NM#3 Shoulder Stock
- Thread starter mmaher94087
- Start date
Keen minds think alike. You too ?
There's something you won't often see ! I thought I was the only one that hoarded extension stocks.
I have one, exactly like yours, new in the box. Got that back about 25 years ago. A few showed up back then. By the time Isaw it, there was only one remaining. SalPS: As rumor had it, S&W found several of them in the safe back when they sold off all the oddities in a large auction back about then.
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mmaher94087
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I have a complete Australian rig with the stock but not a standard NM#3.
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mmaher94087
Member
The late Turner Kirkland (Dixie Gun Works) bought a crate of them and resold them around 1958 or so. They were advertised in his catalog.
How many, non-Australian, "cut for stock" NM3s do you need ? Call me.
Any time I've found a Model 3 cut for stock ... or just a extension stock without the gun ... I purchased it, if there was a reasonable deal to be made.
I have a American Transition, factory refurbished in 1925, that had been fit for an aftermarket "Skeleton type" extension stock as it has finishing screws in the drilled & tapped holes along the back strap and butt.
I don't have the after market extension stock for the American Transition, so, if you have one, please queue me (via email).
I have a very early 12xxx SN range NM3 cut for stock (factory refurbished but then likely refinished again) that shipped to a dealer in Mass.
I have a 2nd Model American cut for stock, while mechanically excellent, needs to be refurbished as it had been period refinished, but not sanded out. It has the the original stock (new) in the white. With only 608 (IIRC) manufactured as cut for extension stock, I purchased this with the intention of restoring it in my retirement ages but seems I'll never get to that project. It letters correctly.
One of the old timers (elder senior member) once told me someone had manufactured a replacement stocks for the 2nd Model Americans at one time but I have never seen one nor can I confirm that, even after years of research. It doesn't seem feasible that anyone would gear up to manufacture these stocks with such a short supply of guns they fit.
Do you have any factual data on replacement A/M stocks (other than the obvious type like the skeleton stocks) ?
NICE thread, Mike !!
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mmaher94087
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Sal wrote: "How many, non-Australian, "cut for stock" NM3s do you need ?" Need? None. Want; one. What I'd like to find is a nice original BLUE NM#3. I had to pass on one that had the slot milled through the serial number and re-stamped under the left stock because of prior commitments. I wish I hadn't lost that one. Currently, I'm in the "prior commitment" mode. See my question to Roy about a 1, 1, 1 that I'm thrilled to own.
Now, THAT is impressive. A 1-1-1 ? If anyone deserves it, you do, Mike. Congrats on that find.
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mmaher94087
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Nice set up Mike,
I'm wondering though how well this variation actually worked? Don't misunderstand me here. It's a valuable piece of history. My input is regarding the two points of contact for a cartridge revolver of 44 caliber?
Even the earlier cap and ball stocks had 3 points of contact. Or perhaps I'm not seeing the 3rd point? I see the threaded joint but it appears to close on a two point clamp. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
The aftermarket stocks had a strong clamp controlled by a worm gear that firmly attached to the grip frame.( I've used these and they work well)
Other modified stocks have threaded holes drilled into the back strap and often under the grip frame for a very secure attachment.
The type of stock pictured was a common design for cap & ball revolvers but not cartridge. Which increased recoil significantly.
Murph
I'm wondering though how well this variation actually worked? Don't misunderstand me here. It's a valuable piece of history. My input is regarding the two points of contact for a cartridge revolver of 44 caliber?
Even the earlier cap and ball stocks had 3 points of contact. Or perhaps I'm not seeing the 3rd point? I see the threaded joint but it appears to close on a two point clamp. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
The aftermarket stocks had a strong clamp controlled by a worm gear that firmly attached to the grip frame.( I've used these and they work well)
Other modified stocks have threaded holes drilled into the back strap and often under the grip frame for a very secure attachment.
The type of stock pictured was a common design for cap & ball revolvers but not cartridge. Which increased recoil significantly.
Murph
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mmaher94087
Member
Murph, the two point system worked nicely as the butt point-of-contact was a 3/8" slot and had matching iron hardware. The hardware was shaped as a mirror image of the backstrap and the 'hook' was a fine thread. All of this made the shoulder stock grip the revolver as if it was welded to it.
The stock for the .320 Revolving Rifle originally had a longer tang (~1 1/2") and longer slot for attaching but, towards the end of production, it was dropped in favor of the 'short' tang. It was still very solid even with a barrel of 16", 18" or 20".
The stock for the .320 Revolving Rifle originally had a longer tang (~1 1/2") and longer slot for attaching but, towards the end of production, it was dropped in favor of the 'short' tang. It was still very solid even with a barrel of 16", 18" or 20".
Thanks Mike
The factory s&w slots (cuts) and mountings for the S&W Models:
American 2nd
Russian (not sure if 2nd or 3rd )
New Model 3
Revolving Rifle
were all different mounts. None of them are interchangeable.
Then there were the aftermarket versions, like the ones that leave evidence of the threaded holes (Like those shown on my American transition in another post.) I'm not sure exactly what type AM stock it had, but would sure love to find a match for it although I'd never attach it to the gun.
I owned a engraved Frank Wesson 32 Caliber rifle with original removable stock, in excellent original condition. That was a work of art. Tongue of skeleton stock slipped into a machined channel on the butt with just 1 thumb screw held it perfectly tight. The stock was numbered to the gun and nickel (or silver) plated.
I sold that to a friend that accompanied me to Charlotte in 2017, after I had first offered it to Bob Hart. Both Bob Hart (Red9) and Roy Jinks verified the engraver of that gun, too, at that 2017 show. When Bob walked away, my buddy that accompanied me asked if he could purchase the Frank Wesson at the same price I offered it to Bob. Being that Bob walked away, I said yes. Bob returned 5 minutes later to buy it. I felt awful, but Bob just walked away. Had Bob asked me to hold it for 30 mins. while he decided, I would have taken it off the table.
Bob and I have been friends for over 25 year comparing notes on these oldies and single shots. We're horse-traded many.
American 2nd
Russian (not sure if 2nd or 3rd )
New Model 3
Revolving Rifle
were all different mounts. None of them are interchangeable.
Then there were the aftermarket versions, like the ones that leave evidence of the threaded holes (Like those shown on my American transition in another post.) I'm not sure exactly what type AM stock it had, but would sure love to find a match for it although I'd never attach it to the gun.
I owned a engraved Frank Wesson 32 Caliber rifle with original removable stock, in excellent original condition. That was a work of art. Tongue of skeleton stock slipped into a machined channel on the butt with just 1 thumb screw held it perfectly tight. The stock was numbered to the gun and nickel (or silver) plated.
I sold that to a friend that accompanied me to Charlotte in 2017, after I had first offered it to Bob Hart. Both Bob Hart (Red9) and Roy Jinks verified the engraver of that gun, too, at that 2017 show. When Bob walked away, my buddy that accompanied me asked if he could purchase the Frank Wesson at the same price I offered it to Bob. Being that Bob walked away, I said yes. Bob returned 5 minutes later to buy it. I felt awful, but Bob just walked away. Had Bob asked me to hold it for 30 mins. while he decided, I would have taken it off the table.
Bob and I have been friends for over 25 year comparing notes on these oldies and single shots. We're horse-traded many.
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GRI
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GRI
Member
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mmaher94087
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The true Russian stock has three attaching points; the 3/8" lug on the butt, the hook and an added lug halfway up the backstrap. The location of that second lug is visible in your photo. I had a standard NM #3 stock, that was altered for the Russian, that had a screw-in lug and clearance flat milled into the attaching iron.
Very interesting mounting
Hey GRI,
Those are very interesting machined mounting slots and what looks like a round boss at the top of the backstrap? Is it threaded?
This is just further evidence that the shoulder stocks whether factory or aftermarket? We’re more popular than we might have thought.
It makes perfect sense when you think about it. Ammo was expensive, justifying the huge market for reloading tools then. Rifles were also very expensive so why not get a shoulder stock to convert your pistol into a viable hunting tool?
Murph
Hey GRI,
Those are very interesting machined mounting slots and what looks like a round boss at the top of the backstrap? Is it threaded?
This is just further evidence that the shoulder stocks whether factory or aftermarket? We’re more popular than we might have thought.
It makes perfect sense when you think about it. Ammo was expensive, justifying the huge market for reloading tools then. Rifles were also very expensive so why not get a shoulder stock to convert your pistol into a viable hunting tool?
Murph
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mmaher94087
Member
I'll save GRI the trouble if I may. The "..round boss.." is the attaching hole for the threaded, hooked rod that cinches the stock to the backstrap. The hole is not threaded.
Very cool. I’ve never actually seen a stock like that for sale, but I got this photo at the Cody museum about a month ago.
NewDeparture
Member
Outstanding extension stock.
This is the first time I see a cardboard box labeled for one of those stocks.
I´m therefore assuming that they could be ordered as a completely separated item? I always thought they were only provided or sold with NM#3 “cut for stock” revolvers.
This is the first time I see a cardboard box labeled for one of those stocks.
I´m therefore assuming that they could be ordered as a completely separated item? I always thought they were only provided or sold with NM#3 “cut for stock” revolvers.
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mmaher94087
Member
I believe the extension stock could be ordered separately but the revolver would need to be sent back to S&W to have the slot and hole milled in the backstrap. I'll need to look through my literature to verify my statement.
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mmaher94087
Member
Regretfully, I don't seem to be able to find the information. I thought I had a Price List that showed the NM #3 stock but it eludes me now.
Where did I put my notes?
Don’t feel bad Mike.
Happens to me a lot. I pride myself on keeping good notes and documents but you can’t log everything!! I was thinking that I might have something along those lines in my Distributor catalogs. I’ll look when I get a chance.
Murph
Don’t feel bad Mike.
Happens to me a lot. I pride myself on keeping good notes and documents but you can’t log everything!! I was thinking that I might have something along those lines in my Distributor catalogs. I’ll look when I get a chance.
Murph
NewDeparture
Member
Thanks Mike,
I had a chance of buying a blued extension stock from the same guy I had already bought the “cut for stock” NM3.
Metal parts were pitted and buffed, and then reblued in a glossy-black bluing.
I´ve had a hard time making up my mind on that one. I liked the idea of having a extension stock but its condition was a no-no to me. The price was considerable high, about half of what I´ve paid for the NM3 (which fortunately was in original and decent shape).
After some days of thinking about it, I´ve decided against buying it. Not sure if I did OK or not. I would probably never see one extension stock again.
I had a chance of buying a blued extension stock from the same guy I had already bought the “cut for stock” NM3.
Metal parts were pitted and buffed, and then reblued in a glossy-black bluing.
I´ve had a hard time making up my mind on that one. I liked the idea of having a extension stock but its condition was a no-no to me. The price was considerable high, about half of what I´ve paid for the NM3 (which fortunately was in original and decent shape).
After some days of thinking about it, I´ve decided against buying it. Not sure if I did OK or not. I would probably never see one extension stock again.
OP
mmaher94087
Member
The blue extension stocks are difficult to locate. A reblue with pits and rounded edges would be a PASS for me too. I found the blue stock first and now seek the correct blue revolver. The problem, as I see it, is that the finishes of the revolver and stock usually don't match. One always looks newer than the other. I'll try to post photos of my blue stock in the next day or so.
