New M&P 40c owner... with a question

[slevy53]

Hi folks... I just received my new 40c. Short story... love it. The question I have is regarding the mag safety. I ordered it with night sites but no safeties. When it arrived it had the mag safety. I figured this might be a bonus since it skips out on the idiot text on the slide. Okay... great.

So now the question... do I take out the mag safety myself? I've seen the videos and instructions on how to do it. Looks easy enough. However I'd rather not pull apart the assembly personally.

I can't think of a scenario where I would need to be able to fire without the magazine in.

What's the general consensus here? Take out the mag safety or leave it in?

Oh... this is going to be my daily carry piece.

Thanks for the advice!

 

[Bicky Robby]

My opinion on the magazine disconnect is, it dosen't really matter to me. My wife's M&P still has it in place and it has not caused one issue for her.

Which brings me to a thought on mechanical safety devices. Some tend to use the safety, in this case the magazine disconnect, to keep them safe rather than proper training. I have seen safties fail on pistols and rifles. And when they fail, they often reuslt in someone getting hurt because the shooter did not use safe gun handeling practices.

I would try to get the issued resolved through Smith first since you did order the gun without the magazine disconnect on it.

 

[slevy53]

Thanks Bicky... much appreciated. I don't really think it matters much either... but wanted to see if more experienced shooters had scenarios in mind that would direct me otherwise.

Thanks again!

 

[g_conway]

Thanks Bicky... much appreciated. I don't really think it matters much either... but wanted to see if more experienced shooters had scenarios in mind that would direct me otherwise.

Thanks again!

The only real issue, if it's an issue at all, is if you are going to shoot USPSA, IDPA, or iCORE matches with it. The "Show clear, hammer down" is a bit more of a PITA with the safety.

I removed mine for that reason, as well as one other.
I want as little as possible to prevent the gun from firing when I need it. That said, I have never seen one reported incident were a mag-safe caused a problem.

 

[grimreaper21]

I've seen scenario's that support both sides...

one was a story written by a cop and basically he was fighting for control of his gun with his attacker. he smartly pressed the magazine release and when the attacker gained control of his gun, he pulled the trigger pointing right at the cop, and nothing happened.
the other side of the story would be obviously, you cannot fire your weapon without the magazine.

Lets invision a similar situation where you are fighting with an attacker and you have control of your weapon, but have either emptied the mag, dropped the mag, or some other unpredictable situation has occured. Your quickest possible way to return fire is loading a single round in the chamber through the slide. In this situation you will not be able to fire the round. There was a cool scene of this in the show "Breaking Bad".. if I find online i'll post it here.

 

[MP1SG]

I would be cautious of removing any safety feature from a weapon. LIABILITY stands out in my mind in the event you need that weapon to defend yourself..A good Atty will hammer you on "why did you remove a factory installed safety" Of course a good defense atty could prob attack on your behalf as well. Just a good idea not to mess with a safety.

just my 2cents.
As for the police Officer fighting for his weapon. I would think if i was in that situation (and I have been) I was much much more concerened with how many Knee elbow and fist stikes i could make rather than looking for that tiny little mag release button. The weapon would almost have to be in a perfect position for you to hit that button. which prob isnt the case.
again just my 2 cents
1SG

 

[grimreaper21]

here is the scene in question.. a rather awesome worst case scenario in which you wouldn't want a mag safety.
Season 3, Episode 7: Ambush - YouTube


MP1SG while i agree with you not everyone is a trained world class mixed martial artist so having complete dominance over your attacker is not always going to be that easy. I train with people that LOVE to bait you into strikes so they can further embarass you. I'm not sayin someone this smart or trained would attack a cop but don't think it isn't possible. remember for every attack there is always a counter, one that usually puts you in a worse position than you were beforehand. As my sensei always says, I let my enemy choose how he defeats himself.

 

[Lost Lake]

Improper use of a slide lock in that scene also...

Some here will say it would be better to die than release the slide by using the slide lock.

I took the mag safety off one of my M&P's. It's super easy to do and takes maybe two minutes. I replaced the spring with one from a ball point pen. Works like a charm.

 

[MP1SG]

Grimreaper
well put, my point was more geared to trying to hit that little button while u are fighting for control of the weapon. I just never saw that as a possibility. like i said the weapon would almost have to be presented to you in a perfect position allowing you to depress that smill little button. i just thinks thats a crazy argument, I somewhat agree with a police dept having that feature. where they can remove the magazine while booking a prisioner etc etc. (which i dont agree with, we have to secure our weapons when booking a prisioner)
thanks tho

 

[Tom Goodrick]

I have a magazine safety on my M&P 40 and like it. It is the only safety I have. I have been firing other guns recently that developed problems. It was always very tense as I carefully unloaded the gun without an accidental discharge. On my M&P I just drop the mag and I can relax and take a deep breath before getting down to the problem of an FTF.

I am on the range ready to fire and a friend walks up and wants to chat. Simply removing the magazine safes the gun for a few minutes. Of course I still keep my finger out of the trigger guard until ready to fire. But the Mag safety is a mechanical thing to do for safety that is easy to use and easy to over ride.

At home my defense gun is almost always at hand, loaded but with the mad pulled out an inch under a safe cover. I know when I need it, I have to grab the gun and push in the mag. For more safety I remove the mag and set the mag in a separate nearby place.

I am bothered that I can't get the mag safety on all guns.

 

[dallascj]

I have removed it from every gun I had that came with them. I don't think it is necessary for my personal firearms and it makes slide removal a PITA.

 

[g_conway]

I would be cautious of removing any safety feature from a weapon. LIABILITY stands out in my mind in the event you need that weapon to defend yourself..A good Atty will hammer you on "why did you remove a factory installed safety" Of course a good defense atty could prob attack on your behalf as well. Just a good idea not to mess with a safety.

just my 2cents.
As for the police Officer fighting for his weapon. I would think if i was in that situation (and I have been) I was much much more concerened with how many Knee elbow and fist stikes i could make rather than looking for that tiny little mag release button. The weapon would almost have to be in a perfect position for you to hit that button. which prob isnt the case.
again just my 2 cents
1SG

The only case that a disabled mag-safe would be an issue is on an accidental discharge with mag out, if at all. I don't know why the self defense angle keeps getting brought up.

In a self defense situation, the gun went off because YOU PULLED THE TRIGGER. The gun did what it was supposed to do in that situation. I have even heard people use that argument to say you shouldn't change factory trigger pull.
If you stand there in court and say "I pulled the trigger on purpose to defend my / others life" then all of that saftey / trigger pull garbage becomes moot.

 

[Lost Lake]

I have a magazine safety on my M&P 40 and like it. It is the only safety I have. I have been firing other guns recently that developed problems. It was always very tense as I carefully unloaded the gun without an accidental discharge. On my M&P I just drop the mag and I can relax and take a deep breath before getting down to the problem of an FTF.

I am on the range ready to fire and a friend walks up and wants to chat. Simply removing the magazine safes the gun for a few minutes. Of course I still keep my finger out of the trigger guard until ready to fire. But the Mag safety is a mechanical thing to do for safety that is easy to use and easy to over ride.

At home my defense gun is almost always at hand, loaded but with the mad pulled out an inch under a safe cover. I know when I need it, I have to grab the gun and push in the mag. For more safety I remove the mag and set the mag in a separate nearby place.

I am bothered that I can't get the mag safety on all guns.

Methinks you put too much faith in your mag safety. In my opinion, all safeties are just backup systems and I NEVER depend on them. They are mechanical and do fail. Thinking a gun is safe because the mag is out, or a thumb safety is on is dangerous. In fact, I teach people that even if a gun is unloaded, the slide locked back, the chamber clear, safety on, whatever, the gun NEVER gets pointed at something you wouldn't want to shoot.

In your situation at the range chatting with a friend, pulling the magazine out makes no difference to me. I still want the weapon pointing down range, no hands on the gun, and nobody walking in front of it.

I'm not the safety police, I just don't trust safeties like some do. I've never had one fail, but why chance it?

 

[T-BoneFL]

Hi folks... I just received my new 40c. Short story... love it. The question I have is regarding the mag safety. I ordered it with night sites but no safeties. When it arrived it had the mag safety. I figured this might be a bonus since it skips out on the idiot text on the slide. Okay... great.

Some questions for you (an anyone that can answer):
1. What's the model number of your 40c? I am interested in the 40c with mag safety only (i.e. no thumb safety, no internal lock). P/N is #109203, but the S&W online catalog does not show any 40c guns with night sights.

2. What brand night sights came with the gun? And what color?

Thanks in advance.

-T

 

[MP1SG]

Improper use of a slide lock in that scene also...

Some here will say it would be better to die than release the slide by using the slide lock.

I took the mag safety off one of my M&P's. It's super easy to do and takes maybe two minutes. I replaced the spring with one from a ball point pen. Works like a charm.

Actually I give him thumbs up for the use of the slide lock. We train our officers to use the slide lock and to sling shot the slide (Gross motor skills vs fine motor skills) In the event one hand is injured which appeared to be the case in that video. The mon on the ground manipulated the weapon and fired a fatal shot while being shot and having the use of only one hand. Job well done i say.

 

[1fly2ty]

With regards to safties on striker(safe action pistols)fired guns is as Jeff Cooper once said"your looking for a solution to a non-existent problem" or words to that effect! I have 2 M&P's and a Glock 23. why do you suppose Gaston Glock has never had the desire to put any type of safety on Glocks!

 

[Lost Lake]

Actually I give him thumbs up for the use of the slide lock. We train our officers to use the slide lock and to sling shot the slide (Gross motor skills vs fine motor skills) In the event one hand is injured which appeared to be the case in that video. The mon on the ground manipulated the weapon and fired a fatal shot while being shot and having the use of only one hand. Job well done i say.

Yeah I know. I use my slide lock as a slide release, and have been thrashed about it here... My thoughts are the same as yours, one hand is better than two, but if we keep talking like this someone will blast us about the proper function of the slide release....

 

[Lost Lake]

Some questions for you (an anyone that can answer):
1. What's the model number of your 40c? I am interested in the 40c with mag safety only (i.e. no thumb safety, no internal lock). P/N is #109203, but the S&W online catalog does not show any 40c guns with night sights.

2. What brand night sights came with the gun? And what color?

Thanks in advance.

-T

Bud's has them for $455. With Novak night sights. Model 306603LE with three mags.

S&W M&P40C 40S&W 3 1/2 Night Sights MS TS for Sale at Buds Gun Shop $455.00

Wait, that one has a thumb safety.

Here's one with no thumb safety but no mag safety. You can add a mag safety if you want.
http://www.budspolicesupply.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/4_8/products_id/82

 

[MP1SG]

Yeah I know. I use my slide lock as a slide release, and have been thrashed about it here... My thoughts are the same as yours, one hand is better than two, but if we keep talking like this someone will blast us about the proper function of the slide release....

Probably right,but then aagain they also probably lack the knowledge and expierence of handling weapons

 

[slevy53]

Some questions for you (an anyone that can answer):
1. What's the model number of your 40c? I am interested in the 40c with mag safety only (i.e. no thumb safety, no internal lock). P/N is #109203, but the S&W online catalog does not show any 40c guns with night sights.

2. What brand night sights came with the gun? And what color?
-T

Well... the SKU number is 307603. I don't find it on the S&W website at all. This post has all of the SKU numbers though:

http://***************/boards/index.php?/topic/23583-mp-sku-numbers/

As far as the night sights... I've actually tried to figure it out. The only branding on the sights themselves is an M&P brand stamp. I don't see Trijicon branding on the sights at all. From researching online I'm finding most folks think they're Novak sights with Trijicon lamps. Wish I could know for sure though.

The lamp color is green. I like them regardless of what brand they are... although to be honest I don't have anything else to compare them to.