When you load .45 ACP Rim brass using lead projectiles, which is the best seating die to use, one with a tapered crimp or a roll crimp? I've been trying to load with a 200 grain Acme coated round nose using a taper crimp and am having a real problem with the rounds not seating deep enough in the cylinder of my 625-2. I've ordered a seating die from RCBS with the roll crimp and I hope this will solve my problem. When I use plated or full metal jacket projectiles I don't experience this problem. Any ideas?
Question Regarding .45 ACP Rim
- Thread starter OldChief
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Taper crimp should get it. I'm thinking your lead bullet diameter is a bit more that your throats. Size those lead bullets down to same as the plated bullets, prob .451 & all should be well.
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I did a side-by-side informal comparison some years ago using a roll crimp and a taper crimp on Auto Rim with cast bullets. Actually, there was very little difference but the taper crimped rounds were slightly more accurate as I recall. I've used .451" and .452" cast bullets in ACP and Auto Rim; again little difference, but I size all bullets in a .452" die to keep things simple. I've never had a problem seating .452" bullet pretty far out in two 625s, a Model 22, and a 25-2, but I suppose some chamber throats are tighter than others. Perhaps that's what you've run across.
Regardless of the type crimp you pick, crimp as little as possible, just enough to prevent bullet movement under recoil and no more. Accuracy will usually be better than with a heavier crimp.
Regardless of the type crimp you pick, crimp as little as possible, just enough to prevent bullet movement under recoil and no more. Accuracy will usually be better than with a heavier crimp.
I think you're correct. These bullets are .452, Acme doesn't offer a .451 in .45ACP, though these are listed for .45ACP. I don't have a sizing die for lead bullets so I guess I'll just use these for .45 Colt and stick to plated or fmj .451s for my .45ACP RIM.
Thanks,
Sounds like tight throats. Try to seat your bullets just a few thousanths deeper
The chambers in a revolver for rimless cartridges are cut to seat on the case mouth.That means there is a square corner can get filled with lead, powder, carbon, etc. This effectively makes the chamber shorter, not allowing the case to fully seat in the chamber.
If you look at rimmed cartridge revolver chambers, you will see a tapered transition from the case size to the bullet size.
If you look at rimmed cartridge revolver chambers, you will see a tapered transition from the case size to the bullet size.
Waldo
Member
I have been reloading both .45 ACP and .45 Auto Rim on a Dillon 550 for many years. I use a taper crimp die. After I run a bunch of .45 ACP. I just switch shell plates and run all of my Auto Rim brass. I have used both 230gr. cast LRN and 200gr. cast SWCs. I have never had any trouble in either a S&W 25-2 or 625
That's my plan.
What are your bullets sized to, .451 or .452? I've never had a problem with either jacketed, plated or cast bullets in .451. Are any of those you're using .452?
The only Acme 200gr 45 bullet's I've tried were the coated ones for 45 Colt, RNFP-NLG-HT. They miked at .4521". Were these the ones you tried?
I shot them in a couple of my 625s, without issue (other than trace leading), loaded in S-L 45AR brass, seated to COAL@ 1.195".
My notes don't say specifically but I'm sure I roll crimped mine since it has a crimp groove.
I'd think the only reason they didn't drop in cleanly was because you didn't fully remove the case flaring/bellmouth after seating with your taper crimp.
The only other likely thing causing your trouble would be if the brass was over max. length (.898"), which is not likely but worth checking. If they were too long the Auto Rim cases would end up headspacing on the chamber shoulder instead of the case's (fat) rim.
.452" diameter shouldn't be an issue with chambering.
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45AR's are fun to use
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I shot them in a couple of my 625s, without issue (other than trace leading), loaded in S-L 45AR brass, seated to COAL@ 1.195".
My notes don't say specifically but I'm sure I roll crimped mine since it has a crimp groove.
I'd think the only reason they didn't drop in cleanly was because you didn't fully remove the case flaring/bellmouth after seating with your taper crimp.
The only other likely thing causing your trouble would be if the brass was over max. length (.898"), which is not likely but worth checking. If they were too long the Auto Rim cases would end up headspacing on the chamber shoulder instead of the case's (fat) rim.
.452" diameter shouldn't be an issue with chambering.
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45AR's are fun to use
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Ivan the Butcher
Member
I've been shooting my standard 45 ACP loads in my 625 with full moon clips for around 20 years. 200 RNPF have used both non & coated, 5.5 WW231, WLP, mixed brass. Very good at 25 yards! ALWAYS with a taper crimp. Uses a bronze brush and scrub those chambers clean!
When my older brother bought both a Custom Shop Wilson and a Custom Shop Kimber, the 625 (Series of 1989) as the only way I could afford to keep up and beat him once and while. The above load is my only load for six 1911's, three Sig 220's, and the 1917 & 625 S&W's. I usually have 60 to 80 full moon clips loaded at any time, in case he wants a rematch!
Ivan
When my older brother bought both a Custom Shop Wilson and a Custom Shop Kimber, the 625 (Series of 1989) as the only way I could afford to keep up and beat him once and while. The above load is my only load for six 1911's, three Sig 220's, and the 1917 & 625 S&W's. I usually have 60 to 80 full moon clips loaded at any time, in case he wants a rematch!
Ivan
gwpercle
Member
Handy Hint .... seat the bullet in one step , do not apply a crimp.
Crimp the bullet , taper or roll , in a separate step , without seating it any deeper .
Makes life a lot easier ...trust me!
I have one 45 acp revolver with tight chambers ...this one will only take ammo loaded with .451" dia bullets ...if sized .452" the ammo will not fully chamber .
Other 45 acp revolvers will chamber ammo loaded with .452" sized bullets .
It sounds like a tight chamber...which isn't bad because cases can last a long time before they develop a crack or split .
Since I cast my own bullets I size them as needed .451" or .452".
Gary
Crimp the bullet , taper or roll , in a separate step , without seating it any deeper .
Makes life a lot easier ...trust me!
I have one 45 acp revolver with tight chambers ...this one will only take ammo loaded with .451" dia bullets ...if sized .452" the ammo will not fully chamber .
Other 45 acp revolvers will chamber ammo loaded with .452" sized bullets .
It sounds like a tight chamber...which isn't bad because cases can last a long time before they develop a crack or split .
Since I cast my own bullets I size them as needed .451" or .452".
Gary
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Thanks for all the great replies. Now back to the drawing board to try a few of the suggestions. The bullets are Acme .45 ACP sized to .452. I use the same bullets BLUEDOT37 showed for my .45 Colt. Ivan, I scrubbed the chambers like I never did before!
BigMuddy
Member
I had issues seating some of my lead bullet loads in my M22 using acp brass. A tip from a friend suggested using a Lee factory crimp die. Solved all of my problems.
Dan
Dan
fredj338
Member
If you are loadng a rimmed case with a bullet that has a crimp groove, roll crimp. No diff than 38sp, 357mag, etc.
Waldo
Member
I buy cast bullets in bulk. I find that at 5 or 10 thousand at a time I get a pretty good price break. I have never noticed any difference on target with either diameter. But I try to load pretty close to factory velocity and use my reloads in every thing from SAs to Automatics. I have never tried to find the one best load for a particular gun.
I am glad you solved your problem.
gwpercle
Member
Lee makes a inexpensive bullet sizing die that can be used in a single stage press , get a .451" sizing die and run those .452" bullets through it and presto ....451" bullets . $20.00 from Midway or Amazon .
Gary
Gary
NB4EST
Member
For timed revolver matches using moon-clipped 45 ACPs or other ammo in speed-loaders, I seat RN or RNFP bullets and roll crimp. My timer rarely lies, and it claims roll-crimped loads are quicker into the cylinder chambers.
You might want to use plug gauges (pin gauges) to measure the cylinders.
Hhip 4103-0451 $5.62 Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.451" | Zoro.com
Hhip 4103-0452 $5.62 Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.452" | Zoro.com
Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.453" | Zoro.com
Hhip 4103-0451 $5.62 Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.451" | Zoro.com
Hhip 4103-0452 $5.62 Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.452" | Zoro.com
Replacement Pin Gage P-2 0.0002 Tolerance 0.453" | Zoro.com
