Perfection versus Character

[Sprefix]

My question is up for consideration and deliberation, possibly even some heated argument. Why does it have to be so perfect? A- I'm a collector and that's what is the most desirable for my investment. B- I'm a shooter and want the most desirable for my investment. OK, Why is the shooter with character so over-looked? I want a gun to be nice and serviceable. I can do with out pitting and gross changes in parts. I think we can agree here. I, however, totally love a gun that has a "history" and "character" and the marks to prove it. That is another form of provinance that I can enjoy (and afford). Character is what we see in a movie actor that we can see a part of ourselves in. It is what we see in "Old Blue", you know...., the '70 Chevy that always starts and never lets us down. It is the 3" long gouge in the stock from sliding down the pert'near vertical cliff when we were after that 6X6 elk we finally got in '81 down in Colorado. Sometimes, it seems that our Royalty comes out when we want to make a purchase. A ring in the barrel suxx, and a chopped-up set of Cokes is a travesty, but they sure can(or do) add character to the firearm as long as they are functional. As long as the gun hasn't flat-out been abused, character can be "cool". I know that I don't want to un-box and shoot a museum piece. I'd love to pull a sweet old lever-gun, say 80 or a hundred years old out of a ranchers safe, and put a few rounds down the south pasture at a "bandit" on the run. Not too long ago, a dear friend of mine that has passed was at the local range with another mutual friend and handed me a 90-something year old Colt Bisley 4 3/4" .45 and said "Put a few downrange and see what you think." I did just that and WOW, what a great shooting old revolver. It was pretty used and was not short on patina and the grips were a bit smoother than they were in the early days, But it was a seriously fine handgun with some character and stories that will never be told. Now, we have plastic and Realwood overlays and picatinny rails that I'm sure will earn many stories of great shooting feats by man and woman, far and wide. Maybe someday, they too, will have character. Pictures of your guns with character and history are welcomed (and begged for). Your fine collections are beckoned for(drooling towels at the ready). Make your case for perfection or character. Show a piece of history (yours or someone else's), and tell a story about it. Even a tall tale is sure to be interesting. Take some of us younger guys and girls back in time when the world was much more black and white, good and bad, and you did or died. Thanks...............

 

[captorquewrench]

I am new to gun ownership...they were around in the house when I was growing up, and we were taught how to shoot and handle them. So after a long time without having guns, aside from an old 12 gauge shotgun, my husband and I are keeping and carrying.

What I can relate to, from another standpoint, is character. As a musician, I love to have horns with character. I've played "perfect" horns new from the manufacturer, and I hate them. They have no story, no experience, no individual tweaking or distinctive flaws that show off their beauty.

My daily player is about 15 years old. Even for a more moern horn, it has an OK story (sadly, an all-too common one, music school dropout kept it in the closet) but it has its flaws. There are a couple of things I keep having to take it back to my tech for, mostly they are my own fault from my playing habits, but that horn and I are a match. There are thousands of the same model out there, and I played some of them, but they just aren't the same. I guess it's like cars. My mom drives the same model car I do, but a year newer. I hate driving her car, and I think it's more than just she opted for auto transmission. The butt groove in the seat isn't the same, we haven't have the near death scrapes like I have had in mine...Anyway, when I play another horn, even one of my own, it feels kind of like I'm cheating on my spouse.

Here's a horn with character story. A school I worked at some years back had a horn in storage. It was old, old, old! The case falling apart, tarnished black, and something was seized up. And it just sat there. So it got to where during off periods, I would take it out and slowly do minor adjustments. Then came "cleaning out the storage room" I came in, and it was in a pile marked "basura" So I took it home, did some research on serial numbers etc, and a lot of Tarn X and elbow grease later, I have it. One kid marches with it, sometimes I use it for big band stuff (hey, it's 75 years old!) but I have to tell you...it has character. It's a monster to play, and we fight each other, but there is a certain je ne sais quoi about it...I can't give it up even though I do not get much face time on it. It's a conversation starter and a looker, and we have a sort of understanding with each other.

I don't know, but I think I am finding, as a new gun owner, that I am gravitating to more character than perfection along the same philosophical lines as with my horns.

Having said that, sometimes for the every day, we have to sacrifice character for practicality. For carry, I think I'd like to err on the side of perfection even though I always want some character in everything.

Does that even make any sense at all?

 

[Goldstar225]

I respect those with the funds to purchase and collect those "perfect" examples of older guns and keep them safe. Since I don't have the means to do that I'll content myself to admire them when I see them.

While I occassionally buy a new gun, it won't stay new long. It's going to be shot and carried.

I also buy used guns to, well, use some more. Honest wear doesn't bother me, abuse and poor mechanical condition does so I pass them buy.

When I buy used, I don't see the wear as character, it's just honest wear by the prior owner(s). Character is the wear that I put on the guns and is part of the memory of experiences shared with friends and family.

 

[Fishslayer]

I like holster wear. I have zero interest in "collecting" and and a $2500 shooter is out of the question.

I like cop guns. Worn much & fired twice a year.

 

[DOEBOY1]

I like a little holster wear maybe a ding in the grips, I like these thing to be bought from collectors because they are not worthy of their collection. Being a gun accumulator I am more than willing to take the discount and have a shooter because, which one of your true friends reall wants to hold that perfect gun they will never be allowed to shoot it ? I have a few that have a turn ring and little to no blueing loss but those I can't take fishing ( never know when you might be attacked by a rainbow). My beat up 10-10 I could use it as a hammer (unloaded of course) or maybe a boomarang so It has multiple value. I lots several guns that have history. Doeboy

 

[Sprefix]

A Woodsman story......

I have a colt woodsman that a guy sold me that was made in '69. He was a customer of mine and said he needed to sell some guns as he was 83 years old and moving closer to his kids. He said they were not interested in having any of his dozen or so guns. I perused what he had for sale and got some prices and called a few friends of mine. They got some nice stuff for a fair price to both parties. I was eyeballing his 6" Colt Woodsman that was clearly a shooter and still in good shape. He said he taught his two boys and his daughter to shoot with it. I asked him if he was sure he wanted to part with it and he affirmed his earlier answer. He said he wished it got used for small game a lot more as it was so accurate and easy to shoot. He said his children had no interest at all and they didn't want to fuss with California law and guns of any kind. He made a few suggestions to them driving Subaru's and being involved in too much that wasn't their business. I chuckled and didn't ask any more questions. He thanked me for helping him get rid of his guns and told me how much Woodsmans' were going for around here. He smiled and said he only needed $200 for his and it came with a paupers fortune in ammo and a Bauer Bros. Holster that was purchased new with the gun. I complained and fussed to his enjoyment while I dug out the cash. He gave me some camping sundries as well as a fair assortment of fishing gear. I thanked him kindly and assured him it would carry on filling the pot. He was down close to his children and happy to be a small part of their lives for about a year before he pulled up stakes in this world and headed for the next. I got the woodsman out and wiped it down and thought of him and the fun he must have had teaching his kids to shoot. What a shame that they don't have the fondness of the memories or the desire to have such a fun and bonding piece of their past. I guess it's good for me as I now have it and can't resist popping a grouse or ptarmigan with it.

 

[Gutpile Charlie]

Hey Captorquewrench....another Kappa Kappa Psi member here.

I am a 1963 music ed graduate of Oklahoma State University (alpha chapter). Played brass and taught for a few years before I found out I could make more money doing something else!

I have a "like new in box" King Master Model Silver Sonic cornet that was given to me by a music dealer when I graduated. I covered the case with a canvas cover, took care of it, and you can not tell that it is nearly fifty years old.

As a band director, I also pulled old horns out of the storage room and tried to bring them back to life.

 

[Andy Griffith]

I've been told many times I am a perfect character...I just don't know which one they are referring- Popeye or Bluto...

Does that count?

 

[Sprefix]

I've been told many times I am a perfect character...I just don't know which one they are referring- Popeye or Bluto...

Does that count?

hahahahahhahahahahaaa

 

[P&R Fan]

I truly understand what you're saying, but I have to qualify it a bit.
If I'm at a gun show and I see a nice revolver, I'm going to pay less for one in 80% condition than one in 98% condition. That doesn't mean the more worn gun isn't as good a shooter, it's just more worn, which means if I or my heirs ever sell it it will be worth less on the open market.
Now, I have several guns that I or my Dad or Grandpa put honest wear marks on. Those are priceless to me, because they hold special memories. However, if they were ever sold (not in MY lifetime) the buyers would rightfully expect to pay less because of wear. Now, I suppose if they had belonged to Elmer Keith or somebody famous, that would actually increase their market value. I'm not famous, so with mine, not so much.
I personally like to shoot the guns I own. If it's just going to sit in the safe I feel it's a waste. Enough shooting/handling will eventually put a bit of wear on them. I'm OK with that, and of course I don't abuse them, I take good care of all my guns.
I have a client who has a 1987 Buick Grand National Turbo that her late Husband bought new. It is 99.9% original and perfect. I got to drive it the other day, it has 2,990 actual miles on it. I encourage her to take it out a few times a year to keep everything lubed up and working good. Fortunately when she does she lets me drive. (This is a VERY good client). I can see this car being 50 years old and still in the shape it is in now, with not that many miles on the odometer. It is worth a lot of money, because of it's condition. That is understandable, but somebody who wanted one of these for a driver would probably settle for one with 80,000 miles that was more affordable and could be regularly driven. Now a pure collector wants my client's car. It's all about what is important to you.

 

[Gun-runner]

I've always won this argument/discussion because I'm a perfect charactor!!

 

[G.T. Smith]

Here's character

I bought this 37 from a guy who kept telling me that his dad who left it to him when he died, (his father), that there was a good possibility that it had killed someone. He kept telling me that, and I kept telling him that I didn't care about that because it is only a tool and if it killed anything, it was only doing it's job for the shooter. Right or wrong.
The grips are the original grips and have the serial numbers stamped inside the right hand grip. They are beat to hell, with a few chunks missing and what appears to be dog teeth marks on the back and bottom. They are tight though and I will keep them with the gun, but I have a new set of grips because I just don't like the rough condition of the originals.
Other than that It shoots great and fairly accurate 25'. Good timing and lockup, no pitting in the barrel. It is a 1968 model and looks like it has been around the block. It definitely has character. Here is a couple pics of character
Peace,
gordon

 

[Sprefix]

Now that is what I'm talkin' bout. '68 was good year too. I have a few cherries, and I love them. I have no problems with perfection, I just want to see some "characters" get their due. If any of you gents had a flawless 20 something year old female (assuming one exists)(LOL), would you just walk by in admiration on occasion? Something tells me the truthful answer is...well......heck no. You ladies can use that question inserting Juan the cabana boy. Sometimes you must put perfection through the paces to appreciate it. JMO......