powder coated bullets pt2

[Maximumbob54]

You have your own lathe. That's almost like cheating.

Here's another thought on WC's. Just set them nose down and load them with what little crimp you use if any so they are just a hair out still. I bet they shoot just fine.

I need to try this. Y'er killing me.

Edit: I forgot to ask, was this just using jacketed .30-06 data for the yeller bullet bullseye shooters???

 

[venomballistics]

You have your own lathe. That's almost like cheating.

Here's another thought on WC's. Just set them nose down and load them with what little crimp you use if any so they are just a hair out still. I bet they shoot just fine.

I need to try this. Y'er killing me.

yeah, I'd clearly call it "optional" reloading equipment
but if your like me, where your driven to experiment, Machines start to make some sense.
The tool to keep an eye on is the laser sintering 3d printer.
You might afford a Porsche before you afford an LSP but the prospect of printing 3D steel off of a CAD draft is delicious.

Im between calibers at the loading bench for now, with PCed 45 ACP the only thing left to stuff and store.
that'll be followed by more pictures and then some time at the alter of manhood (lathe), where I will set up for a trek a little farther off the "by the numbers" reloading reservation and punch out a few molds with coating in mind

 

[Maximumbob54]

I've seen the 3D printed 1911 they made a year or two ago. I'm just waiting for the registered magnum setting. Then I will sell a lung, kindey, or whatever it takes.

Since you have your own lathe, is that to say you could be boring your own mold blocks??? If so, I've tried a couple of no lube groove molds and I have to say they are great. The first decent looking .30 cal no lube groove mold I see I may have to jump on it. So far I've tried a 135gr 9mm and 230gr .45 ACP and wow the accuracy with coating...

 

[venomballistics]

You have your own lathe. That's almost like cheating.

Here's another thought on WC's. Just set them nose down and load them with what little crimp you use if any so they are just a hair out still. I bet they shoot just fine.

I need to try this. Y'er killing me.

Edit: I forgot to ask, was this just using jacketed .30-06 data for the yeller bullet bullseye shooters???

no ... that load is way off the reservation from when I was playing heavy with a suppressor.
It is a stepped up variant of a series of loads that tamed the blast down to a discrete ping.
I played with it so extensively I know it inside and out, and was quite confident in using it as a starting point.

10.8 grains of blue dot, winchester standard large rifle priming, mixed brass, mostly remington this time, and the Lee 150G flat point I picked up at a gunshow on a lark back in the 90's for all of $6

The base subsonic parent load was somewhere between 7.8 and 8.4 grains, using the Lee 150FP, 180 RN and 200 RN with a Fed 215 magnum primer.
I say "somewhere" because it changes a little from lot to lot and needed to be retuned for each lot of powder.
it gave an ES in the single digits and 1" accuracy@ 100 Yards

 

[venomballistics]

I've seen the 3D printed 1911 they made a year or two ago. I'm just waiting for the registered magnum setting. Then I will sell a lung, kindey, or whatever it takes.

Since you have your own lathe, is that to say you could be boring your own mold blocks??? If so, I've tried a couple of no lube groove molds and I have to say they are great. The first decent looking .30 cal no lube groove mold I see I may have to jump on it. So far I've tried a 135gr 9mm and 230gr .45 ACP and wow the accuracy with coating...

I have bored a few blocks in the past.
Setup is a real time vampire at all stages.
This will be a total rethink of what we call a mold.
and if it works, Ill use it, if it works really well ... Ill produce it

 

[venomballistics]

Im about running out of energy today

heres a random sampling of todays accomplishments

we have some 30-06 in obligatory black using 3031
45 ACP at the ready as the red ball express over power pistol
and in fire and lava tones is the round of our forefathers 45-70 burning RL7
round two at the range should really push the coatings worth.
I do hope most of them show promise at the range, as these should all be fine standard loads for all reasons and most seasons.

heres what I mean about parchment paper being your friend.
it seems to keep your contact plates clean without interfering with the electrostatic charge in any meaningful way. it also releases the baked pills with ease.
there is a catch though, if your overspray is heavy enough, your slugs will release from the parchment in a solid sheet of flash. It seemed to get knocked off in sizing however.

heres a $25 investment that kinda started to grow on me.
I have come to call it the sleazy bake oven. Anyone arriving late, .... or early and overlooked this detail. Powder coat needs to be baked at around 400 degrees for around 15 - 20 minutes. It also renders the oven useless for edible pursuits.
This little number has temperature controls AND a built in timer that shuts it off after the bake is done.
at around $25 ... get two or three and run em in rotations

 

[David R]

I have done some more testing with the 115 grain 30 cal bullet. I was a cast bullet shooter for years.

I tried them in my 1917 enfield (30-06) and had no luck.

I tried them in my Savage 308 today and they shot well. Some hope. It could be fun. More later.

David

Edit

[/IMG]

8 grains Unique, Large Pistol primer, 115 gr Bayou bullets seated pretty deep with a light crimp.

25 yards prone laying in the grass, no sling or anything. Stevens like a savage 110 with a wood stock. I will up the charge till the group goes south.


My girlfriend was shooting jugs of water in the back yard with it today. What a blast.

 

[venomballistics]

Been in the venom labs again, and I present to you a sweet finding in powder application. 

Preheat the bullets prior to giving them the magic dust. 
While not entirely necessary for the electrostatic methods I employ, this should be adaptable to tumble methods. 

I populated the rack and baked them in the sleazy bake for 10 minutes at 350 degrees.
immediately after removal I transfered them to the coating station and sprayed with harbor freight yellow. 
The powder was melting to the surface on contact which provided a head start on building of the coating.
The resulting single coat is rather thick, perhaps even overkill for my needs and methods. 

Perhaps use of airgun bb's in a rotating metal container could be a viable option.

 

[David R]

Last night I shot some out of the 308. I upped the charge to 12 grains Unique like Lyman recommended for the potentially accurate load. I shot a few 5 shot groups at 25 yards off a decent rest and got 5/8 to 1 1/8" groups. These should be going around 1800 fps acording to the book. Its probably close. No gas check! Tonight my girlfriend is going to shoot that 308 in a hunter silhouette match. I am shooting it too. I have 100 rounds loaded up on the Dillion.

The no lead part is great for me. It saves time and the cost is miminal.

I also ordered some 158 grain RNFP 30 caliber from another compay to try in the 1917 enfield.

David I'm having a ball R.

 

[Moonman]

Coatings are the wave of the future, whether HI-TEK, ELECTROSTATIC POWDER COATING,
TUMBLE Powder Coating with electrostatic powders or THE BLUE BULLET deal.

Progress is on the march with all the testing currently in process.
The USA market is really stimulating the Australian HI-TEK process with NEW DRY POWERS/CATALYSTS/COLORS.

Many USA RIFLE SHOOTERS are enjoying ENHANCED results with accuracy and Cleaner Rifles.

GOOD work by all the folks experimenting with these processes, it can
only HELP THE SHOOTING SPORTS.

It doesn't matter if you purchase finished projectiles or
DO-IT-YOURSELF. it's all good.

 

[venomballistics]

Last night I shot some out of the 308. I upped the charge to 12 grains Unique like Lyman recommended for the potentially accurate load. I shot a few 5 shot groups at 25 yards off a decent rest and got 5/8 to 1 1/8" groups. These should be going around 1800 fps acording to the book. Its probably close. No gas check! Tonight my girlfriend is going to shoot that 308 in a hunter silhouette match. I am shooting it too. I have 100 rounds loaded up on the Dillion.

The no lead part is great for me. It saves time and the cost is miminal.

I also ordered some 158 grain RNFP 30 caliber from another compay to try in the 1917 enfield.

David I'm having a ball R.

I see that cast meets Unique load again.
Fine load as it may be, I suspect that its finally outlived its purpose.
Get serious with these new pills. push em for real and share the results.
Im still not sure how far into FMJ turf we can go yet, but I'm not about to be the only one doing it.

Im trying 3031 loads next, to be followed by slower rates as well as 4227, which incidentally seem to be on the shelves lately

 

[Maximumbob54]

I tried IMR 3031 with some 8mm Mauser loads and while I had zero leading in the bore I had at best what you would call a shotgun pattern at a whole whopping twenty five yards. I suspect that while the coating held the bullet together the alloy hardness didn't withstand the rifling torque and the bullet's spin was chaos. Maybe, maybe not. I just tried the starting load of a jacketed bullet minus 10%. I have a few more loaded up at starting level and then I think one gr more but haven't had time to finish that little experiment. Really though I think it's more a matter of you just can't push a lead bullet of any hardness that hard. The hardest lead bullet is still going to be softer than any jacketed bullet.

Now that being said I do wonder what a PC'ed jackteted bullet would do.

 

[Moonman]

Maximumbob54,

To learn one must experiment in uncharted territory,

just remember ole' ELMER KEITH blew up a few firearms testing new ground.

 

[David R]

More Results. Tonight we shot Hunters silhouette. I cleaned all 10 pigs @ 50 yards with the 308 using 115 gr powder coated bullets and 12 grains Unique. We had a blast. Almost 100 rounds and no fouling I can see right now. My girlfriend also got 10 pigs at 50 yards with 10 shots. I need to cut them back a little, they leave a good ding in the silhouettes. Maybe 10 grains red dot.....

David

Edit, no doubt you can smell paint burning.

 

[venomballistics]

More Results. Tonight we shot Hunters silhouette. I cleaned all 10 pigs @ 50 yards with the 308 using 115 gr powder coated bullets and 12 grains Unique. We had a blast. Almost 100 rounds and no fouling I can see right now. My girlfriend also got 10 pigs at 50 yards with 10 shots. I need to cut them back a little, they leave a good ding in the silhouettes. Maybe 10 grains red dot.....

David

Edit, no doubt you can smell paint burning.

Yeah, I could catch a whiff of that once in a while.
It's nothing compared to the stench of ez plate spray, an early experiment with friction reducing paint.
Smelled like driving flat out on the highway to hell with your brakes on fire.

 

[venomballistics]

man ... I really need to reorganize the shop.
if its a tool, and you need it, its not there
so this took a lot longer to do than it should have. but I got it done.

Its some of the things you pick up on a lark that really wake you up from your misconceptions.
one of those things was the 30 cal Hornady 110 grain JSP.
it was the ultimate bunny buster.
the results were a chunk of skin flopping on the ground within a cloud of crimson mist.
I grew quite fond of its terminal savagery, so I rendered it as a cast hollow point mold, designed specifically for coating.

sexy little things aint they

 

[David R]

My best so far is 1 1/8" @ 50 yards for 5 shots with a 308 Using Bayou 115 gr 30 cal carbine bullets powder coated gold.

One more group like that and I will load all empty brass.

David

David

 

[David R]

last night I shot the rifle at 100 yards. I fired 5 and 5 of different OAL.

Both groups were 3.5". I will take that. Now loading all brass in sight. 12 grains Unique, 115 Bayou powder coated bullet and large pistol primer.

We use this gun for Hunter silhouette. Center fire rifle is shot quite a bit here. A few guys love lever guns with 38 sp or 357. This is a stevens bolt action 308 with a 4-12 AO scope.

When I fit the bullets to the gun I smoked the bullet, and chambered it. The lead was perfect. It wiped the smoke off the bullet and did not scratch the paint. This was the same within 1 turn of the seater plug. This shows me the bullet is a perfect fit in this gun.

No fouling that I know of.

This all makes shooting a scoped center fire rifle cost the same as a handgun.

Going to try other powder coated bullets to see if something will work in my 1917 enfield. These 30 cal carbine bullets can only hold a sheet of paper at 25 yards with this gun. I have shot cast out of the Enfield. I sized bullets to .310 this could be the difference The ones I am using right now are 0.3085"

When the time comes, I will also try the 115 gr powder coated in my TC contender cal 32-20. It has a .308 bore.

David

 

[venomballistics]

Time to dump off some range findings.
I think I found the red line of the harbor freight coating.
Seems to be right around 2500 fps estimated.
This is in a rife, without use of gas checks.
Leading patterns are different from traditional lubricant, focusing on the edges of the rifling, and not filling in the grooves.
When pc fails, it's still not as dreadful as traditional methods.
Perhaps through alloys and different powder coat powders, we might be able to negotiate for another 200 fps, however, 2500 plain based represents a significant gain, even over gas checked cast using traditional lube.
This puts the DIY range fodder up into a class perfectly capable of being a very competent field load for many hunting situations.
The pistol side of things nearly need not be explored much beyond the usual quest for accurate loads, and perhaps some velocity gains offered by other powders, such as nylon or Teflon based coating.
While hotly debated, the use of coated bullets can represent more potent loads for SD. Remember that energy is a function of mass times the square of velocity. Any change in velocity is effectively counted twice in the determination of total yield.
50 fps in a 45 ACP is somewhat significant, and 100 fps would be clearly significant.
By all means, search for it.

 

[venomballistics]

From the random thought department.
Every so often, someone drops in asking about the nady dreaded carnival load of a round ball over some charge of bullseye.
It soon fades away in the dashed hopes brought about by a lead lined bore, simply because there is no way to give them lube.
We found the key to making it work here, with coatings in general.
There is no reason it won't work now.
Have some cheap fun.