I am about to start reloading after about a 10 yr absence. This will be reloading for my Savage 223 rifle bolt action. Do I remember correctly that if I save the brass from just that rifle and reload it for just that rifle, it does not really need to be resized? These will be subsonic loads in manufactured subsonic brass.
Reload without sizing
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nbedford
Member
Well, the old whack a mole Lee Loaders only neck sized. I would venture that you would need to neck size at a bare minimum. Try one and see if it will chamber after neck sizing. Course need to at least chamfer the case mouth if using jacketed, or bell the mouth if using cast.
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Ray1970
Member
I only neck size the brass for my bolt guns. Always have. Only gets tricky keeping everything organized if you have multiple rifles in the same caliber.
ajgunner
Member
Without sizing the mouth, when you try to seat a bullet it will simply just slide right in---and probably fall right out when you turn it upside down.
smithra_66
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It always needs to be neck sized after firing.
The case will also grow in length on each firing, so eventually you will need to bump the shoulder back (otherwise you will have a hard time closing the bolt).
You can definitely neck-size-only for several firings though.
OP
Thanks for all your help. You have jogged my memory that the neck sizing will definitely be necessary and chamfer the case mouth; and eventually a full sizing. As mentioned, that should not be for a while, especially as these are subsonic loads. I do have a S&W M&P Sport 15, but keeping the manufactured subsonic brass right back in the box they came from keeps the bolt action separate. Thanks again!
Perhaps a term I am unfamiliar with,,, "Subsonic Brass"?? Subsonic would be any round under 1125 FPS. Is there a specific manufacturer for this brass?
Please do not be offended by my question. If I do not know,,,, gotta ask
Please do not be offended by my question. If I do not know,,,, gotta ask
The first die in all my sets is a re-sizing/depriming die and I have used it every time I reload any caliber round. Since my priming attachment is mounted on my press, I use my press to deprime anyway, so resize every case as well. The effort of lubing the brass is nothing compared to keeping rifle brass shot from every gun I own in a different bag and not getting them mixed up. I guess I just have too many guns.
AJ
US Veteran
Gary,
You probably do have to many. It is an affliction that most of us have. I have five gun safes in my house and a couple of pistol safes. I will be starting rebab soon says my wife!
AJ
Ray1970
Member
OP
I knew that term did not feel right when I typed it. No, it is not any special brass. When I knew my suppressor was on its way I purchased 100 round of subsonic each from Atomic and Beck. So, the brass is new brass that they used to load those subsonic rounds and I keep the brass after I fire it and put it right back in the box it came from. When those 200 rounds are near the end I will reload some of them to make my own subsonic ammo. I have no good reason to do any of this. I just think a suppressor is "interesting" and every time I fire my 223 without any hearing protection and all I hear is the clang of the gong I shoot at, it brings a smile to my face. Glad you asked, you were right, the term did not make any sense the way I used it.
HorizontalMike
US Veteran
On .223 I have found that I need to use a full length sizing die, PLUS use this Redding Competition shell holder set:
I use the 0.010" shell holder in order to resize the very base of my "shot xxx" brass" because mine tend to bulge and not properly fit in a .223 Gauge (a much needed addition also).
AND
BOTH of the above can be found on MidwayUSA, and other sites.
I use the 0.010" shell holder in order to resize the very base of my "shot xxx" brass" because mine tend to bulge and not properly fit in a .223 Gauge (a much needed addition also).
AND
BOTH of the above can be found on MidwayUSA, and other sites.
On .223 I have found that I need to use a full length sizing die, PLUS use this Redding Competition shell holder set
What are you shooting them in?
I have a Rem 788 .223, an AR .223 Wilde, and an AR shooting a .223-based 6mm wildcat and have yet to need a case gauge. The 788 and wildcat get a .002-.003 shoulder bump while the AR gets full length sizing. I use the same dies for the AR and 788, utilizing die shims to reset the adjustment for the 788's shoulder bump.
gwpercle
Member
You will need to at least size the neck smaller , neck sizing die or just partially size with FL sizing die .
The fired case neck wont hold a new bullets securely in place ... sometimes the bullet will just fall into the case ... the new bullet needs to be held firmly for feeding and proper powder burning .
Gary
HorizontalMike
US Veteran
I have a S&W Sport II 5.56/.223 AR-15. I have been known to pick up range brass, and when I do, I find that nearly all range brass need full length sizing just as you allude to. Using the Redding Competition shell holders, I do not have to change my die adjustment.
BTW, I do check/trim brass length and chamfer, even on new brass. Have not reloaded that much .223 so I still need to learn more on neck-sizing only. However, at this point, I am not overly consumed with absolute accuracy since I am trying to keep my Sport II as iron sights only for SD/HD.
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If you're going to be firing the same brass in the same rifle, size just enough with your full length die so that brass will chamber with very slight resistance. The die adjustment will be short of full-length sizing. This takes but a little experimentation to get your size die set up right. This will work with all rifle cartridges including magnums.
Depending on rifle, chamber, load, and other factors that can vary, you may have to full length resize occasionally, maybe after 3-6 loadings. Your brass life will likely be extended. You need no special dies (including a neck sizing only die), but a case gauge can be handy and every handloader should have a good quality dial caliper.
You mentioned using a bolt-action rifle. The above-listed suggestions are for bolt-action guns. Rules are very different if using an AR15 or a copy. Full-length sizing every time is best for 100% reliability in chambering and feeding and a case gauge becomes far more meaningful and necessary.
nbedford
Member
I learn most things from bitter experience. My 788 would run all my 223 reloads, but my AR gave me problems until I seriously started measuring case length and trimming to a trim length of less than 1.760" (some of my Lake City was 1.780 - 1.785!), and started using a Lee RGB die set that was essentially a small base sizer. Not as important with a bolt action, but mentioned it for those who have to extract an unfixed round from an AR with a nylon hammer like I have.
HorizontalMike
US Veteran
BINGO! I am finding the same, though I do not claim any extensive experience in .223 calibers. I have zeroed in on the correct AR loading (eventually), and now enjoy it much.
I originally over bought/estimated my .222 Rem needs many years ago. Fortunately, my over-estimates/purchases has paid off big time...
I love my bolt action .222 Rem, however, having so much excessive supplies for the compatible .223 Rem (in everything but brass) has led to an entirely new and rewarding .223 Rem experience! No regrets!...!LC and some others use a stamped crimp on the case mouth which makes for a longer neck. It looks like the mouth has flattened edges. If you see that, expect to have to trim them before reloading, usually trimming all the flattened crimp off to reach SAAMI case length.
