Reloads won't fit in Ruger Security Six

[pharos]

I have an old Smith 19-3, and a Ruger Security-Six. It seems that the chambers in my 19-3 are more generous than those in my Security-Six. My 357 reloads fit perfectly in my 19-3, but many are too tight for my Security-Six. Both are resized in RCBS dies, and I use a Lyman M die for expanding the case mouths. Any suggestions?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Sorry but more information is needed since there are many reasons why a round won't fit in a cylinder. Brass length? OAL? Bullet? Bullet diameter? Anything else you have...

 

[NYlakesider]

I have an old Smith 19-3, and a Ruger Security-Six. It seems that the chambers in my 19-3 are more generous than those in my Security-Six. My 357 reloads fit perfectly in my 19-3, but many are too tight for my Security-Six. Both are resized in RCBS dies, and I use a Lyman M die for expanding the case mouths. Any suggestions?

What's the problem diameter or length causing the non fitment?

I have a (Circa 72) S.S .357. and 3 other .357 Smiths and all ammo fits all guns no problem...

The S.S. you have is it a .38 or 357?

 

[rwsmith]

The rounds that won't fit......

Where do they stop when you put them in? Do they consistently stop in the same place? Does pressing them harder make them go in farther?. Are they hard to extract when they are in as far as they will go?

 

[ArkieVol]

I had a similar problem with an occasional reloaded case from the same batch refusing to chamber. I assume, but don't know for sure, that seating a bullet sometimes causes a case to bulge ever so slightly.

I bought Lee crimp dies for each caliber and have had no problems since. Crimping is optional with either your seating die or the Lee crimp die but either way the Lee crimp die re-sizes the case again as the final step.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Reloading dies resize cases down to about 1/4" or so forward of the rim, a point on the case head area that routinely expands noticeably when the cartridge is fired. Also, repeated resizing actually displaces some brass toward the case head area, which can add to this dimensional problem.

Assuming that your S&W chambers are somewhat larger in diameter than the Ruger's, cases fired in the S&W chambers may be expanded in the case head area to a degree that the resizing die cannot reduce in sizing.

You may find that the solution is to segregate your cases, using some for the Ruger and the rest for the S&W.

 

[pharos]

Reloads won't fit in Ruger Security-Six

Both the M-19 and Security-Six are 357. I'm reloading Oregon Trail 158 gr. RNFP and SNS in the same weight and configuration.
The rounds will hang up about one quarter to one eighth inch from the base of the case in the Ruger. Almost like I'm trying to load then in a 38spl cylinder. I thought that perhaps the Ruger cylinder needed a good scrubbing after firing thousands of 38spl rounds. Did that - the cylinder is clean, but the results are the same.

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[NYlakesider]

Both the M-19 and Security-Six are 357. I'm reloading Oregon Trail 158 gr. RNFP and SNS in the same weight and configuration.
The rounds will hang up about one quarter to one eighth inch from the base of the case in the Ruger. Almost like I'm trying to load then in a 38spl cylinder. I thought that perhaps the Ruger cylinder needed a good scrubbing after firing thousands of 38spl rounds. Did that - the cylinder is clean, but the results are the same.

Thanks in advance for your help.

How close to the rim is your resizing die set? If you have a mike or caliper check the O.D. of your cases all the way to the rim.

 

[MichiganScott]

I'd check the roll crimp first to be certain you aren't bulging the case around the mouth. You could be bottoming out on the cylinder shoulder. You also need to check and be sure the cases are trimmed below SAAMI max.

 

[GrayGhost99]

I would try just a sized cases first. From there a factory round fired through the ruger, reload it and see how it goes.

 

[sellersm]

I would try just a sized cases first. From there a factory round fired through the ruger, reload it and see how it goes.

^This. Follow logical steps, eliminate variables one-at-a-time. First just the factory brass fired in that Ruger, that's been resized. Then add another step: flare it, load a bullet, crimp and try that. Etc.

 

[mikld]

Whenever there is a fit issue, measure!. To troubleshoot, you'll need to know where the offending round is too big so you can find out when the round becomes too big. Or you could just use WAGs...

 

[Shooter Magaven]

....after firing thousands of 38spl rounds....

.

Thousands? In a 357?
Hmmm... may need more than a scrub

 

[rwsmith]

Yeah...

Thousands? In a 357?
Hmmm... may need more than a scrub

Yeah, make sure the step in the chamber is clean, not just the chambers. That will stop an inserted cartridge almost 1/8" from from bottoming out because the .357 case is that much longer than the .38.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Both the M-19 and Security-Six are 357. I'm reloading Oregon Trail 158 gr. RNFP and SNS in the same weight and configuration.
The rounds will hang up about one quarter to one eighth inch from the base of the case in the Ruger. Almost like I'm trying to load then in a 38spl cylinder. I thought that perhaps the Ruger cylinder needed a good scrubbing after firing thousands of 38spl rounds. Did that - the cylinder is clean, but the results are the same.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Please review my earlier post. The conditions you are describing are completely consistent with the diagnosis offered earlier.

If this were related to case mouth expansion, or swelling of the case mouth as a bullet was seated, then the obstruction would occur at that point. This is not the case. Your reloaded ammunition is hanging up at the case head area where the resizing die does not reduce case diameter, and the cases fired in the larger chambers have expanded to a diameter that prevents chambering in the smaller chambers.

Solution #1: As previously suggested, use one lot of cases for one revolver and another lot of cases for the other.

Solution #2: Have a qualified gunsmith ream out the smaller diameter chambers to match those of the larger diameter piece.

Solution #1 sounds much easier and much less expensive.

Best regards.

 

[scooter123]

As can be seen in this thread there are multiple potential causes. In order to determine an exact cause I find that proceeding methodically is usually the shortest path to a solution.

1) It's been suggested that the case heads may be expanded. Any easy way to confirm of eliminate this possibility is to insert some empty, sized, and unflared case into the chambers of your Ruger. If they hang up in the same manner as your completed cartridges it would lead me to conclude that the case head is indeed expanded.

2) Another potential is a cylinder that still has enough of a carbon ring to prevent a case from being inserted fully. One test that may be revealing is to insert a fired casing from your model 19. By doing this you will actually be testing if the chambers in your Ruger are indeed smaller than those in your model 19. If that is the case you probably will not be able to get the fired casing in the chambers on your Ruger or they will only go in by a small amount. If the chambers in your Ruger are actually at a similar size to your model 19 then those cases will slide right in. Then if you find they stop about 1/8 inch shy of fully seated I think that it would be reasonable to conclude the cylinder on your Ruger still needs some work. If so a 40 caliber brush chucked up in a drill at low speed with some Hoppes #9 or similar cleaner should help in getting that carbon cleaned out.

3) Next potential problem area is oversize bullets in cases with thicker than typical walls. This can cause an assembled cartridge that is over the SAAMI maximum diameter enough to cause issues in a chamber that is slightly carboned up or machined with a slight taper. It will also cause a complete no go situation if the chambers were reamed to the SAAMI minimum or under for the chamber diameter. One solution to this particular issue is to use a Lee Factory Crimp Die to crimp your cases. Because the FCD features a sizing ring that is set specifically to the maximum SAAMI case diameter. Yeah, it can size a big bullet down a bit but I've never observed any loss in accuracy when using the Lee FCD.

Finally, it's been suggested that you do some measuring and I think that is an excellent suggestion. As an aid to doing this you will find the attached PDF of the SAAMI specifications for 357 Magnum useful.

 

[pharos]

Reloads won't fit in Ruger Security-Six

Thanks for all the good info and suggestions. I think I'll take the lazy man's way out and get a Lee FCD. Looking for one load for my 357's and little Marlin lever gun.

On a related note, I've only posted on this site a few times, although I visit here almost daily. In my view, this is the best firearms site on the 'net. Guess I'm not much of an Internet gadfly, but like lots of others, I'm out there, and appreciate the vast amount of knowledge available here.

Thanks, again.

Pharos

 

[reddog81]

I have had the same experience however the guns were different models. I have a Ruger GP100, S&W M28-2, model 66(no dash). My model 66 has the tightest tolerances, and the GP100 has the loosest tolerances. Rounds that won't even make it half way into the model 66 will chamber in the GP100 with a slight push.

I have always taken the easy way out to resolve the problem. Shoot the slightly oversized rounds in the Ruger.

 

[elpac3]

sell the Ruger

 

[mikld]

Being a lifelong machinist/mechanic and reloading for 30 years, I find using a Lee FCD when a real problem is identified as offensive. To further your reloading expertise, find out why the rounds will not chamber! If you don't find a solution to this problem, what are you going to do the next time you have a problem? Alter your gun to fit your misshapen ammo?

IMO using an FCD is like having a nail in a tire, and just stopping by a gas station every five blocks, adding air. Don't remove the nail and patch the hole, just add more air! Your ammo doesn't fit. Why not fix it???