Non NRA friends

[ChattanoogaPhil]

As far as I'm concerned not all gun owners belong in the NRA, at least not with the gun rights aspect of the organization. Some gun owners have views that sound a lot like Sarah Brady to me.

 

[hittman77]

...I'm done here.

Well said.

 

[chaparrito]

I was a member for years. I laud the NRAs safety education (the 501c3 side).
I just won't be a part of any organization that takes an "if you're not for us you're against us" stance. The polarization and divisiveness is tiresome.

 

[LostintheOzone]

If this had been successful the residents of DC would have benefitted but there would have been no basis for Gura's suit and the rest of the US would not have the benefit of the the Heller decision which tilts the the interpretation of the second amendment in favor of personal defense considerations versus the "state militia" interpretation used by anti-gun advocates to deny personal possession of fire arms under the aegis of 2A.

I've been more of a proponent of the personal defense argument for awhile now. Here's a little more to read if anyone cares to get off of the NRA train for a minute and look around.

The NRA Muscles into McDonald v. Chicago - Reason.com

NRA, onetime ally feud over next big guns case to go before Supreme Court

 

[ladder13]

Well what'ya know, pro gun groups disagreeing on method and who gets the glory.
Thing is, the left never disagrees, they want your guns and your freedom, and don't care how it's accomplished.

I agree with David Hardy.

"Some forces in the gun rights community, such as one of its oldest warriors and scholars, David Hardy, refuse to take sides between the NRA and Gura. Instead, Hardy applauds both arguments and both arguers, and begs the gun rights community to stop encouraging dissension: "They're going into the fight of their lives, no OUR lives, and don't need the distractions. We can all engage in internecine battles after oral argument, or better yet, the decision. For now they need to concentrate. Bottom line: there is no bad way to win a case."

 

[feralmerril]

I am and have been a member for a long time. Some of their practices irk me. For instance I cant even tell you when my subscription is really due. They have a way of sending you mail begging you to renew early etc to where you never know whats what. Then I read of what some get paid.
I also was a union member all my years on the job. I didnt approve of my dues paying for campaigning for the opposite part that I detested with my dues. I didnt want to be called a scab or enjoying for free the benifits others paid for. As you age you start to look at things slightly different. This is apples vs oranges I know. Look at the car industry. I was raised in wisconsin where a few neighbors would go work for the auto industry and come home every few weeks. If you got a job in the industry you had the best paying job with the best benefits in the country. I dont think the work was a man killer either. I had uncles in it.
The union was the worlds strongest. Do I need to say any more than look at detroit now?
It well may be true we would be far worse off were there no NRA but yet I aint really sure 100% that is fact. When we start making high paid primidonnas, start pressuring with muscle (money/votes) it only works for so long with whatever thing we are talking about. I cant count how many union meetings I attended where the sheep were led or shouted down by the hot headed egotistical union political stewards etc. My own job as a lowly lockheed guard turned from being probley one of the highest paying guard job in the world when I first hired in to a lot less through the years just before I retired.
Our fire department was under the same part of the company as my guard department. I believe our fire department was the best job in the company for a blue collar worker. They seen next to no fires or action. They got the highest pay and thought themselves indispensable. For awhile they demanded and got yet higher pay grades etc. Their parking lot looked like a millionairs country club with mostly brand new 4wd trucks and hot cars. BBQ`s, building models etc. Got insulted if they had to go check fire extinguishers or whatever.
It only went so long. The last contract they demanded more. The company responded by fireing all but one to check extinguishers and write out welding permits etc. Sold all their toy fire trucks and contracted the county. Maybe a 30 man department gone overnight.
My fellow guards got the message (I was one of the very few to vote no) and accepted the company hireing part time guards at far lesser wages than we got so they didnt have to also give them the benifits we got. Guess what? Through time the part timers outnumbered us old timers and when it come contract time screwed us back. Soon our double time (effectivly triple time) was only straight time if we chose to work them. Perks and wages were cut.
I made more 25 years ago than the guards there do now, I think. God favored me. It seems I hired in at the best time and retired just before it got extra bad.
Somehow I just dont think we are as important as we want to think.
Meanwhile I will stay a member just to hedge my bet.

 

[LostintheOzone]

Well what'ya know, pro gun groups disagreeing on method and who gets the glory.

Granted, but I see a lot of prejudice coming from NRA members. Where does that come from? Note that the SAF isn't listed on this forum as a good old boy club with the badge in the members window like the NRA is. That fact and this thread kind of set me off. I'm off to join the SAF. No guts no glory.

 

[hittman77]

I see a lot of prejudice coming from NRA members.

Perhaps that's how you perceive it but doubt any (or many) of the NRA members here and elsewhere feel that way.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion and to decide how you spend (or keep) your money. Heck, you may even think NRA members was wasting their money .... again .... your call.

Simply because some folks may disagree with you or your opinion of the NRA, lets not jump straight into "prejudice" mode; that kinda smacks of liberals always using the race card.

The sad thing is; while we gun owners are fighting amongst ourselves, the enemies of guns are very united.

 

[redlevel]

Granted, but I see a lot of prejudice coming from NRA members. Where does that come from? Note that the SAF isn't listed on this forum as a good old boy club with the badge in the members window like the NRA is. That fact and this thread kind of set me off. I'm off to join the SAF. No guts no glory.

What is the SAF?

 

[rags]

What is the SAF?

Second Amendment Foundation. On second thought, don't they make roofing shingles? No, that's GAF.

 

[redlevel]

What is the SAF?

My point is, I'll bet the average anti-gun Congress Critter would not recognize a reference to the "SAF." Every one of them, though, knows what the NRA is.

 

[LostintheOzone]

that kinda smacks of liberals always using the race card.

See what I mean. That right there is some pretty black and white thinking.

 

[Biginge]

Never thought I would see the need for defense of the NRA on a major gun forum. Jeez.

 

[CoMF]

I just want to make one thing clear: I'm not going to pontificate to anyone where they should direct their contributions. It's your money, do what you want with it. Just don't judge me for not contributing to your pet organizations and I won't criticize your decisions. To quote another poster, "it's that simple."

The only thing the NRA does that you can't is flood the war chest of pro-2A candidates with millions of dollars. That's it. You can track firearms legislation on websites like THOMAS, and in some cases actually receive automatic updates via email when bills are introduced in the case of GovTrack. You can take the time to email your congress critters through their individual websites or, if you're strapped for time, PopVox will automatically do it for you saving you the trouble of tracking them down.

Don't just automatically vote for someone who pays lip service to 2A issues much less whoever your favorite organization tells you to. Keep track of your Senator's and State Rep's shenannigans through GovTrack's Voting Record section to see where they really stand on the issues, or in the case of non-incumbents, take a look at the bigger picture with sites like OnTheIssues. Sift through the double talk and rhetoric with sites like FactCheck or PolitiFact. You'll be a much more educated voter.

I'll close my post by giving the "true believers" some well-meaning advice: Referring to people who don't support the NRA as "lazy" or "freeloaders," or implying that they're no different than the people actively trying to eliminate private firearms ownership does not endear your position to anyone. In some cases, it actually makes people dig their heels in even further. Trite as it may be, the old adage that you catch more flies with honey than vinegar certainly holds true, but if you insist on always taking a hardline stance I suppose that's your prerogative.

 

[CoMF]

My point is, I'll bet the average anti-gun Congress Critter would not recognize a reference to the "SAF." Every one of them, though, knows what the NRA is.

If it wasn't for the SAF, we wouldn't have DC vs. Heller. "Name recognition" ain't everything, red.

 

[ladder13]

Note that the SAF isn't listed on this forum as a good old boy club with the badge in the members window like the NRA is.

I believe if you have a complaint or suggestion about forum ops, the forum office would be the place to go.

 

[Biginge]

I didn't realize I was trying to endear my position. It seems like some folks should realize that I could care less about theirs.

I gonna start a forum to fight for more roadside parks with comfort stations. I betcha I get grief for that too.

 

[LostintheOzone]

I believe if you have a complaint or suggestion about forum ops, the forum office would be the place to go.

Thanks, I guess.

 

[george minze]

My honest thoughts on membership in the NRA....Back in 63 I was a bulls eye three gun shooter...All matches with the few open matches were NRA sanctioned. The NRA was the sanction body for class qualification...Matches were run by class contest.. 4 classes....You moved up in class depending on a average of scores in past matches...The NRA also had shooter safety classes and youth classes..Some were in conjunction with the Boy Scouts...etc. etc. Over the years the question of concealed carry just didn't come up in most states....Very few had concealed carry laws with out any job pre-condition . Police, armed guards. armed messengers. RR police etc...Were covered by statute....Civilian concealed carry was almost unheard of... Some states had open carry laws, and I understand some states had no specific statutes concerning carry..The NRA didn't have to fight for carry laws, basically because there were very few to start with The NRA to their credit or because they were sort off forced into it had to take on the CCW question. Member pressure and the mood at the time made it necessary to move toward carry legislation..I imagine Wayne about had a heart attach....His job became much more difficult, and maybe he didn't always have his heart into it 100% ???...Hard to tell...I personally think he makes enough to throw himself whole heart into the question...One thing for sure the die is cast and the NRA is in the fight to the finish..Pure self survival is now on the line...Now I don't agree with every position they take, as I imagine many on this forum don't either. Overall they do and have to be our biggest supporter...That is enough for me to pay my dues and give lip service to the origination...I don't have to agree on every thing...The one thing they have going for them that not many if any group has is congress really doesn't want to get the NRA on their case. Has the NRA backed some people that only give lip service to gun owners...Look at Nevada and you know that answer...I'm sure the NRA has thought why do we support this and that person just because they say they are for gun ownership..Nuff said on that topic....I get upset by their professional putting the bit on members just like every body else....I just weigh the benefits and the disadvantage..To me the question is easy they produce more advantages than non-advantages..Pure and simple if the NRA wasn't there I think we would not have every state with some type of concealed carry law on the books...Granted some are there with all kind of hindrances but still there..So I guess I'm saying I'll take the help from those who can produce it.......Right now it seems that the NRA gets the most notice and has the most clout.....So I will pay my dues and complain about all the fund raising calls and hope they maintain their clout...The more members the more clout.....I don't need a Masters Degree to figure that one out.....Just my opinion......But gun owners have the best conditions that we have ever had.....Even the Socialist Republic of
Chicago has to get on board sometime.....I'll admit kicking and screaming.....Being a member might not be perfect but it sure beats the next best thing as we speak...

 

[Newgene]

Not being in NRA doesn't mean nothing being done to protect gun rights. Non members can write to senators, congress men, presidents as well as members. Their are other groups associated with gun rights.

+1............