

I was born and raised in SD and spent about half my adult life there. About 1 in 11 adults had a concealed carry permit, even before they adopted Constituional carry. The permit fee was $5 for decades and then double to $10. It took about a week from application to permit.

SD added a couple of advanced permits with greater fees and training requirements, but those were tailored for residents who wanted improved reciprocity with other states and in particular it’s neighbor MN. But the basic $10 permit was still available.

SD didn’t need a Constitutional carry permit. Now and in the near future, I don’t think it will be a problem in SD as it’s still a state where personal responsibility and getting along with your neighbors are still fairly strong values. That’s ironically because of the high probability of the person someone provokes being armed. Not surprisingly crime rates, outside the two major metropolitan areas and a couple of the reservations, are still low.

That’s not the case in some other state where Constitutional carry has become the law. In those states the simple reality is that Constitutional carry increases the potential for some one to be carrying a gun who might a lot be less responsible than someone with a concealed carry permit.

The saving grace for concealed carry permit holder will be the data base connections in many states between concealed carry permits, VDLs, and vehicle tags. It’ll give officers a heads up that the driver might have a concealed carry permit and be less of a risk of he or she is carrying a gun.

I accurately called the ball on where law enforcement was headed and I don’t like here it’s at as a profession or what it’s become in many departments - but don’t for a minute think I don’t fully support officer safety and take a hard looked at increase threats to officers.

Even if everything you write is true, and I’m not saying it isn’t, why should the potential future bad acts of some heretofore law abiding citizen(s) be used as an excuse to abridge other citizens’ Constitutional rights?
 
Would consider just carrying around the house to see if you can get comfortable with it. When i started, worked in an office full of tree hugging do gooders continually checking me over to see if i was carrying/printing. This was after governor made it legal for state employees. As a result made sure i was using options not easily discernible, and every option tested at home first. Did the upper and lower shelf stretch tests before carrying in public.

Am not a believer in "no one notices" line of thought, although some may more aptly describe the phenomenon as "no one said anything".

If you can not get comfortable with the practical and legal aspects, then don't do it. Nothing the matter with making that determination, as it's a personal choice.
 
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Get training. Read a lot of good info (try googling Steven (S.P.) Wenger's stuff, for example). Get training.
 
f you get stopped by the police inform them you have a permit and are armed , most are used to it by now and wont likely be over concerned.

I wouldn't carry an automatic with no round in the chamber. Don't think there is much danger of an AD with your S&W carried in a good holster. if you are really that worried get a DAO revolver instead. The only AD I have ever had with one of my carry weapons was with a PPK in .380. I had the hammer cocked and pushed the hammer drop and it fired.

Practice drawing and train yourself not to put your finger in the trigger guard untill the sights are on what you will shoot.
 
I finished up a bike ride, was carrying my 642 IWB and a cycling shirt over it. Those shirts fit tight, so I know I was printing.

There were a few neighbors out playing with their dogs, a local officer was chatting with them. I pulled up to chat too. Probably went on for 30 min or so. No one noticed (or at least said anything).

I once rode behind a guy on the trail and it was very easy to make out the LCP in his back jersey pocket.
 
That’s not the case in some other state where Constitutional carry has become the law. In those states the simple reality is that Constitutional carry increases the potential for some one to be carrying a gun who might a lot be less responsible than someone with a concealed carry permit.

Effects of Concealed-Carry Laws on Violent Crime
Updated April 22, 2020 Rand Corp.
Some studies find that right-to-carry laws reduce violent crime, others find that the effects are negligible, and still others find that such laws increase violent crime. The committee concludes that it is not possible to reach any scientifically supported conclusion because of (a) the sensitivity of the empirical results to seemingly minor changes in model specification, (b) a lack of robustness of the results to the inclusion of more recent years of data (during which there were many more law changes than in the earlier period), and (c) the statistical imprecision of the results. The evidence to date does not adequately indicate either the sign or the magnitude of a causal link between the passage of right-to-carry laws and crime rates. Furthermore, this uncertainty is not likely to be resolved with the existing data and methods. If further headway is to be made, in the committee's judgment, new analytical approaches and data are needed."
JMHO much like "science" the findings of studies largely depend on the opinions of who ever is paying for/conducting the study in the first place.
 
Effects of Concealed-Carry Laws on Violent Crime
Updated April 22, 2020 Rand Corp.
Some studies find that right-to-carry laws reduce violent crime, others find that the effects are negligible, and still others find that such laws increase violent crime. The committee concludes that it is not possible to reach any scientifically supported conclusion because of (a) the sensitivity of the empirical results to seemingly minor changes in model specification, (b) a lack of robustness of the results to the inclusion of more recent years of data (during which there were many more law changes than in the earlier period), and (c) the statistical imprecision of the results. The evidence to date does not adequately indicate either the sign or the magnitude of a causal link between the passage of right-to-carry laws and crime rates. Furthermore, this uncertainty is not likely to be resolved with the existing data and methods. If further headway is to be made, in the committee's judgment, new analytical approaches and data are needed."
JMHO much like "science" the findings of studies largely depend on the opinions of who ever is paying for/conducting the study in the first place.

I’d look at John Lott’s studies…
 
They did.

Studies Exploring the Effects of Shall-Issue Concealed-Carry Laws on Violent Crime, 1997–2004


Study Significant Effect Reported (Main Specification)

Lott and Mustard (1997)a Decrease in violent crime, murders, rapes,
and assaults

Bartley and Cohen (1998) Decrease in violent crime robust to alternate
model specifications

Black and Nagin (1998) Increase in assaults

Bronars and Lott (1998) Decrease in murders and rapes, displacement
of crime to other jurisdictions

Lott (1998a)a Decrease in violent crime in most states
implementing the law

Lott (1998b)a Decrease in violent crime; increase in
property crime

Ludwig (1998) None detected

Ayres and Donohue (1999)a Increase in property crime

Lott and Landes (1999)a Decrease in murders and injuries from
multiple-victim public shootings

Lott (2000)a Decrease in all crime categories

Benson and Mast (2001) Decrease in violent crime, murders,
rapes, and robberies

Duggan (2001) Decrease in assaults

Moody (2001)a Decrease in violent crime

Olson and Maltz (2001) Decrease in firearm murders

Plassmann and Tideman (2001) Decrease in murders and rapes;
increase in robberies

Lott and Whitley (2003)a Decrease in violent crime, murders,
rapes, and robberies

Plassmann and Whitley (2003)b Decrease in rapes and robberies

Rubin and Dezhbakhsh (2003) Decrease in murders; increase in
robberies

Ayres and Donohue (2003a)a Increase in more crime categories
than saw a decrease

Ayres and Donohue (2003b)a Increase or no effect in all crime
categories

Donohue (2003)a Mixed; effects were sensitive to model
specifications and data

Helland and Tabarrok (2004) Increase in property crime, auto
thefts, and larcenies

In addition to the sensitivity of results to minor changes in model specification noted by the NRC report, these early studies suffered from multiple serious problems with data and methodology that lead us to discount their value for informing this synthesis of evidence on the effects of shall-issue laws.

These problems include the following:

Lott and Mustard's data set used county population values that did not correspond to the crime statistics available for counties, especially those with weak reporting of crime statistics (Maltz and Targonski, 2002). Lott and Whitley (2003) discounted these and other concerns about the quality of county crime rate data, describing them as typical of the types of measurement error commonly encountered in statistical analyses. Furthermore, they suggested that the findings in Lott (2000) persisted even when analyzing the subset of counties with minimal error in crime statistics. After reviewing this exchange, the NRC panel disagreed with Lott and Whitley that the original effects reported by Lott (2000) survived this test: "The committee concludes that it is at least possible that errors in the [Uniform Crime Reporting] data may account for some of Lott's results" (NRC, 2004, p. 137).

Many of these studies followed the example of Lott and Mustard (1997) by including arrest rates as a model covariate. This led to these analyses excluding large numbers of counties that had no crimes of a given type and therefore an undefined arrest rate, an approach that differentially excluded locations where the introduction of shall-issue laws could have led only to an increase in crime rates (Ayres and Donohue, 2003a).

There were errors in the classification of shall-issue states in the Lott and Mustard data set that were only later corrected (Ayres and Donohue, 2003a). There were multiple errors detected in the data sets used by Lott (1998b, 2000) and by Plassmann and Whitley (2003), and Plassmann subsequently acknowledged these errors to the NRC (NRC, 2004, p. 136). Correction of these errors eliminated many of the significant effects reported by Plassmann and Whitley (2003) (Ayres and Donohue, 2003a).

Nearly all of the studies listed in the table above failed to control for serial correlation in the panel data set; the exceptions were Duggan (2001), Olson and Maltz (2001), Plassmann and Whitley (2003), Ayres and Donohue (2003a, 2003b), and Helland and Tabarrok (2004). This led to gross exaggerations of the statistical significance of study results and greatly elevated the risk of finding statistically significant effects that were in the opposite direction of any true effect (Schell, Griffin, and Morral, 2018; Moody and Marvell, 2018b; Aneja, Donohue, and Zhang, 2014; Helland and Tabarrok, 2004).

Most of the studies used the large number of covariates first included in the Lott and Mustard (1997) analyses, which had a ratio of estimated parameters to observations of between one to eight and one to 14 across analyses. When the proportion of estimated parameters is this high, there is considerable risk that the statistical models are overfit, and the law effects that they estimate thus may not be generalizable. Among few exceptions, the models of Ludwig (1998) and Moody (2001) did not suffer from this problem.


Effects of Concealed-Carry Laws on Violent Crime | RAND
 
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As a little note, to lighten the mood, I had a house fire in 2018. Omitting details, a fireman came out of the house and handed me my ID wallet that he found on the dresser in my bedroom. So I asked him if he'd go back in there and see if my revolver was still where I left it, under a pillow. He says sure and goes back inside, comes out a minute latter with my loaded 3" M686+.

I thanked him, I unloaded it, I handed it to my next door neighbor with the loose cartridges, and I asked him to please hide it in his house. No problem.

Plenty of neighbors were standing there. Nobody said boo.

God Bless Texas! :D

iscs-yoda-albums-s-and-w-revolvers-picture15726-686-6-a.jpg
 
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