Reliable 40 S&W Load

[MYM&P]

Good morning all,
I am hoping for advice on what you have found to be a reliable load for 40 m&p pro. I have been reloading for about a year and have just taken up USPSA shooting. The problem I am having is failure to feed and jams. In order to clear the pistol the magazine needs to be released. This is very unnerving (and embarrassing during a timed shoot). Here is the current load data I am using:
200 gr Montana gold bullets
5.3 gr Bullseye
CCI small pistol primers
1.130 COL
I also run the completed round thru a Lee bulge buster die in a separate operation. The M&P pro is about 8 months old bought new. I am not too worried about about power factors right now I just want to be able to focus on shooting the game without worrying about the pistol jamming. It should be noted that I have played with the col from 1.120-1.130. The longer COL seems to work the best but the pistol still continues to jams every 3 or 4 magazines.
Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Dragon88]

What crimp are you using?

Please describe your malfunctions in detail. Are the rounds nosediving, getting hung up at the feed ramp, failing to chamber completely, or...?

 

[Rule3]

Welcome to the forum!

Question, why are you using such a a heavy bullet and why the bulge buster? Are you using brass from a Glock? If IR the MP is a fully supported chamber.

Have you taken the barrel out and "tested" a round by dropping it in the barrel (should plunk) and seat correctly, and then turn the barrel upside down, the round should fall out.

 

[MYM&P]

The round appear to be hanging up on the ramp(will pay closer attention next time I am at the range) I am using a lee 4 hole turret press and was told since I am using a bulge buster die to take the factory crimp die out of the equation. The only crimp being used is the one produced from the bullet seating die ( very light). Also when I drop the magazine the round will then chamber. On a lighter side I am getting real quick dropping and reinserting mags.

 

[MYM&P]

Thanks for the reply's. I am using mixed brass and am acting on advice given to me from folks at the range on both the bulge buster and bullet weight. I have done the barrel test and all the COL I have tried seem to work. In as much as I know they should work. I should also throw in the pistol works a lot better with factory ammo but really cant afford to due that much shooting using only factory ammo.

 

[Dragon88]

Sounds like you need to get a handle on your crimp. You need to measure it and set your crimp die or die body to a specific measurement. I like .421" crimp in 40 S&W and 10mm. This is measured right at the case mouth just before your calipers would slide off onto the bullet.

I don't think the bulge buster is necessary. I would take it out and do a final crimp stage. Proper crimp is more important.

 

[growr]

I too shoot USPSA?IPDA with an M&P .40 FS not a PRO and like rule3 wonder why you are using such a heavy bullet?
I have used Montana Gold bullets for years and usually use a 165 projectile. You are shooting cardboard and a 155/165 will VERY consistently knock down any steel.

As far as your feeding issues go, rule 3 also has it right for testing the ammo in YOUR barrel. I have never used or needed a bulge buster type die as my Dillon carbide dies do what I need.

I would also invest in a Wilson/Dillon case gauge as another means of checking your ammo.

Randy

PS. does you gun mis-behave with factory ammo also? As dragon 88 mentioned more details would be helpful.

 

[MYM&P]

I just checked the crimp on 50 rounds I loaded this morning and its running .4205 to point .4210. I have noticed that my COL is somewhat inconsistent it will run currently from 1.1295 to 1.1330 or so but chalked that up to using mixed brass. I have been thinking of buying the case gauge will do.

 

[OKFC05]

also run the completed round thru a Lee bulge buster die in a separate operation.

Well, that's a mistake. Do the work on the brass before you load it....
Where to start?
Particularly for .40, push through sizing before loading is a good idea (it has cured my .40 rejects from "smileys" left in the brass near the head; I use range trash brass). At any rate, do all your sizing before loading and forget the FCD and bulge buster after the cartridge is loaded. Put a normal taper crimp on it.

Get a drop-in cartridge gauge so you can find out whether you are loading to SAAMI cartridge specs; don't guess.

I have seen 200gr .40 work in XDs, but never tried it in an M&P. I know 180gr works fine.

To repeat, the key to good loading is to get the brass right before loading, not keep messing with it after loading. After you seat and taper crimp, it should drop right into the case gauge.

 

[MYM&P]

The theory for the 200 gr bullet was to try to mimic the factory loads that seem to work better than the reloads. I will go back to using the bulge blaster first but have tried it both ways and haven't really seen any different results.

 

[Rule3]

The theory for the 200 gr bullet was to try to mimic the factory loads that seem to work better than the reloads. I will go back to using the bulge blaster first but have tried it both ways and haven't really seen any different results.

What 200 gr factory loads? Using a bigger (heavier bullet) means you are stuffing more of it into the case and potential of increasing pressure in a high pressure round.

But, your choice. As mentioned, probably a crimp issue. Rather than a Bulge Buster, try the Lee Factory crimp die. (yes lots of folks say Nay, but many more like them as you can crimp as a separate stage)

You might find this interesting:

Make Right With a ".40 Lite"

 

[OKFC05]

The theory for the 200 gr bullet was to try to mimic the factory loads that seem to work better than the reloads. I will go back to using the bulge blaster first but have tried it both ways and haven't really seen any different results.

Well, we're trying very hard to be helpful and not hurt your feelings.
Let me put it this way.
1. You are using a weird load with a powder that is too fast for optimum and may be underpowered, causing short stroking of the slide.
2. Your loads are inconsistent in size and feeding.
3. The loading procedures you are using don't appear in any loading manual.
4. You haven't gauged your loads, not even in your barrel.

All of us (who load .40) guarantee that if you get a 165 or 180gr plated or jacketed bullet and load it to Power Factor 165 using Titegroup, HP38, or similar powders so the cartridge drops freely in and out of a cartridge gauge, it will shoot as well as any factory ammo.

Other than that, the only suggstion I have is to master standard handloads before you start experimenting.

 

[MYM&P]

Thanks for all the help. It is time to reorder bullets so I am going to try the 165 as suggested. will get a case gauge and start all over. I have been given a LOT of advice over the last 8 months on loads and such and appears not all was correct
Thanks again

 

[growr]

The load I have used for years on my .40's is MTG 165, 7.0 grns AA#5, any and all picked up range brass, 15,000 rounds downrange in USPSA/IDPA without a hiccup. Makes major, cycles the gun, Point of Aim and Point of Impact are the same and brass ejects to the same spot...what else do I need?

The suggestions offered by OKFCO5 and others is well stated...

Might work for you as well....

Randy

PS. I have used bullets as light as 135 grn .40 and was able to take down any steel and make major, much prefer 165 MTG bullets however.

 

[Rule3]

Thanks for all the help. It is time to reorder bullets so I am going to try the 165 as suggested. will get a case gauge and start all over. I have been given a LOT of advice over the last 8 months on loads and such and appears not all was correct
Thanks again

We are here to help, but the best "advice" comes from your manuals not online.

Try the lighter bullets, a different powder and check your taper crimp and OAL. Good luck and be safe.

 

[growr]

We are here to help, but the best "advice" comes from your manuals not online.

Try the lighter bullets, a different powder and check your taper crimp and OAL. Good luck and be safe.

Rule3 is SO correct ......get manuals either on line from the manufacturers or buy hard copies. Hard to go wrong when you follow the manual. It is also very helpful to use a chronograph if you have access to one.

Randy

 

[Skip Sackett]

200 gr Montana gold bullets
5.3 gr Bullseye
CCI small pistol primers
1.130 COL

Welcome to the forum! I have made reliable loads just not with that weight of bullets. Those are designed for using in the 10MM, not the 40S&W.

My loads have been designed around the 180gr bullets. I use loads with a much different powder. In fact, I would never use Bullseye in a 40S&W load of any kind, period. Nothing faster than Unique. My powder of choice for these kinds of loads is SR4756. The other powder of choice would be Longshot. Both will give higher velocities with much lower pressures. The M&P is not a firearm to worry about but others are and should be cautioned against.

FWIW

 

[engineermike]

I gotta ask, where did you get your load data. I'm looking at the Lee manual and it show Bullseye to be 4.2g to 4.6g for a 200g jacketed bullet with an O.A.L./C.O.L of 1.130. Isn't 5.3 a little/lot heavy?

 

[Paul5388]

I think there has been a lot of uncalled for criticism, mainly due to an inability to read. This is what he said

I have done the barrel test and all the COL I have tried seem to work.

and then

I just checked the crimp on 50 rounds I loaded this morning and its running .4205 to point .4210.

So why is everyone ragging on his technique when he has already done what was suggested?

You want him to read the loading manuals, but you don't even read what he is doing. Light load may be short stroking the slide, but it may be a quite heavy load. Crimp isn't right, but that doesn't have anything to do with feed ramp problems, but the crimp is actually right anyway.

I should also throw in the pistol works a lot better with factory ammo

That doesn't mean without problems, or does it? If factory loads aren't 100%, there probably isn't much wrong with the load and everything wrong with the gun or magazine.

 

[OKFC05]

Light load may be short stroking the slide, but it may be a quite heavy load.

Not so fast. With a powder that is too fast for the application, it is quite possible to hit max PEAK pressure and still fail to make enough total energy (integrated area under the pressure curve) to operate the slide fully.

And the technique I questioned was push through sizing a loaded cartridge.