OAL for .45acp in a 1911

[EMT Edu]

I'm looking for recommendations for a correct OAL for my 1911. I've seen and tried several lengths from 1.185 (which didn't work at all) up to and including 1.255". and am still having a feeding problem. The last hundred round experiment I loaded to 1.240" with more than enough FTFeed.

I'm not absolutely sure that this is my only issue, but fixing one thing at a time. Thanks for any input.

Terry

 

[m657]

Take a sample of factory loads that DO work in your 1911, then try a few of your own reloads the same length in several magazines.

I've used everything within the range in the reloading manuals. More than one OAL works good. I tend to favor 1.235 end of the scale working with 230 RNL and HP38. The shorter 1.185 hasn't worked as reliably for me.

Except revolvers.

Do your rounds fail to fit the chamber? or what?

Years ago my first 45 acp die just wouldn't throw reliable loads. After much effort, I finally used a case gauge which proved the die itself was out of spec. The factory replaced it at no charge and all was good then.

Don't give up, keep eliminating the potential points of error. This is a learning process.

 

[Harrison]

Just make sure the round it is not too long to feed through the magazine or fit in the chamber. A properly ramped 1911 ought to feed most anything. Mine has even fed full wadcutters. If you are having feeding problems with good mags, and reasonable rounds they you probably have a barrel/ramp fitting problem. Take it to a good 1911 mechanic and have him look at it. Every gunsmith isn't into the fine points of 1911 function. Find one that is.

 

[epj]

One important piece of the puzzle left out is the size and shape of the bullet. I load a H&G68 style bullet at 1.25-1.26 and it will feed fine in all my 1911's and other .45 autos as well. Too wimpy a load may cause problems as well. If your gun feeds factory loads with no problem, try the same OAL as the factory load. Also, take your barrel out of the gun and use it as a case gauge on some of your reloads. The .45ACP needs to have a taper crimp of about .471. Some go as tight as .469, though I've never had to go that tight. In some cases a Lee Factory Crimp die can solve these type issues.

 

[EMT Edu]

I'm shooting a lswc round, I believe what is called the H&G68 style. I'm loading 5.4 gr of Unique, and/or 5.1 gr of VV N320 that was given to me. Neither of these should be considered wimpy, at least according to the manual and online data I've found. I had loaded some with 5.0 gr of Unique and the gun wouldn't cycle.

The round seems to be hanging on the feed ramp. One thing I've found and attempting to fix is a large build up of crud on the feed ramp after only 50-100 rnds. I believe from reading here and other places that I'm over oiling the gun. I was careful this last time I cleaned to use a minimum amount.

I have also been adjusting the crimp. I have a relatively new Lee die set, and per their web sight my seating die is also a crimp die. I had increased the crimp, but thought I had suffered in accuracy, so I've been slowly backing off.

The rounds that fail to feed will easily drop into the chamber by hand and fire when shot. This is why I think the length is part of the problem.

I have several rounds loaded now at 1.240 and 1.255 inches and hope to shoot this afternoon or at least this weekend sometime.

Thanks for the ideas.

 

[stumper]

I always found 1.25" to work well for SWC and JHP bullets. 1.26" for FMJ bullets.

 

[Ron H.]

I'm shooting a lswc round, I believe what is called the H&G68 style. I'm loading 5.4 gr of Unique, and/or 5.1 gr of VV N320 that was given to me. Neither of these should be considered wimpy, at least according to the manual and online data I've found. I had loaded some with 5.0 gr of Unique and the gun wouldn't cycle.

The round seems to be hanging on the feed ramp. One thing I've found and attempting to fix is a large build up of crud on the feed ramp after only 50-100 rnds. I believe from reading here and other places that I'm over oiling the gun. I was careful this last time I cleaned to use a minimum amount.

I have also been adjusting the crimp. I have a relatively new Lee die set, and per their web sight my seating die is also a crimp die. I had increased the crimp, but thought I had suffered in accuracy, so I've been slowly backing off.

The rounds that fail to feed will easily drop into the chamber by hand and fire when shot. This is why I think the length is part of the problem.

I have several rounds loaded now at 1.240 and 1.255 inches and hope to shoot this afternoon or at least this weekend sometime.

Thanks for the ideas.

Sir, FWIW, I load that style bullet with just a sliver of the front band showing outside the case mouth, and crimped to 0.470 inch. OAL runs around 1.235 inches. These run perfectly in my box-stock old Colt.

Your Unique load, despite being listed as max on Alliant's site, actually is very mild. It works fine with the old standard 16-pound recoil spring, but a gun with an "extra power" recoil spring might have problems with it. That your gun won't cycle the 5.0-grain Unique load (which runs fine in my gun), makes me suspect you've got a pretty stiff recoil spring. Try a 16-pound spring and see what happens.

It could also be that your feed ramp needs a little cleaning up, but I'd try the recoil spring first--it's cheaper and reversible.

Hope this helps, and Semper Fi.

Ron H.

 

[Skip Sackett]

OK, maybe I missed it but EMT, what firearm are you using these loads in? I am going to assume a 1911. Now we need to know what kind. If it is a S&W, I find it hard to believe that it won't feed. I currently have a Taurus PT1911 and it simply eats everything I feed it, with the exception of an H&G #502, 240gr LSWC that I cast myself.

I have two styles of H&G #68's. One a Lee clone and one an authentic H&G. Both work flawlessly at 1.250" in my firearms. I do shoot these in a M625 too.

Make up rounds that fit the magazines, meet the recipe minimum OAL and fit in the chamber. Here is what one reloading brother does: Take a factory RN round and set your seating and crimping die with it. Then use the same settings to seat and crimp your LSWC load. One caution: If you go below the listed recipe OAL, you must reduce the charge weight of the powder and work your load up from there. I would reduce a minimum load by .5gr for every .030" of an inch deeper of bullet depth. Not always the same as OAL.

Some times it is hard to get a grip on the difference between the two. Not trying to be confusing but sometimes bullets of the same weight have greatly different lengths. If set to the same OAL, the longer bullet will seat deeper in the case. Enemy #1 of pistol ammo, seating depth.

 

[EMT Edu]

Thanks for the ideas... I'm shooting a SW1911DK. I have been experimenting with a higher powder load, slowly sneaking up to 6 gr of Unique. I'll give some of this a try and see if I have any better luck. Thanks again.

 

[shovelwrench]

Its very likely your feed issue is more of a mechanical problem then a reloading problem.

Exactly what position is the loaded round in when the gun jambs/misfeeds?

Also a Pic of the offending round in the jambed position would help.

1911s can have feeding problems for lots of reason, its very unlikely that a S&W won't feed because of OAL, considering you have allready run the gambit of length.

 

[fredj338]

First, your 200gr load w/ 5.4gr of Unique is a bit on the wimpy side, probably not making much over 700fps. That could be one issue. If the bullet is a H&G or copy, an OAL of 1.25"+/- should feed fine. That would have just about 0.05" of shoulder above the case mouth. I have fired 1000s in 4 diff 1911s, including my S&W1911PD. I run them over 800fps though, which means getting your Unique charge wt up closer to 6gr.
The gun is designed to run at full speed. Sluggish slide return could be the issue. If dummy rounds will hand cylce, then you just need more ummph. I recommend making up only 10rd test batches. Start w/ 5.8gr, then 5.9gr, then 6gr. I run 6gr under a 230grLRN for just about 850fps in a 5", pretty much duplicates ball ammo. With a 200gr, you will b close to 825fps or so.

 

[hogblue]

Shovelhead probably has the problem nailed down. Through the years I've found that most problems with semi autos are magazine generated.

The load I prefer for my Smith 1911 is 200 gr LRN from Bushwhacker out of Lamar MO., 1.260 OAL and 5.0 gr Hodgdon HP-38 or Win 231. Both the same powder. Loads are like cookies, everyone likes something different but they all end up in the same place.

 

[EMT Edu]

Thanks everyone for your ideas. It's lots to digest and process.

 

[w2kbr]

Well...you might try this, if you haven't done so.
Strip the 1911......set a bullet in an empty case (no powder, no primer).
Set the bullet at the longest OAL. Then place the test bullet in the chamber. The case should go "all the way in". If the case protudes, re-set the test bullet a bit deeper..trial and error, until the test cartridge, is fully chambered, and still very easy to extract. When you get to that point, check the OAL. Load 5 rounds "LIVE" and test fire.

Regards

 

[don p]

My 1911 does NOT like LSWC. I tried some that a friend loaded and had feeding problems. I'll stick with my 230 grain hard cast lead ball. Down here the lead ball and wad cutters are the same price. Load and shoot ball

 

[w2kbr]

Well, ...initially my 1911 did not like them either..would feed jacketed all day long......so, I went thru the process of finding out when the bullet would fall in the chamber and exit w/o a pull, and then measured the OAL...adjusted the load, and Bingo, no feed problems..I guess it depends on the shape of the nose of the LSWC, and the OAL....

I don't like LSWC cause they leave a lead "trail" in the chamber and barrel...so I run JFN........and pay the extra pennies....

Regards, R

 

[woodysan]

OAL?

I load my .45 cal to 1.251, and my three 1911s do not have a problem with this. I have increased my powder to 5.8 grs of HP-38 with really good results. Good luck, Woody PS I use different weight bullets and follow my Lee reloading manual to the Tee.

 

[woodysan]

I load my .45 cal to 1.251, and my three 1911s do not have a problem with this. I have increased my powder to 5.8 grs of HP-38 with really good results. Good luck, Woody PS I use different weight bullets and follow my Lee reloading manual to the Tee.

also sometimes I pull a barrel and slide my reloads in to make sure they fit ok.

 

[rambuster1]

I had some feeding problems with an AMT .45 many years ago. I polished the feed ramp and started using a seating/taper crimp die. I leave about 1/16 inch of the front band exposed. I shoot 200 gr. swc. My gun is now totally reliable. I have not had any jams in years. I use a small amount of white lithium grease for lube. No oil.

 

[Joni_Lynn]

I use the 200 lswc H&G style bullet with anywhere from 5.0 of HP38 to 5.6 and they all function my different 1911's just fine with 16 and 18 pound recoil springs.
I use a length of 1.255" and crimp to .469
The lips of the magazine might be a problem but it's doubtful. A lot of mags have an abrupt release which doesn't always work. Colt mags and the hybrid made by Checkmate have a gradual release design which works well.
Good luck.