Primers

Time to make a small primer making machine. a 1hp motor and hydraulic pump running a small press kicking out cups, another set of dies to make anvils. Some brass sheet and some lead styphenate, barium nitrate, antimony sulfide, tetrazine and powdered glass and your in business.

Os course you better study up on safe handling of those or you would be in orbit rather than business. Even today priming compound is handled in small batches and each stage is isolated from the other stages and there s a lot of hand labor involved

I started saving spend primers years ago. Why not, the don't take up much room. If you really had to you could pop out the anvils use a punch and die to reform the cup, make a sheet for the cups so you could fill them with primer "paste" made of the correct compound and install and anvils

Nothing is impossible.
 
steelslaver said:
Time to make a small primer making machine. a 1hp motor and hydraulic pump running a small press kicking out cups, another set of dies to make anvils. Some brass sheet and some lead styphenate, barium nitrate, antimony sulfide, tetrazine and powdered glass and your in business.

Os course you better study up on safe handling of those or you would be in orbit rather than business. Even today priming compound is handled in small batches and each stage is isolated from the other stages and there s a lot of hand labor involved

I started saving spend primers years ago. Why not, the don't take up much room. If you really had to you could pop out the anvils use a punch and die to reform the cup, make a sheet for the cups so you could fill them with primer "paste" made of the correct compound and install and anvils

Nothing is impossible.
Click to expand...

With Berdan primers it would be even easier.
 
kbm6893 said:
Whatever the excuse of the day is, primers are not being made to meet the demand.
Click to expand...

You may be right, but I hope you're not. Maybe labor, maybe parts, I dunno. But if its a deliberate choice for whatever reason, the Manufacturers need to be held accountable. Don't buy their products or sell their stock.
 
What effect does the shortage of primers and powder have on the manufacturers of reloading equipment?
Last I heard, Dillon is doing record business. Many products are posted as backordered, with delay times of well over a year.
This is posted on their website:

"We Have Not Forgotten About You

Customers with existing carbide die backorders, we have not forgotten about you! Die orders are filled based on the date they were placed, oldest orders first. Because we refuse to shift carbide production to China, we have been slower to get caught up on demand. However, the dates shown for newly placed orders do reflect that our carbide suppliers are steadily increasing output, without compromising the quality everyone expects from Dillon Precision. We appreciate your patience and your loyalty to Dillon Precision."

Good for Dillon, on multiple counts. Glad to see they appreciate their customers. And, glad to see they aren't outsourcing to China! I wish the entire industry acted this way!
But the question remains: "Why buy machinery if you can't get the 'fuel' to use it?"
Strange times.
This is getting very tiresome.
 
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6string said:
What effect does the shortage of primers and powder have on the manufacturers of reloading equipment?
Last I heard, Dillon is doing record business. Many products are posted as backordered, with delay times of well over a year.
This is posted on their website:

"We Have Not Forgotten About You

Customers with existing carbide die backorders, we have not forgotten about you! Die orders are filled based on the date they were placed, oldest orders first. Because we refuse to shift carbide production to China, we have been slower to get caught up on demand. However, the dates shown for newly placed orders do reflect that our carbide suppliers are steadily increasing output, without compromising the quality everyone expects from Dillon Precision. We appreciate your patience and your loyalty to Dillon Precision."

Good for Dillon, on multiple counts. Glad to see they appreciate their customers. And, glad to see they aren't outsourcing to China! I wish the entire industry acted this way!
But the question remains: "Why buy machinery if you can't get the 'fuel' to use it?"
Strange times.
This is getting very tiresome.
Click to expand...
IMO Dillon is doing it right. The worst thing when ordering online is waiting forever for a shipment without knowing why you aren't getting your product. When a company reaches out like that they put your mind at ease and you know they care like said above.
 
6string said:
Last I heard, Dillon is doing record business. Many products are posted as backordered, with delay times of well over a year.
This is posted on their website:
Click to expand...

Who says record business? Them?

This sounds like a whole different scenario.

Seems like people won't work any more. I recently needed to have a lawn tractor repaired. Same shop doing business with for many years. It took forever to even get it picked up. The excuse was can't get drivers to come in every day. No mechanics in the shop. They have signs posted re. hiring but nobody applies.

So, I question whether Dillon is selling more than ever before, or they can't sell much because they don't have employees?

It makes no sense to me that equipment is being oversold, when we all know that components are unobtainable.
 
GypsmJim said:
Who says record business? Them?

This sounds like a whole different scenario.

Seems like people won't work any more. I recently needed to have a lawn tractor repaired. Same shop doing business with for many years. It took forever to even get it picked up. The excuse was can't get drivers to come in every day. No mechanics in the shop. They have signs posted re. hiring but nobody applies.

So, I question whether Dillon is selling more than ever before, or they can't sell much because they don't have employees?

It makes no sense to me that equipment is being oversold, when we all know that components are unobtainable.
Click to expand...

Good points!

Interestingly, though, Dillon keeps adding new products, many of which are pushing the envelope of "high end".
They have both the 1050 and 1100 commercial type presses, a new brass processing press, and now automation equipment in the $2-3,000 range.
So, is this gear that is actually being manufactured and shipped, or does it just exist on the drawing board???

If it's the former case, who's got the components (powder, primers, etc) to feed the darned things?
 
I got into reloading in the spring of 2013, 6 months after Newtown. Ordered the press and everything else on Amazon. Was at my door in a few days. Got primers and powder with very little trouble. The shop would only sell me 500 primers and I had to use Red Dot since nothing else was available, but I was making ammo 6 months after Sandy Hook. By Christmas of 2013, components were easily obtainable.

I've been advocating reloading since then. Now I tell people who ask to not bother buying anything until components are available. It is utterly stupid to start reloading now with components being so scarce.

Where there is a demand the market responds. Shooters are being screwed over by the industry we have been keeping in business for decades. My local shop has gotten exactly TWO bricks of primers into his shop in over 2 years. This isn't about new shooters or hoarders. There is nothing to hoard. Maybe the big box stores are getting some product, but I have none of those anywhere near me, and I'm sure not going to drive 2 hours for a maybe.

A question for the long time reloaders here: have you EVER seen over a 2 year drought with no end in sight, like what is happening now?
 
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steelslaver said:
Time to make a small primer making machine. a 1hp motor and hydraulic pump running a small press kicking out cups, another set of dies to make anvils. Some brass sheet and some lead styphenate, barium nitrate, antimony sulfide, tetrazine and powdered glass and your in business.

Os course you better study up on safe handling of those or you would be in orbit rather than business. Even today priming compound is handled in small batches and each stage is isolated from the other stages and there s a lot of hand labor involved

I started saving spend primers years ago. Why not, the don't take up much room. If you really had to you could pop out the anvils use a punch and die to reform the cup, make a sheet for the cups so you could fill them with primer "paste" made of the correct compound and install and anvils

Nothing is impossible.
Click to expand...
Business is booming....
 
Tucson AZ show this weekend: Primers running $130 for the most part, with some people actually selling some SPPs at $100 and some having fantasies of $200.
Powder looks like about $40/lb with generally good availability.
 
kbm6893 said:
A question for the long time reloaders here: have you EVER seen over a 2 year drought with no end in sight, like what is happening now?
Click to expand...

No, not in my neck of the woods.

I always have a good supply on hand, and have never run out. Maybe got down to my last brick, but then November came again and the supplies went back up.

I ordered several bricks online in March, 2020. All were in stock, and at a SALE price of $28.99. I kick myself for not ordering more. A few days later the Covid taskforce was on TV so I tries to order more, but 100% was outa stock.
 
Never seen the shortage last this long ever..and it ain't over...I think 2 more years. The powers that be DO want us unarmed though...so maybe longer(said tongue in cheek)! But the last time we had 4 primer manufacturers R,F, W and CCI and people who were not getting paid to not go to work..and a lot of imported components/ammo
 
Skeet 028 said:
Never seen the shortage last this long ever..and it ain't over...I think 2 more years. The powers that be DO want us unarmed though...so maybe longer(said tongue in cheek)! But the last time we had 4 primer manufacturers R,F, W and CCI and people who were not getting paid to not go to work..and a lot of imported components/ammo
Click to expand...

Yeah. I've talked to some real old timers with 40 years or more reloading and they've never seen this. I figure it's gonna be another couple of years, and by then many of us will have been beaten down enough that we'll be happy to pay $100 a brick. Which may have been the point all along. At this point I'm thinking the manufacturers have seized on the moment to charge triple what they used to.
 
My guy at Buffalo Arms told me that reloading components are all on the back burner until they get the shelves restocked with loaded ammo, which is where the money is. There was also a huge order put in from the military, homeland security and believe it or not the USPS. He told me that we should not be expecting to pick primers, etc. up for a reasonable price until mid 2023. Most of us at the club will look out for each other, nobody really wants to shoot alone...Now is the time to be trading stuff you don't use all that much for what you do, small rifle primers for large pistol, etc.
Black powder was the major problem with Hodgden going out of the black business entirely, closing the Goex plant. It was bought by the Estes company who plan on relocating and upgrading with plans to reopen early to mid 2023. In the meantime, the only outlet is Swiss and Schuetzen, both tied up with shipping problems. Percussion caps are built on the same equipment that makes .22 cartridges and take the back seat, again we are hoping on our european friends to keep us burning black.
 
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Think about this before you accuse the manufacturers of gouging. Flat rolled steel, which primers are made of, went from $.035 per pound to $1.25 per pound for a while, now it's down to about $0.80 or so. LAbor costs have gone up. Transportation costs are up, with diesel going from $1.80 to over $5 per gallon. Let's face it, inflation is up nearly 10%, costs in the manufacturing and transport are 3 to 4 times what they were. And you guy still expect to buy primers for 4 cents.?
 
Considering the product delays and massive cost increases I see at my 9ta5, I suppose I shouldn't be surprised. We all want to get the most for our hardearned dollar and manufacturers aren't in this for fun.

That being said, I'll continue to whine and complain cuz it's my right to be a crusty ol' coot.
 
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raljr1 said:
Think about this before you accuse the manufacturers of gouging. Flat rolled steel, which primers are made of, went from $.035 per pound to $1.25 per pound for a while, now it's down to about $0.80 or so. LAbor costs have gone up. Transportation costs are up, with diesel going from $1.80 to over $5 per gallon. Let's face it, inflation is up nearly 10%, costs in the manufacturing and transport are 3 to 4 times what they were. And you guy still expect to buy primers for 4 cents.?
Click to expand...

No I don't expect to pay $40 a brick. I would like to be able to pick them up at $60-$70 if I choose to. The problem is they're not on shelves at all.
 
raljr1 said:
Think about this before you accuse the manufacturers of gouging. Flat rolled steel, which primers are made of, went from $.035 per pound to $1.25 per pound for a while, now it's down to about $0.80 or so. LAbor costs have gone up. Transportation costs are up, with diesel going from $1.80 to over $5 per gallon. Let's face it, inflation is up nearly 10%, costs in the manufacturing and transport are 3 to 4 times what they were. And you guy still expect to buy primers for 4 cents.?
Click to expand...

My primers are brass , no steel involved. I believe you are misinformed.
 
Diesel fuel is now up over 6$ a gallon. The country is about to go off a recession cliff. As much as I like to shoot and reload, my big worry is how am I going to heat my house and will food continue to be available in the quantities and varieties that I am used to. Primers? Not so much. I afraid we have a lot more discomfort to go through before things start to stabilize.
 
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