Opinions wanted regarding 32 Safety Hammerless 1st Model

[Jcon72]

I know these old guns aren't highly collectible (nor particularly high on my personal wish list), but according to the SCSW the .32 New Departure 1st model was "scarce" in a blue finish and I'm curious as to what exactly that means in relation to these guns and how it affects their value.
A local gun shop has this 3" model that I've committed to buying and should be picking it up later this week. It seems to be in pretty good condition for its age, including the grips that so often are chipped/cracked/broken. This was somewhat of an impulse purchase not only because it is a blue one but also because I was able to get it for what seemed to be a pretty reasonable price. You might say it's one of those "just because" purchases.
Unfortunately I won't have better quality pictures to post until later in the week when it comes home, but I was wanting some educated input from those of you who are much more knowledgeable than me on these oldies. In order to keep people's opinions as objective as possible I won't yet disclose just how much I paid.
So what do ya'll think? Honest opinions, please!
Also, the serial number is 65xxx. The closest I can estimate is that its birth date would likely be somewhere around 1896-1898; does that sound about right?

 

[opoefc]

65K serial range is around 1894, or so. I don't think the market is affected to much for a 1st model because it's blue and not nickle plated. The wear evident on your gun keeps it from having any collector value, so it's value will be as a shooter, if in good mechanical condition. Ed

 

[mrcvs]

Many of these were stored in bedside table drawers for decades and remain in pristine condition, so the condition of yours ultimately hurts the collector value. Nonetheless, you could shoot it a few times and not really hurt the value. I would be inclined to use black powder given the quality of steel used circa 1894.

 

[Jcon72]

Many of these were stored in bedside table drawers for decades and remain in pristine condition, so the condition of yours ultimately hurts the collector value. Nonetheless, you could shoot it a few times and not really hurt the value. I would be inclined to use black powder given the quality of steel used circa 1894.

Maybe I'm lazy, but I would rather handload some mild smokeless ammo just to have a little fun with the gun than deal with the hassle of cleaning corrosive BP residue from it.

 

[glowe]

There were 91,417 of this model made and almost 250,000 32 Safety revolvers made. What is worse for the collector is that the survival rate appears to be very high. As noted, there were several other things going against the little 32 Safety. Many remain in excellent condition, even with original boxes. The caliber is very anemic and not popular and the gun is so small it is hard to shoot with any degree of accuracy.

On the positive side, with many companies making safety revolver, they are the best quality safety revolver made back then. They were also extremely safe and could be carried with all cylinders loaded with no concerns. They were so small that they fit in a pocket, purse, or just about anywhere else without notice. This model seems to be very robust and few mechanical issues are found even on the well used examples.

For the collector, all 1st Model 32 Safeties are classified as antiques, but there does not seem to be a value add for the antique status over the "modern" 2nd and 3rd Models. Using the SWCA database, roughly 15% of all listed were nickel and the guns surrounding your serial number shipped from 1894 to 1896.

Value is a little hard to determine since several sell on Gunbroker and one can do a search of sold guns and their prices. Problem is that there is no way to clearly determine value since the "same" condition guns seem to sell for a big spread in prices paid. Overall, a 32 Safety in your condition sold for an average spread of $200 to $300. There are between 55 and 60 32 Safeties sold in the last 30 days on GB.

The quality of steel did not change between 1890 and 1899. Actually, there were no important improvements made in steel tensile strength until the 1910s to 1920s. Standard tensile strength of structural steel was 30,000 psi and alloys used in the firearm industry would have likely been closer to 50,000 psi. 32 S&W is a very weak round and pressures were very low, under 12.000 psi.

It is also important to recall that 32 ACP was commonly used in this revolver when one could not find 32 S&W, so most were likely shot with both caliber ammo. 32 ACP is designed to achieve 17,000 psi, which I would not recommend shooting in those top-break designs today.

 

[Jcon72]

For the collector, all 1st Model 32 Safeties are classified as antiques, but there does not seem to be a value add for the antique status over the "modern" 2nd and 3rd Models. Using the SWCA database, roughly 15% of all listed were nickel and the guns surrounding your serial number shipped from 1894 to 1896.

Thank you for taking the time to type all of that, Gary. I'm a little confused by your above comment, though, regarding blue/nickel numbers since the SWCA claims blue 1st Models are "scarce". Or are you saying that 15% "of ALL production .32 Safety Hammerless" (not just the 1st Model) were blue?
As stated before, I'm certainly no expert on these but it just seems to me that the overwhelming majority of the ones that I see for sale tend to be nickel.
I know this isn't an expensive gun but my inquiring mind always likes to know background details on things like this.

 

[mrcvs]

I tend to stick to black powder rounds in early firearms. Even the Colt Single Action Army revolver should be fired black powder only if production is before 1905.

This graph, and the pressure spike, explains why.

 

[H Richard]

Shooter grade prices remain fairly low, in the $300 to $400 range of in decent condition. I sold these about 18 months ago and all were in that price range.
a First Mod, 2nd Mod and 3rd Mod.

 

[Jcon72]

Thanks, guys. This one is costing $225 out the door (including tax and FFL transfer) so it sounds like a reasonable deal as I suspected. These aren't the type of revolver I want to make a habit of collecting but a guy almost has to have at least one of them, IMO. And while it's not pristine it's gotta be a lot better than *I* would look at the age of 125.
It was actually incorrectly described on GunBroker by my local gun shop as a 4th Model; maybe that's why it didn't sell for a little more? Here's the listing if anyone wants to take a look:
Attention Required! | Cloudflare

 

[glowe]

I tend to stick to black powder rounds in early firearms. Even the Colt Single Action Army revolver should be fired black powder only if production is before 1905.

This graph, and the pressure spike, explains why.

That is a meaningless chart. Anyone can show that difference without regards to the type of powder, load specifics, etc. You cannot just throw up a pressure curve from an un-named smokeless load and compare it to BP.

The purpose of load comparison is to build a smokeless round that matches a particular BP round and is done all the time. I have a folder full of studies from credible sources that show pressure curves matching smokeless to BP. It is not rocket science, and you can bet that ammunition companies have long since done that very thing in building commercial ammo that matches (and usually is below) pressure curves of original BP ammunition.

As far as shotgun shooting is concerned, A researcher by the name of Sherman Bell did extensive studies on reloading to match BP rounds and proved that inch per inch pressures in barrels can be duplicated almost perfectly. A couple charts are below and show pressure curves for a few loads, all designed and shot to 1200 fps. These charts were published in a detailed research article in Double Gun Journal back many years ago.

. . . and yes I am going to continue to harp on these old wives tales ad nauseam when presented with meaningless charts and statements not based in fact.

 

[glowe]

. . . As stated before, I'm certainly no expert on these but it just seems to me that the overwhelming majority of the ones that I see for sale tend to be nickel.
I know this isn't an expensive gun but my inquiring mind always likes to know background details on things like this.

I was referring to 1st Model examples only. The database is a random collection of posting from SWCA members over many years. Not used much today for new entries, but remains a reliable source of information like this. Yes, the 1st Model guns in the database showed 15% blued guns. Checking GB sold guns from the last 30 days shows 20 blued 32 Safeties from all model guns out of 55 ended auctions. That is 35% blued guns. I do not recall that there is any documentation available that confirms the scarcity of blued Safeties, so maybe not as uncommon as once thought???