Range Brass finds and 2 questions

[jonnnyboy]

I had the opportunity to slip off to the small country range and with no one there, I got to scrounge brass to my heart's content. I always enjoy picking up brass. It's like picking up money to a handloader! There were lots of 9mm and 5.56 with a sprinkling of 45acp in the mix. I actually ran into a few cases that I had not seen at this particular range before, 30 carbine and a couple 50AE.

From the right is the 50AE, 30 carbine, three interesting 5.56 and then on the left is a couple of unusual 308 winchester match cases.

I have two questions. First, are the 5.56 cases with the star crimps - blanks? I've never seen these types of cases and my first thought was they were blanks.

Second, please take a close look at the 308win cases. Those cases have a couple issues. They look like they had been marked in the extraction groove with a dark marker. They also have concentric lines that completely encircle the case. These lines appear to be raised brass as if there were grooves in the chamber of the gun that shot them. I can't imagine what made those lines. Here's a closer look.

Any ideas?

 

[growr]

You are right in the .556 casings being blanks....the .308 casings appear to have been fired in a barrel with polygonal rifling...ie. HK/clones.

As far as the extractor grooves being colored, many will do this in some manner to mark and identify THEIR brass.....

Other may chime in as well....but that is MY take on your brass...

Randy

 

[serger]

The 223's are blanks, the 308's were shot out of An H&K with the fluted chamber.

 

[rwsmith]

Yeah, blanks...

Many, many moons ago (late 1960s) we were camping in a area where the National Guard had done some field exercises and there was brass like that all over the place. I remember some was even 30-06 and a lot of Garand clips all around.

 

[SMSgt]

I believe the fluted chamber is intended to reduce extraction friction.

 

[bigedp51]

I had the opportunity to slip off to the small country range and with no one there, I got to scrounge brass to my heart's content. I always enjoy picking up brass. It's like picking up money to a handloader! There were lots of 9mm and 5.56 with a sprinkling of 45acp in the mix. I actually ran into a few cases that I had not seen at this particular range before, 30 carbine and a couple 50AE.

From the right is the 50AE, 30 carbine, three interesting 5.56 and then on the left is a couple of unusual 308 winchester match cases.

I have two questions. First, are the 5.56 cases with the star crimps - blanks? I've never seen these types of cases and my first thought was they were blanks.

Second, please take a close look at the 308win cases. Those cases have a couple issues. They look like they had been marked in the extraction groove with a dark marker. They also have concentric lines that completely encircle the case. These lines appear to be raised brass as if there were grooves in the chamber of the gun that shot them. I can't imagine what made those lines. Here's a closer look.


Any ideas?

Any ideas.....yes

Throw the 5.56 blanks away the cases were not designed for 55,000 psi reloading.

The black on the base of the .308/7.62 case was caused by the gas escaping around the fluted chamber. And the carbon collected in the extractor groove. Just like the black on your case necks with low pressure loads. Or the black carbon that builds up in your AR15 action from the gas tube. And why some people like piston operated semi-auto rifles.
Some people say rifles like these $hit where they eat.

 

[OFT II]

The HK 91 rifles had grooved or fluted chambers to aid in extraction that left marks on the case like this.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

I know that 30-06 blanks were "Full Power" reloadable after FL sizing and trimming. I had never heard that 223/5.56 wasn't. I knew a commercial reloader that loaded several thousand fired blanks in normal Reloads. He said he would never do that again, do to all the extra effort needed, but said nothing about the brass be inferior!

I have a few hundred 50 AE brass some where, I'll trade you for 30 Carbine if you want! (I used to think a M-1 Carbine type weapon in 50AE would be cool, I owned a Desert Eagle in 50 EA: I really don't think so any more!)


Ivan

 

[Dale53]

During the late sixties and early seventies I competed seriously in IPSC. My rifle of choice was a tuned HK-91. I successfully reloaded military brass for the rifle. Other than the "uglies", the brass held up quite well. Ask my old friend, Ken Hackathorn...

Dale53

 

[Big Cholla]

Hey, I knew Ken back then too. Great guy and a fantastic Instructor. Did he ever show you the "Hackathorn RIP"? ............

 

[AveragEd]

I wonder how many new reloaders would just use those .223/5.56 cases without knowing they were unusual and asking about them. Another reason for not using range brass unless you know how to sort the good from the potentially dangerous.

Ed

 

[fyimo]

I'm on our VFW Posts Honor Squad and we shoot the 21 gun salute, fold and present the flag, and play Taps. We do this for families that request this for a fallen Veteran in our county. We put 3 of the spent 30-06 cases from our M1 rifles in the flag representing Duty, Honor, and Country. The rest of the spent blank brass is usually picked up by the family and when it's not we pick it up. I have never thought about reloading it into 30-06 ammo and I probably won't because I have enough 30-06 brass.

 

[jonnnyboy]

I've been handloading for a long time now, almost 30 years and I still come across brass that represents something different and/or interesting. I've seen blanks before but not in the 5.56 caliber so that was a neat find. I have plenty of the 5.56 so I will just keep the blanks as is. I have heard that they can be used to make 300 Blackout brass but since normal brass is so plentiful, there's no need to even think about experimenting.

The 50AE was a good find this time. It was a first for me and I think I actually picked up a couple of them. I've found 30 Carbine before but not many so it is a rarity as well.

The big question was on the 308w with the longitudinal stripes. Those were stumpers for sure. I think the HK chamber is the best answer at this point until I can actually be at the range when this brass is released to the wild. Would be interesting for sure.

Happy scrounging and a Merry Christmas to all.

PS. I would be interested in hearing about innovative ways to display unusual brass cases. Right now I just have them lined up on a shelf in my reloading den.

 

[Qc Pistolero]

These 5.56 cases are ready to separate.Look at the ''ring around the collar''.Don't trim and reload these.They're only good for the brass recuperation bin.
Qc

 

[Engineer1911]

HK semi-auto rifle shooters do not reload:

A] Fired brass is ejected into the next county or at least to the farthest point possible to the right, never to be found again.

B] Once that 308 brass leaves an HK chamber it is junk. It is very difficult to resize for reloading even with a small base sizer die and PREMIUM case lube. If you get it resized, it self-destructs the third time it is fired.

This is knowledge given to you based on my short-time ownership of an HK-91.

 

[Steve912]

These 5.56 cases are ready to separate.Look at the ''ring around the collar''.Don't trim and reload these.They're only good for the brass recuperation bin.
Qc

In this case, the 'incipient case head separation' is actually a sort
of cannelure--that's how 5.56 blanks come, right out of the little
cardboard box. Dunno why they make 'em that way, they just do.

 

[zeke]

HK semi-auto rifle shooters do not reload:

A] Fired brass is ejected into the next county or at least to the farthest point possible to the right, never to be found again.

B] Once that 308 brass leaves an HK chamber it is junk. It is very difficult to resize for reloading even with a small base sizer die and PREMIUM case lube. If you get it resized, it self-destructs the third time it is fired.

This is knowledge given to you based on my short-time ownership of an HK-91.

Another short time owner of hk-91, the reloading difficulty was one of the reasons it got sold off. The fluting of the chamber doesn't hurt the reloader, but the rifles action (roller something) is designed to forcibly yank the brass out quicker than others. Brass expands more, gets stretched more and is filthy. It is very reliable.

Have successfully reloaded the brass, but as indicated it was a multiple step pain, and not worth it in my opinion.

 

[TheDrake]

Another short time owner of hk-91, the reloading difficulty was one of the reasons it got sold off. The fluting of the chamber doesn't hurt the reloader, but the rifles action (roller something) is designed to forcibly yank the brass out quicker than others. Brass expands more, gets stretched more and is filthy. It is very reliable.

Have successfully reloaded the brass, but as indicated it was a multiple step pain, and not worth it in my opinion.

I am having this argument about HK91 brass right now. Based on your reply, I am still confused? Can this brass be reloaded or no? I am currently prepping some , I can not feel the marks in it, it just appears to be soot. I can rub it off with a rag and metal polish. I have some people telling me to reload it, its fine, I have 1 person saying no, its garbage, it will blow the gun up. How can the gun blow up? Even if the brass lets go, all the pressure will want to go down the barrel. If this was a cheaper rifle, I would say SEND IT, but this is a pre-ban HK and it was my fathers. I'd rather not screw it up.

 

[PPCSHOOTER]

I'VE RELOADED PLENTY OF 308 AND 223 BRASS FIRED IN H&K 91 &93's. NO REAL SECRET. JUST FULL LENGTH SIZE THEM. JP

 

[colt_saa]

HK semi-auto rifle shooters do not reload:

A] Fired brass is ejected into the next county or at least to the farthest point possible to the right, never to be found again.

B] Once that 308 brass leaves an HK chamber it is junk. It is very difficult to resize for reloading even with a small base sizer die and PREMIUM case lube. If you get it resized, it self-destructs the third time it is fired.

This is knowledge given to you based on my short-time ownership of an HK-91.

I totally disagree with this

I have been shooting my G3k for 22 years now, I have probably been loading it for 20. Resizing is a matter of leverage. Different presses have different feels to them. Just because something is difficult on your press does not mean it is difficult on mine or vice versa

The fluted chambers if HK weapons is not limited to rifle chamberings. I have probably loaded the smaller cartridges 20 to 1 over the 7.62. We were running lots more ammo through the SMGs over the years