New guy with a "burned" model 29 needs advice..
- Thread starter cheapbeater
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blackpowder30
Member
I wouldn't even send it to the factory. Save your postage.
Richard
Richard
Pontiaker
Member
I love al these comments, mostly from people who have no idea about heat treat or metalurgy. Its a tool, a tool that has been damaged. yes its comepletly fixable, not a big deal.Just because S&W wont do it does not mean it cant be done. I heat treat knife blades all the time, rockwell test etc...Its just metal, re heatreat, replace springs, refinsih and go from there. The problem is the cost of this work will probably be way more than the gun is worth EXCEPT for the sentimental value, depends on the owner. I would love to go through this gun and rebuild it. Yes it could be done, old gunsmiths from the 30's would probably have no problem doing it. Todays smiths that dont actually deal with alot of stuff that was done back then probably would not touch it. Guys that know a little about heat treat would do some research, heat treat to prober hardness and be done with it. People really need to keep an open mind about things they know nothing about before condeming things like this.
StingrayG4
Member
Better to err on the side of caution than to have a potential explosion in your hand. However, I would like to express that I present this as my opinion only and not as gospel.
-S
Raider
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
I think that it would be more expensive to find and pay somebody with the proper knowledge to re-heat treat the revolver than to buy a new one. Wonder what the cost would be? I myself would put it in a shadow box and be done with it because I don't have the talent or money to restore it but thats just me. Good luck!
Charlie
Charlie
borntoraisehogs
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I miss the good old days when there was plenty of people with arcane skills to perform the works modern industry now turns away . They didn't need no fancy liabilty insurance , cause when something they worked on , blew up , they didn't have anything worth suing them for . We liked it that way , we liked it fine .
It seems to me that you either wall hang it or send it back to the factory. Only S&W knows and has the specs on how they heat treat a Model 29-2. They heat treat differently based upon the specifics of the cartridge and the gun.
If you send it to them they will give you an answer one way or another and a price. If they think it's unsafe and can't be repaired they may keep it. They may cut you a deal. Who knows. They may send you a shipping label. Nothing ventured nothing gained.
If you don't send it in, I would disable it so in the future someone doesn't try to "fire" it.
Of course this is just my opinion and opinions are like "noses" and other things.
You know what you have but you don't know what you might have.
If you send it to them they will give you an answer one way or another and a price. If they think it's unsafe and can't be repaired they may keep it. They may cut you a deal. Who knows. They may send you a shipping label. Nothing ventured nothing gained.
If you don't send it in, I would disable it so in the future someone doesn't try to "fire" it.
Of course this is just my opinion and opinions are like "noses" and other things.
You know what you have but you don't know what you might have.
wheelgun28
Member
Ok, in order to repair such a complex machine as a pistol, it would need to be fully disassembled, down to the last screw. The frame and barrel separated. The frame can be heat tread and tempered, this can be done with almost no ill effect to the base metal. In order to do this you would need to know the exact alloy of the base metal and the desired level of temper, aka hardness. You will need a competent heat treater that has manufacturer ffl, as you will be leaving the serialized frame with him. You could do it your self if you have the proper equipment. (Id probably want do this in a vacuum oven to cut down on scale build up) This will require the frame to be heated red hot and soaked in the heat until the metal is heated through.
After heat treatment is complete, all of the important dimensions will need to be machined. During heat treatment the metal will move, things will no longer be in alignment, threads may not work. The original manufacture these sizes were left with extra material so they can be finished machined post heat treat.
Also the parts will need a full polish prior to bluing.
Things like the barrel will warp and most likely need to be replaced. If it didnt warp it will need the bore re polished and sized.
The cylinder if not warped to badly might be able to be honed back to size? Hopefully with out oversizing the chambers.
Another problem is, things like the side plate, how hard to make it or how soft? Trigger? Hammer? What do you do with the rear site?
I think there is ALOT more to this than meets the eye.
The best part is after its all done, you own the liability of any failure. Even if it isnt directly your fault, as you have modified it with out consent of the manufacturer.
For what its worth, I work in the tool and die industry,(kinda) for lack of a better term.
After heat treatment is complete, all of the important dimensions will need to be machined. During heat treatment the metal will move, things will no longer be in alignment, threads may not work. The original manufacture these sizes were left with extra material so they can be finished machined post heat treat.
Also the parts will need a full polish prior to bluing.
Things like the barrel will warp and most likely need to be replaced. If it didnt warp it will need the bore re polished and sized.
The cylinder if not warped to badly might be able to be honed back to size? Hopefully with out oversizing the chambers.
Another problem is, things like the side plate, how hard to make it or how soft? Trigger? Hammer? What do you do with the rear site?
I think there is ALOT more to this than meets the eye.
The best part is after its all done, you own the liability of any failure. Even if it isnt directly your fault, as you have modified it with out consent of the manufacturer.
For what its worth, I work in the tool and die industry,(kinda) for lack of a better term.
One more opinion
This has been an interesting thread, I usually cannot read an entire 6 or more page post - my eyes wear out. And, I was not going to weigh in, but here goes...29-3 are plentiful and reasonably priced. And, the 8 3/8 guns are often the least desirable to most, so you should have no trouble finding a decent 6" or 8 3/8" shooter that will probably require less of an investment than rehabbing that questionable gun. I don't know if a 29-3 shooter is something you want because you just happen to have one that you are considering resurrecting.
There have been some excellent replies on this thread. My two cents...I would disable the gun by removing the firing pin from the hammer, have someone MIG a spotweld on the firing pin bushing hole so simply re-installing a firing pin would not permit firing. Then polish it, leave it in the "white" so it looks like a 629. I bet cleaning and lubing the action would permit it to cycle properly. You'd have a one-of-a-kind non-firing, cycling model certainly worth the money you have in it. Display it, or whatever. Just make sure everyone who might handle it follows safe gun handling procedures and treats it like a fully functional firearm and not a toy.
This has been an interesting thread, I usually cannot read an entire 6 or more page post - my eyes wear out. And, I was not going to weigh in, but here goes...29-3 are plentiful and reasonably priced. And, the 8 3/8 guns are often the least desirable to most, so you should have no trouble finding a decent 6" or 8 3/8" shooter that will probably require less of an investment than rehabbing that questionable gun. I don't know if a 29-3 shooter is something you want because you just happen to have one that you are considering resurrecting.
There have been some excellent replies on this thread. My two cents...I would disable the gun by removing the firing pin from the hammer, have someone MIG a spotweld on the firing pin bushing hole so simply re-installing a firing pin would not permit firing. Then polish it, leave it in the "white" so it looks like a 629. I bet cleaning and lubing the action would permit it to cycle properly. You'd have a one-of-a-kind non-firing, cycling model certainly worth the money you have in it. Display it, or whatever. Just make sure everyone who might handle it follows safe gun handling procedures and treats it like a fully functional firearm and not a toy.
model70hunter
Member
Hello new guy. I've been reading this forum for quite some time. It's a great place to learn and see very nice S&W's. Recently I joined up. I do have some experience with this subject. In the middle 70's the local banker was living in a trailer while they built his new home. One burned mobile home later they dug out 10 pre 64 winchesters and 1 Sako. He collected on his insurance and dropped tham off at the local gun shop as a freebie. I spent a lot of time there and cut a deal with the gun shop owner. If I could sell them we would split 50/50. I made many calls and found a fellow in Colorado who built custom pre 64's rifles and also had a heat treating oven. He bought them all site unseen, pending rebuildable. I screwed off the bbls and ship shipped them to him. He said all were rebuildable and sent a check I think I got 200 each. The gunshop owners dad was a gunsmith, I fix guns, everyone who saw them said no way will these ever be saved. All of us were suprised. Some where there are 10 pre 64's and a Sako that looked worse than this. Your options are;
1. Send it to Smith you might be suprised. You will at least have a S&W letter to frame next to it.
2. Have S&W rebarrel to 44 special perhaps.
3. Find some one who can do heat treating and have it rebarreled to 44 Special. You might find cylinders and barrels at Numrich.
Again your S&W does not look as bad as those old M-70 Winchesters, get busy, get it sent to S&W, see what they say. I feel they will not do anything due to liability but see what they say. If you can't fix it and hang it on the wall, totally disable it like another poster suggested. You might get a gun smithing school to take it on as a project, 44 special or sleeve the cylinder and barrel to 22LR. Get busy doing something positive. You can look up S&W on the internet and call them MONDAY. Let us know what happens.
1. Send it to Smith you might be suprised. You will at least have a S&W letter to frame next to it.
2. Have S&W rebarrel to 44 special perhaps.
3. Find some one who can do heat treating and have it rebarreled to 44 Special. You might find cylinders and barrels at Numrich.
Again your S&W does not look as bad as those old M-70 Winchesters, get busy, get it sent to S&W, see what they say. I feel they will not do anything due to liability but see what they say. If you can't fix it and hang it on the wall, totally disable it like another poster suggested. You might get a gun smithing school to take it on as a project, 44 special or sleeve the cylinder and barrel to 22LR. Get busy doing something positive. You can look up S&W on the internet and call them MONDAY. Let us know what happens.
blackpowder30
Member
Hay Pontiaker, I spent too much time working in the tool and die shop at the General Electric jet engine plant in Evendale, Ohio. We had our own heat treat units. Don't think everybody who writes here knows less than you. We're not talking about knife blades. We're talking about pressures a knife blade never gets near. Like I said before. Don't spend the money to ship it to S&W. Have a good weekend. Richard
Pontiaker
Member
Better to go to a professional than a collectors forum and listen to a bunch of guys that just dont know what their talking about.
Pontiaker
Member
Heat treat is heat treat, you find out what kind of steel it is and what hardness its supposed to be then you test it and retreat and temper to spec, again its not rocket science.
Heat treting it more than one time is nothing, the info is out there, its very common to heat treat, temper, heat treat steel more than once.
Pontiaker
Member
This is all simple and easy work any gunsmith with heat treat experience can handle no problem. The cost may be more than the gun is worth except for what the owner values it as a family piece.
Do you have any idea what a gunsmith does? Way way more complicated stuff than this....
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Pontiaker
Member
Sorry but your wrong.
Pontiaker
Member
You can read my posts above.Again it can be done, not a big deal except for the guy who is paying for it.
" Don't think everybody who writes here knows less than you."
Is this some kind of a dig? So far no, there has not been anyone here yet who seems to know more than me about this subject, wish a real gunsmith would come in here and let you guys know its not a big deal. You have any idea how many guns are in fires every year and repaird to like new condition? Lots...
borntoraisehogs
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Has the statute of limitations run on this crime ? Why are you confessing to accessory to insurance fraud here ?
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