Range Report Laser-Cast 158 LSWC & Bullseye

[forestswin]

I loaded Laser-Cast 158G LSWC bullets over 3.3, 3.4, 3.5, 3.6, 3.7 & 3.8 G of bullseye in 357 cases and shot them with a 686 6" on the bench with a 2x20 scope at 25yards tonight. Poor results (2" to 3") groups. These are the loads given by Laser-Cast for Bullseye powder - book velocities range from 751 fps to 813 fps. No leading - but still not a good match for my gun. I only have Bullseye, Unique and WST powders so far - they do not list load data for Unique nor WST.

Laser-Cast gives load data for HP38, N100, RedDot, Titegroup, AA9, H4227, HS-7, H110 & 2400.

Any suggestions for another powder and loads for these Laser-Cast bullets? I'm only interested in target shooting @ 25 yards for now.
I've been trying to stay with light loads, but I already have a very good light load round using the Hornady swaged 158's

Should I go magnum with something like 2400 for these harder cast bullets?


I only hear good things about these bullets, they seem to be high quality.

Is there an equivalent bullet to get load data ?

I'm not comfortable with data I have on a 158G [linotype] Lyman #358311 - it lists using Bullseye from 4.9 G to 6.9 G
flags go up - this differs too much from the manufacturers data.
Any help is appreciated.

 

[m657]

I've had really good accuracy with TiteGroup at moderate velocities and 158 SWC as well as 158 RN. I use 130 conical with light TG recipe for my ICORE & Steel Challenge in revolvers.

I've only recently gotten around to using BullsEye at all, in 45acp loads. Not sure how I like it yet.

Also, HP38/W231 have given pleasing groups at the short distances I use, mostly around 25 yards. Haven't gotten any real on-paper groups to talk about yet as I favor steel. For me if I can get the 4-6" round steels to sing at these short match distances I'm doing fine.

I use a variety of 4-5-6" S&W mostly in matches, due to the fine triggers obtainable by careful application of home-care.

Good luck, keep us posted.

 

[Rule3]

You are essentially shooting 38 Specials out of 357 Mag cases.
Or mouse fart 357 Loads.

A 158 gr hard cast bullet in 357 Mag is more in the 6.0 gr range with Bullseye.

It's not the bullet it's the powder and the charge. Either up your loads with the Bullseye or change powders to a slower powder.

Bullseye would not be my choice for the 357 Mag with all the better powders around,

Lyman Cast manual for a hardcast 158gr LSWC is 6.2 to 6.9

Unique (as you have it would be a far better choice.)

 

[Hammerless-12]

Well first off theres nothing wrong with Bullseye powder in the 38 special. Ive used it for over 35 years as well as Unique. One of the most important things you want to look at in loading the 38 special is a fairly heavy, consistant crimp. A light crimp or an inconsistant crimp does not work well with the 38 special, at least for me. I would up your load to (what I use) is 4.8 grains of Bullseye. In the 38 special I like the 148 gr. wad cutter for my most accurate load. But I did somehow end up with 1000 158 gr. SWC and I do like them. I do use the 38 special case and not the 357 case, so Im not sure how the special loads will work in the mag. case. I have a hunch that you may have to play with the charge a little, but not much. Using Unique I also obtained much better groups with a heavy crimp. Either one of these powders is a winner in the 38 special. Using Unique my load is 6 grains and it pretty much matches the 4.8 load of Bullseye. I have alway gotten a little more loads out of a pound of Bullseye verses Unique. Have some fun with that 38 special, I shoot both S&W as well as Colt revolvers and the 38 special is one of the most accurate rounds Ive ever shot.

 

[chud333]

Agree with Rule3,
I use Unique behind my lasercast 158's
7.5 grains and it's not at all unruly.
A good loading for plinking and accurate
out of my Model 28 with 4" tube.

Chuck

 

[Titegroups]

I've had very good luck with titegroup and bullseye in 357 cases with 125g LRN bullets at around 1000-1100fps.

 

[alwslate]

I'm not a target shooter, just a plinker mostly, but with hard cast
bullets I have always gotten smaller groups with RN bullets rather
than SWC in mild loads. I agree with the others that your Bullseye
charges are pretty light for magnum brass. For me W231 usually gives
better accuracy than Bullseye on average. With 158 gr bullets it seems
easier to achieve accuracy at 850 fps rather than 750 fps or so.

 

[tappedandtagged]

6 grains of Unique should get you around the 1,000 fps mark. Thats my go-to target load. For magnum, I use 12 grains of AA #9 ( gets me around the 1,200 fps mark if memory serves). Both provide exceptional accuracy in my 6" Taurus 689.

 

[trulyapostolic]

I've found excellent accuracy, at 50 yards, shooting 2.7-2.8 gr. Bullseye out of 38 Special cases pushing swaged 158 gr. SWC bullets. I'd trying lowering your powder charge to 3.0 grains and shoot it again. Faster isn't always better for accuracy.

 

[Rule3]

I loaded Laser-Cast 158G LSWC bullets over 3.3, 3.4, 3.5, 3.6, 3.7 & 3.8 G of bullseye in 357 cases and shot them with a 686 6"
Any help is appreciated.

Well gee, the OP is talking about 357 Mag cases, out of a 6" 686. so 38 special data is not really relevant.

Yes, Bullseye is fine for 38 special, I use a lot of it, but we are talking about 357 Mag.

 

[zelda]

l shoot loads out of my Mod 28 using the same bullet and powder in both 38spc and 357mag cases. l can see no difference in accuracy.

Dad's load is 3.5gr 700x, cast wadcutter bullets

 

[Sal1950]

A starting load of about 6.5g of Unique under the 158 LaserCast should be a nice touch. If your getting any leading at that level try increasing the load. I'd stay under 7.0g max.
Sal

 

[tappedandtagged]

A starting load of about 6.5g of Unique under the 158 LaserCast should be a nice touch. If your getting any leading at that level try increasing the load. I'd stay under 7.0g max.
Sal

That is 0.5 grains above Alliant's max for the Speer swaged 158 grn LSWC, but I feel that is mainly to reduce leading of the bore. But the 158 grn Gold Dot has a max of 7.7 grains.

I use 6 flat for my plinking loads. Very accurate, no leading using MO Bullet Co. and hardly any recoil to speak of. I can't find my notes now, but I think I was getting over 1,100-1,200 fps out of my 6 inch Taurus.

 

[longranger]

2.8gr Bullseye 148grSWC,magic in .38 Special,same bullet with 3.1 gr. Bullseye in a .357 case,magic. These are old "Bullseye" shooting loads that are just pure joy to shoot.

 

[Snobal]

What size groups do you expect from a revolver at 25 yards?

I use 3.3 grains of Bullseye powder in .357 Mag cases (to avoid the .38 case lead ring) with 148 grain BBWC bullets from an RCBS mold for a target load at our Bullseye Matches.

This load typically produces 6-shot groups around 2" (or less), c-t-c, from sandbags at 25 yards from all of my .357 Mag revolvers (S&W 66's, Ruger Redhawk, Ruger GP100's, and Ruger SP101).

Notes from some of my chrono results with this load include:
- 4" Model 66: 737 fps
- 4" GP100: 773 fps
- 3" SP101: 755 fps
- 6" GP100 764 fps

By the way, I've been using a chrono since the 1970's and the only thing "I know for sure" is that every gun is different.

Also, I would not put the time and effort into casting my own bullets if I could find any "store-bought" cast bullets that grouped as well as mine do --- and shot as "leading free' as mine do.

The only exception I've found is with Laser-Cast 200 grain SWC bullets for .45 ACP.

I have not tried Laser-Cast .357 cal. bullets, but in my very limited experience, the other "popular" brands of cast bullets in that size have produced exceeding poor results.

Back to .38/.357 caliber: In my limited experience, I have had to increase the velocity with round-nose and SWC bullets to get them to group well. For that reason, I use my own cast BBWC bullets at our matches (for the best accuracy with the least recoil in timed- and rapid-fire events).

Over the years, my best revolver groups (.41 mag and .44 mag) have been with Keith-type SWC bullets, using RCBS mounds, wheel-weight lead with a bit of added tin, and either H-4227 or IMR 4227 powder loaded to achieve velocities over 1,200 fps. These loads have produced groups of well less than 2" at 25 yards, and under 6" at 100 yards.

I'm too poor a shot to do much better than that with iron sights.

JMHO - YRMV

 

[forestswin]

What size groups do you expect from a revolver at 25 yards?

I am hoping to find 1" groups like I got with the Hornady 158g LSWC - see attached photo

I use 3.3 grains of Bullseye powder in .357 Mag cases (to avoid the .38 case lead ring) with 148 grain BBWC bullets from an RCBS mold for a target load at our Bullseye Matches.

I plan on trying the 148 WC's next

This load typically produces 6-shot groups around 2" (or less), c-t-c, from sandbags at 25 yards from all of my .357 Mag revolvers (S&W 66's, Ruger Redhawk, Ruger GP100's, and Ruger SP101).

Notes from some of my chrono results with this load include:
- 4" Model 66: 737 fps
- 4" GP100: 773 fps
- 3" SP101: 755 fps
- 6" GP100 764 fps

By the way, I've been using a chrono since the 1970's and the only thing "I know for sure" is that every gun is different.

I am finding out that I will need a chrono

Also, I would not put the time and effort into casting my own bullets if I could find any "store-bought" cast bullets that grouped as well as mine do --- and shot as "leading free' as mine do.

Casting is down the road for me - I am really just learning how to shoot.

The only exception I've found is with Laser-Cast 200 grain SWC bullets for .45 ACP.

I have not tried Laser-Cast .357 cal. bullets, but in my very limited experience, the other "popular" brands of cast bullets in that size have produced exceeding poor results.

Back to .38/.357 caliber: In my limited experience, I have had to increase the velocity with round-nose and SWC bullets to get them to group well. For that reason, I use my own cast BBWC bullets at our matches (for the best accuracy with the least recoil in timed- and rapid-fire events).



I'm too poor a shot to do much better than that with iron sights.
As you can see in the picture, I am using a scope for load development

JMHO - YRMV

Snobal - thanks for all your input here - I am learning and having fun