“New” Star Modelo Super 9mm Largo

[Hawkeye3844]

Hello All,

It's been some time since I've posted on the forum, but wanted to share with you a neat pistol I've owned in the past, and own another one, yet again.
A few years ago, I purchased a Star Modelo Super, in somewhat of an odd cartridge, the 9mm Largo. It is a 9x23mm case, and is exactly the same as a 9mm Bergmann-Bayard round, except the Spanish version has more horsepower to it.
I sold my last one to fund a purchase of a S&W 64-5, which I absolutely love, in .38 Special.
At some point, I had kinda regretted selling the Star, and had kept my eye out for another one that was in great condition, and inexpensive. The past few years I saw a rise in price on them, and thought maybe I wasn't going to own another one, but, as Lady Luck had found me, I found another one! So I snatched it up as fast as I could!
Now, I'm happy I have both pistol's.
The Star is an amalgamation of 2 John Browning pistols. The ever popular 1911 exterior, and the internals of a Browning Hi-Power.
I believe I will spruce the outside up a little, and leave the internals just the way they are, because they're in excellent shape.
Now, just to touch on the 9x23mm Largo round. It has been described as a "poor man's .38 Super"! It's psi rating is about 3000 psi down from the .38 Super, but I doubt anyone won't be tell the difference.
The cartridge is capable of generating anywhere from 400 ft-lbs to 500 ft-lbs of energy. In my book, that's not a slouch.
My pistol was a commercially made one, from 1957. It has a pristine bore, and should shoot quite well, I think.
Anyway, I think I have gone on long enough.
I have posted some pics for everyone to peruse at your leisure.


Hawk




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[Fishinfool]

Nice find. I have the same pistol, purchased about 1980 or so. Paid less than $100 for it. At the same time I bought 2 cases of Spanish Military Largo ammo. Early 60's manufacture, one case was corrosive, one not. I believe they were less then $100 as well. The same shop had 9mm Largo bolt action Spanish "Destroyer" Carbines for cheap, and was going to get one to go with the pistol, but they all had rusted / pitted barrels.

I have read that some pistols had soft hammer sear notches that could wear and possibly go full auto if the half cock didn't catch. Never had that issue with mine, but I did find "SARCO" carried a ton of parts for this pistol, and maybe still does?

Still have it, in the back of the safe, and about half a case of ammo left. Shoots great, and is very well made, if a little finish challenged. My only issue with it is I get bit by the hammer pretty good, and have to wear a glove when shooting it. Fits a BHP holster I have. That 9mm Largo round is a step up from the common 9mm Luger, and I would guess about equal to a +p. Posted a poor pic, the only one I have handy.

Larry

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

I had several Super B's in the 90's, when I bought them they were in the cardboard Interarms box and had the cleaning rod and holster. There was enough room for a 50 round box of Blazer aluminum cased ammo too. Back in the day I sold them with ammo for $100 OTD, I considered it one of the "Best Bang for the Buck" guns, and got a lot of people to put one away for a rainy day!

Ivan

 

[ACORN]

The same shop had 9mm Largo bolt action Spanish "Destroyer" Carbines for cheap, and was going to get one to go with the pistol, but they all had rusted / pitted barrels.

Larry

A local shop had 2 of the Destroyer carbines. I was going to buy one but Covid struck and they changed their hours and I couldn't get there when they were open.
Would have been a cool little plinker.

 

[Hawkeye3844]

Nice find. I have the same pistol, purchased about 1980 or so. Paid less than $100 for it. At the same time I bought 2 cases of Spanish Military Largo ammo. Early 60's manufacture, one case was corrosive, one not. I believe they were less then $100 as well. The same shop had 9mm Largo bolt action Spanish "Destroyer" Carbines for cheap, and was going to get one to go with the pistol, but they all had rusted / pitted barrels.

I have read that some pistols had soft hammer sear notches that could wear and possibly go full auto if the half cock didn't catch. Never had that issue with mine, but I did find "SARCO" carried a ton of parts for this pistol, and maybe still does?

Still have it, in the back of the safe, and about half a case of ammo left. Shoots great, and is very well made, if a little finish challenged. My only issue with it is I get bit by the hammer pretty good, and have to wear a glove when shooting it. Fits a BHP holster I have. That 9mm Largo round is a step up from the common 9mm Luger, and I would guess about equal to a +p. Posted a poor pic, the only one I have handy.

Larry

Thank you Larry!

It's funny you said something about the half cock, because that's exactly what I check first, to see if the hammer slips. In the past, I've had 1911's hammer slip from half cock, and had an accidental discharge from one, thankfully no injuries or fatalities.
I haven't heard of anything great about the bores of the Destroyers barrels. That's a shame, because I think they would be great plinkers, or small game getters.

The Stars are definitely well made. I can tell that the person before me, must have carried it in a holster quite a bit. That's the only flaw with mine, excessive holster wear.
Yes, the mild form of the 9mm Largo is a +p 9x19. I handload mine, and with the newer pistol powders, I can keep the chamber pressures down, with getting a little more velocity. I can attest to the 9mm Largo with getting much more muzzle energy than the 9x19 could ever dream of. I saw on a website that I can get a 124gr bullet going into the 1300 FPS range, and getting substantially more muzzle energy. This is thankfully without more wear and tear to the pistol.
It's a remarkable pistol and round to me.
The problem of getting hammer bite, can be solved, from what I've learned from trial and error, is not to choke up as high to the hammer spur.
I have some Berry's plated bullets, 124 gr solid base hp, and I like to use those for plinking. They're rated up to 1250 fps, and do an amazing job of popping 20 oz water bottles up into the air about 15 - 20 ft. LOL
Brass and bullets are still easy to find, thankfully. I found out that I can use .38 ACP/.38 Super dies, with using a regular 9x19 shell holder.


Hawk


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[Hawkeye3844]

I had several Super B's in the 90's, when I bought them they were in the cardboard Interarms box and had the cleaning rod and holster. There was enough room for a 50 round box of Blazer aluminum cased ammo too. Back in the day I sold them with ammo for $100 OTD, I considered it one of the "Best Bang for the Buck" guns, and got a lot of people to put one away for a rainy day!

Ivan

It's funny, but when I was fresh in the Air Force, I bought a brand new Star Super B, and that started my journey with owning the one I have currently.
They were a steal at $100. I should've kept that one too, but I had to raise money to move.
That one didn't have any problems with eating any ammo I fed it. It was quite accurate, too, if I remember correctly.


Hawk


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[2152hq]

The last bunch of STAR Model B Super pistols I had I bought from AIM Surplus in the late 90's or early '00's.
They were around $125 and included the extra magazine, cleaning rod, paperwork/manual and the orig box.
These were in orig finish and about 90%.
They also had some 'Factory refinished' for another $50.
Those Factory refinished ones were not awful, but were certainly not worth the extra $50 IMO.

I kept a couple and sold the rest of them.
Eventually gave away one of the 2 I'd kept,,then sold the last one.
Yes I wish I'd kept at least one!

One of the few semiauto pistols I could still operate the slide. Very smooth and easy to manipulate.

Model B & B-Super were a designation for 9mmLuger caliber.
Model A & A-Super were the designation when the same pistol was in 9mm Largo caliber

The magazines interchange betw the two but the 9mm Luger mag feed lips are very slightly longer than the Largo Model A magazines.
They usually don't cause any problems if a 'conversion from one caliber to the other is done on a frame.

The Thumb Safety causes the most problem on these STAR pistols wether they are A,B or Super A/B.

When working properly, engaging the thumb safety should cam the cocked hammer back off of the sear. You should be able to see the hammer move slightly backwards.
The engagement of the safety should be able to be employed simply with one hand/finger(thumb).

You should not have to also slightly pull the cocked hammer back a little to help to engage the Thumb Safety.
This last point is a very common ill of many STAR pistols in this group. Some much so that it's often written up that it IS the proper way to engage the thumb safety. Not so.

Simple wear of the engagement surface cam betw the thumb safety and the hammer and the fact that the case hardening (surface hardening) of the parts wears through quite often as it can be quite thin.
The softer inner core of the steel parts then wears easily and the function of the parts suffers.

The STAR's generally have a firing pin that is longer than the breech block they are in. Not a recoiling pin such as a Colt 1911 so that when at rest, the tip is pulled inside the breech face and not sitting against the primer of a chambered primer.

In the STAR, the firing pin is hanging out the face of the breech when the hammer is all the way down.
So if you have a round in the chamber and the hammer down,,that firing pin is sitting on the primer of that round with the hammer behind it.
A drop or bump to the hammer and a discharge will occur.

STAR did switch to the recoil style firing pin in their designs but I don't think it was until the 70's.
IIRC the STAR BM started out with the old style pin also but near the end of production of the Model, the newer recoil style was fitted to them as well.

Simple way to check,,lock the slide back and press the firing pin forward from the back of the slide till it's even with the slide at the rear.
If the pin protrudes from the breech face it's the old style.
Don't carry w/a round in the chamber and the hammer down all the way.

The half cock is a not a safety. Just like the Colt, it's there for the sear to catch the hammer should the full cock notch fail.

These pistols always shot accurately for me with jacketed bullets. Not as well with cast lead. Maybe it was just the loads I tried. I'm not a great experimenter as some are and didn't try a book full of cast loads.

Some HP bullet designs didn't feed well as with many semiautos. Others did. FMJ commercial ammo like Rem 115gr always worked well.

 

[Absalom]

Yes, the mild form of the 9mm Largo is a +p 9x19. I handload mine, and with the newer pistol powders, I can keep the chamber pressures down, with getting a little more velocity. I can attest to the 9mm Largo with getting much more muzzle energy than the 9x19 could ever dream of. I saw on a website that I can get a 124gr bullet going into the 1300 FPS range, and getting substantially more muzzle energy.....

That's one thing I've always found a bit ironic about the 9mm Largo:

Conventional wisdom has always been that the .380 is the most powerful load around which one should build a pistol with a simple undelayed blowback action, and that the 9mm Para requires some breech-locking mechanism.

And then Astra builds a simple blowback pistol not just for the Para, but the considerably hotter Largo. The Astra 400 served as the standard Spanish army pistol for decades.

 

[LVSteve]

I've got a Super B and they make great teaching weapons. The weight soaks up the recoil and the springs are not too tough when racking the slide. It gets new shooters over the hump of shooting what most consider a real cartridge.

 

[Hawkeye3844]

That's one thing I've always found a bit ironic about the 9mm Largo:

Conventional wisdom has always been that the .380 is the most powerful load around which one should build a pistol with a simple undelayed blowback action, and that the 9mm Para requires some breech-locking mechanism.

And then Astra builds a simple blowback pistol not just for the Para, but the considerably hotter Largo. The Astra 400 served as the standard Spanish army pistol for decades.

The Astra is an amazing pistol in itself. It is a great piece of engineering, and blows away the idea that a blowback pistol can be made for much more powerful rounds like the 9mm Largo.
Eventually, I would love to get ahold of an Astra 400.
Call me crazy, but I think the Astra looks nice too. They are accurate as well.
A lot of people turn there nose up at Star and Astra, and they really shouldn't. Granted, their finishes aren't all that great, but the engineering of the pistols themselves are quite remarkable.


Hawk


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[Hawkeye3844]

The last bunch of STAR Model B Super pistols I had I bought from AIM Surplus in the late 90's or early '00's.
They were around $125 and included the extra magazine, cleaning rod, paperwork/manual and the orig box.
These were in orig finish and about 90%.
They also had some 'Factory refinished' for another $50.
Those Factory refinished ones were not awful, but were certainly not worth the extra $50 IMO.

I kept a couple and sold the rest of them.
Eventually gave away one of the 2 I'd kept,,then sold the last one.
Yes I wish I'd kept at least one!

One of the few semiauto pistols I could still operate the slide. Very smooth and easy to manipulate.

Model B & B-Super were a designation for 9mmLuger caliber.
Model A & A-Super were the designation when the same pistol was in 9mm Largo caliber

The magazines interchange betw the two but the 9mm Luger mag feed lips are very slightly longer than the Largo Model A magazines.
They usually don't cause any problems if a 'conversion from one caliber to the other is done on a frame.

The Thumb Safety causes the most problem on these STAR pistols wether they are A,B or Super A/B.

When working properly, engaging the thumb safety should cam the cocked hammer back off of the sear. You should be able to see the hammer move slightly backwards.
The engagement of the safety should be able to be employed simply with one hand/finger(thumb).

You should not have to also slightly pull the cocked hammer back a little to help to engage the Thumb Safety.
This last point is a very common ill of many STAR pistols in this group. Some much so that it's often written up that it IS the proper way to engage the thumb safety. Not so.

Simple wear of the engagement surface cam betw the thumb safety and the hammer and the fact that the case hardening (surface hardening) of the parts wears through quite often as it can be quite thin.
The softer inner core of the steel parts then wears easily and the function of the parts suffers.

The STAR's generally have a firing pin that is longer than the breech block they are in. Not a recoiling pin such as a Colt 1911 so that when at rest, the tip is pulled inside the breech face and not sitting against the primer of a chambered primer.

In the STAR, the firing pin is hanging out the face of the breech when the hammer is all the way down.
So if you have a round in the chamber and the hammer down,,that firing pin is sitting on the primer of that round with the hammer behind it.
A drop or bump to the hammer and a discharge will occur.

STAR did switch to the recoil style firing pin in their designs but I don't think it was until the 70's.
IIRC the STAR BM started out with the old style pin also but near the end of production of the Model, the newer recoil style was fitted to them as well.

Simple way to check,,lock the slide back and press the firing pin forward from the back of the slide till it's even with the slide at the rear.
If the pin protrudes from the breech face it's the old style.
Don't carry w/a round in the chamber and the hammer down all the way.

The half cock is a not a safety. Just like the Colt, it's there for the sear to catch the hammer should the full cock notch fail.

These pistols always shot accurately for me with jacketed bullets. Not as well with cast lead. Maybe it was just the loads I tried. I'm not a great experimenter as some are and didn't try a book full of cast loads.

Some HP bullet designs didn't feed well as with many semiautos. Others did. FMJ commercial ammo like Rem 115gr always worked well.

You absolutely know your stuff about the 1911's and the Star!
It's great to have another person around with a wealth of knowledge.
Everyone on here should listen well to this gentleman when he speaks about these pistols.
Thank you very much for your input and knowledge, I greatly appreciate it.


Hawk


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[Hawkeye3844]

I've got a Super B and they make great teaching weapons. The weight soaks up the recoil and the springs are not too tough when racking the slide. It gets new shooters over the hump of shooting what most consider a real cartridge.

I have to agree with you there. It is a great starter pistol, because it does exactly as you say.


Hawk


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[JLL21473]

This thread and others are great. I have a Star Super SM. The scaled down size and 1911 design, is what makes it so appealing to me. It was my grandfathers. He retired from Air Force early to mid 60's, but I'm not sure that is where he acquired it from.

 

[Walter Rego]

I have a Super A that I bought back around 1993 for something like $179. It has a 1949 date code and is Spanish Army marked. I believe it is one of the many, many Star pistols that were returned to the factory for credit when the Spanish military wanted newer pistols and couldn't afford them, and then refinished and sold on the commercial market. The roll stampings are just a little weak and it looks way too new for a 1949 military issued pistol.
I also stocked up on the 1970's era Santa Barbara arsenal 9mm Largo ammo when it was something like $2.00/25 and have a few boxes of the CCI aluminum cased Blazer ammo which shoots very well.
The 9mm Largo round is no slouch and loaded with the CCI Blazer hollow points would be a very credible self defense weapon.

 

[Drm50]

I had a Star 9Largo. I shot 38acp in it with no problems. Had Spanish Destroyer at same time and used same ammo. I shot some 38Super in the carbine but not in the star.

 

[Hawkeye3844]

I have a Super A that I bought back around 1993 for something like $179. It has a 1949 date code and is Spanish Army marked. I believe it is one of the many, many Star pistols that were returned to the factory for credit when the Spanish military wanted newer pistols and couldn't afford them, and then refinished and sold on the commercial market. The roll stampings are just a little weak and it looks way too new for a 1949 military issued pistol.
I also stocked up on the 1970's era Santa Barbara arsenal 9mm Largo ammo when it was something like $2.00/25 and have a few boxes of the CCI aluminum cased Blazer ammo which shoots very well.
The 9mm Largo round is no slouch and loaded with the CCI Blazer hollow points would be a very credible self defense weapon.

That's a good looking pistol!
You got a steal of a deal back then!
I wouldn't want to get shot by a regular 9x19. But especially more so from a 9mm Largo.
When loaded with a decently made modern hollow point, I believe the 9mm Largo would blow a hole in someone the size of a fist.
Yeah, the 9mm Largo is anything but a slouch! Yikes!


Hawk


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[Hawkeye3844]

I had a Star 9Largo. I shot 38acp in it with no problems. Had Spanish Destroyer at same time and used same ammo. I shot some 38Super in the carbine but not in the star.

Yes, a lot of the commercial made ones could chamber the .38 ACP, and the .38 Super.
Plus some people were brave enough to shoot regular 9mm in them.
I wouldn't recommend anyone doing so nowadays. Please shoot what is labeled on the barrel.
That will save anyone a trip to the hospital, and or the morgue.
The only other ammo you can shoot in the Star Modelo Super is the 9mm Bergman-Bayard.


Hawk


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