chaparrito
Member
That kind of behavior wouldn't be tolerated on a shooting range and shouldn't be tolerated anywhere else. It's not only unsettling to others it's potentially dangerous and just plain rude.
Open Carry In Public Restaurants - What Would You Do?
- Thread starter PA Reb
- Start date
chaparrito
Member
I'd have asked to be moved and not made an issue out of it. Who wants to sit and eat a paid for meal with the business end of a gun pointed at your loved ones? Not my idea of a good time.
bigmoneylewis
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Personally, I would not worry about it . I do understand the concern , especially with loved ones involved , but the way I figure it, having a loaded gun pointed at you is no big deal. Heck, right now, as many loaded guns as I have in various desks, dressers, shelves their is probably at least a couple pointing at me at this very moment.
When you pull up at a red light, the guy next to you in a pickup probably has one under the seat pointed right at you .
When you walk out of the restaraunt into the parking lot, as you make your way to your car, their will be several cars pointing directly at you . Some may even have a driver behind the wheel with the engine running . A 4,500 lbs automobile is just as deadly (if not more so) than a .45 auto . The main thing is , the guy seated near your family did not have his hand on his gun . If the gun was drawn and in the guys hand and sweeping all around the customers , that's a totally diffrent story. Sure some freak accident could cause the gun to go off, but just as easily some old guy in the parking lot might stand on the accelerator instead of the brake and plow you and your family over .
I think it is too much paranoia over nothing , but that's just me personally.
Lewis
When you pull up at a red light, the guy next to you in a pickup probably has one under the seat pointed right at you .
When you walk out of the restaraunt into the parking lot, as you make your way to your car, their will be several cars pointing directly at you . Some may even have a driver behind the wheel with the engine running . A 4,500 lbs automobile is just as deadly (if not more so) than a .45 auto . The main thing is , the guy seated near your family did not have his hand on his gun . If the gun was drawn and in the guys hand and sweeping all around the customers , that's a totally diffrent story. Sure some freak accident could cause the gun to go off, but just as easily some old guy in the parking lot might stand on the accelerator instead of the brake and plow you and your family over .
I think it is too much paranoia over nothing , but that's just me personally.
Lewis
bigmoneylewis
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And another thing, just think about how many people carry LCPs, Beretta Bobcats or whatever "pocket pistol" in a front pocket . What do you think happens when they sit down . They are pointing a loaded gun at everybody in front of them . The barrel is positioned horizontally and they are probably having dinner with their wife , with their gun pointing right at her .
Lewis
Lewis
Half cock? Meanwhile, with a retention strap between the hammer and the frame, this doesn't sound as bad as it did initially. A little harder to get excited about this one.
OP
PA Reb
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OP
PA Reb
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I can guarantee you mine isn't. (A) I have no round in the chamber (B) I make sure the inner material in my pocket is off to my side so the gun is pointed down (C) Or it's in my back pocket pointed down.
I'm outta this one folks!
Holster and Gun Falsehoods Abound
Perhaps some of the unfounded concern regarding just where a holstered firearm is pointed stems from people who have had un-intended discharges and their lawyers. Someone who shoots themselves in the foot or backside incident to holstering/unholstering, often cannot take the embarrassment of being truthful with their friends and co-workers, especially LEOs. It's easier to blame the gun or the holster or both, then file a suit, make some money.
The last case I worked, the plaintiff claimed the "defective" holster not only chambered a round in his M1911 but also discharged it, the bullet entering his leg. Using an identical holster, try as I might, I COULD NOT DUPLICATE THE PLAINTIFF'S CLAIM AND I COULD NOT MAKE THE HOLSTER DISCHARGE THE M1911 NOT MATTER HOW I TRIED. But, the holster company settled out of court and made a cash settlement with the plaintiff.
Then, there are the guns that fired when dropped, sat upon, or whose safety was broken, or simply went off by itself.
These cases make the papers because the left-leaning press loves an opportunity to denigrate firearms and their owners. The end result is that large segments of the public, including gun people, half-believe the tripe they read and hear about. It is understandable then, that being swept by a holstered handgun may cause anxiety in some people.
My best advice is to tune out properly holstered handguns. Modern pistols and revolvers won't discharge on their own. As others here have said, you're being swept all the time by guns you can't see. In my 30 years of law enforcement, I have swept thousands of co-workers, members of the public, even family members, with my slant-shoulder rig. If this carry method represented a threat to the public, the Consumer Product safety Commission would have banned them decades ago.
Perhaps some of the unfounded concern regarding just where a holstered firearm is pointed stems from people who have had un-intended discharges and their lawyers. Someone who shoots themselves in the foot or backside incident to holstering/unholstering, often cannot take the embarrassment of being truthful with their friends and co-workers, especially LEOs. It's easier to blame the gun or the holster or both, then file a suit, make some money.
The last case I worked, the plaintiff claimed the "defective" holster not only chambered a round in his M1911 but also discharged it, the bullet entering his leg. Using an identical holster, try as I might, I COULD NOT DUPLICATE THE PLAINTIFF'S CLAIM AND I COULD NOT MAKE THE HOLSTER DISCHARGE THE M1911 NOT MATTER HOW I TRIED. But, the holster company settled out of court and made a cash settlement with the plaintiff.
Then, there are the guns that fired when dropped, sat upon, or whose safety was broken, or simply went off by itself.
These cases make the papers because the left-leaning press loves an opportunity to denigrate firearms and their owners. The end result is that large segments of the public, including gun people, half-believe the tripe they read and hear about. It is understandable then, that being swept by a holstered handgun may cause anxiety in some people.
My best advice is to tune out properly holstered handguns. Modern pistols and revolvers won't discharge on their own. As others here have said, you're being swept all the time by guns you can't see. In my 30 years of law enforcement, I have swept thousands of co-workers, members of the public, even family members, with my slant-shoulder rig. If this carry method represented a threat to the public, the Consumer Product safety Commission would have banned them decades ago.
That's going to open a whole nother can of worms
keith44spl
Member
Originally Posted by PA Reb
BUT, I just didn't like the direction it was pointed. It also gave me the opportunity to plainly see the gun was in my opinion at condition one or combat ready as
the hammer was at half cock and the retention strap was between the hammer and the frame
- all of which led me to believe (but not know for certain) there was probably a round in the chamber and ready to go.
.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
.
That hammer safety/retention strap between the hammer and frame is old school....
Folks have carried pistols in all manners over the years...
Cocked & Locked, cocked and unlocked, half cocked, some with the grip safeties tied or pinned down, etc...
Ranger Charlie Miller was known to carry in a peculiar fashion...
And we all have heard what he (Miller) had to say about that.
.
In closing, concealment does not keep one from being 'muzzled' by a firearm.
Lots of folks manufacture those horizontal shoulder rigs and horizontal 'small of back',
as well as cross-draw holsters that lay flat along the belt line.
Somebody must still be buying em, as most makers still catalog them.
BTW, I won't build em, ever.
Su Amigo,
Dave
Last edited:
Two issues here I think:
The horizontal type shoulder holster. My opinion of them is negative. When the primary rules of gun safety are to always assume a gun is loaded AND to never, ever point a gun at anything you don't intent to shoot,,
the holster and carry style really goes outside those simple safety standards.
There's long threads here in the past complaining of being 'swept' by people handling guns at shows and shops.
Those are assumed to be unloaded,,but you never know and it makes you nervous and angry to get that treatment from the seemingly not-thinking gun handlers.
A loaded gun purposely pointed at yourself or others while carrying it makes little sense. I don't care how much training and safety certificates the gun owner , gun or holster has.
Doesn't make any more safety sense than a design that would somehow point the loaded gun forward at family and friends of the gun owner at the table.
As far as open carry, I won't myself,,seems to draw attention where it's not wanted. But I do support those that can and legally do so if they choose.
But safety first. It's a responsibility you take on,,a very big responsibility no matter which method is used.
Just my .02
Be careful
The horizontal type shoulder holster. My opinion of them is negative. When the primary rules of gun safety are to always assume a gun is loaded AND to never, ever point a gun at anything you don't intent to shoot,,
the holster and carry style really goes outside those simple safety standards.
There's long threads here in the past complaining of being 'swept' by people handling guns at shows and shops.
Those are assumed to be unloaded,,but you never know and it makes you nervous and angry to get that treatment from the seemingly not-thinking gun handlers.
A loaded gun purposely pointed at yourself or others while carrying it makes little sense. I don't care how much training and safety certificates the gun owner , gun or holster has.
Doesn't make any more safety sense than a design that would somehow point the loaded gun forward at family and friends of the gun owner at the table.
As far as open carry, I won't myself,,seems to draw attention where it's not wanted. But I do support those that can and legally do so if they choose.
But safety first. It's a responsibility you take on,,a very big responsibility no matter which method is used.
Just my .02
Be careful
