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Hi There,
Does anyone know what wood did they
use to make these cases?
Cheers,
Webb
Does anyone know what wood did they
use to make these cases?
Cheers,
Webb
S&W .32 CF SA Factory Case
- Thread starter wlw-19958
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From research notes:
The Wood is always of high grade Oak, Mahogany, Birds Eye or Curly Maple.
In some cases multiple types are used. Example: Maple with pine base.
I have seen different factory cases with different brass fittings.
Many were sold in bulk to Distributors and likely copied by their box makers.
Murph
The Wood is always of high grade Oak, Mahogany, Birds Eye or Curly Maple.
In some cases multiple types are used. Example: Maple with pine base.
I have seen different factory cases with different brass fittings.
Many were sold in bulk to Distributors and likely copied by their box makers.
Murph
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Hi There,
I think I haven't made myself clear. I am referring to the cases that were
sold by the Factory as an accessory for the S&W .32 CF SA No: 1-1/2.
I currently have three of these cases and one is damaged and I wish to
repair it and I would like to use a wood that matches as well as can be.
The sides look like a they could be from the Prunus genus in the
Rosaceae family. Perhaps from the Prunus avium.
Cheers!
Webb
I think I haven't made myself clear. I am referring to the cases that were
sold by the Factory as an accessory for the S&W .32 CF SA No: 1-1/2.
I currently have three of these cases and one is damaged and I wish to
repair it and I would like to use a wood that matches as well as can be.
The sides look like a they could be from the Prunus genus in the
Rosaceae family. Perhaps from the Prunus avium.
Cheers!
Webb
mmaher94087
Member
I cannot add anything as I do not know the wood species. The late David Chicoine and I had this same conversation many, many years ago and I believe his response was Basswood. Please do not hold me to this as 40+ years ago is too long for me to remember the conversation. What did you have for dinner yesterday?
OP
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Hi There,
Dinner? Yesterday? Roast Beef.
I don’t think it is Basswood. The grain structure
doesn’t look right plus the color isn’t red
enough.
Stained Poplar wood could be a possibility
but I haven’t checked to see.
Cheers!
Webb
Last edited:
OP
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Hi There,
Mahogany (Swietenia) is a large family of native American hardwoods.
Mostly found in tropic and semi-tropic climates. Depending on the
variety, the colors run from red to red-brown. Swietenia macrophylla
and Sweitenia mahagoni would be the most likely of the Mahogany
family to be used in this case.
These cases were not made of the exotic woods used in fancy cases.
They would be made from less expensive woods (I would think).
These were not made for high retail and the wood wasn't "fancy."
Cheers!
Webb
Mahogany (Swietenia) is a large family of native American hardwoods.
Mostly found in tropic and semi-tropic climates. Depending on the
variety, the colors run from red to red-brown. Swietenia macrophylla
and Sweitenia mahagoni would be the most likely of the Mahogany
family to be used in this case.
These cases were not made of the exotic woods used in fancy cases.
They would be made from less expensive woods (I would think).
These were not made for high retail and the wood wasn't "fancy."
Cheers!
Webb
Seems like Mahogany was pretty standard. Photo comparison with Distributor cases the grain and color looks pretty close.
I wonder if they had a wood case for the 3” barrel. They list the 3” as standard but you sure don’t see a lot of them. Like this extremely rare 3” barrel pasteboard box?
Murph
I wonder if they had a wood case for the 3” barrel. They list the 3” as standard but you sure don’t see a lot of them. Like this extremely rare 3” barrel pasteboard box?
Murph
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Hi There,
Very Nice! That case has the pores of a
Mahogany. I’m not good enough to tell
which species.
Cheers!
Webb
Very Nice! That case has the pores of a
Mahogany. I’m not good enough to tell
which species.
Cheers!
Webb
I’m sorry, I should clarify the 3 case photos are from 3 separate cases. The 2 exterior photos are Factory wood cases for the 32cf SA. The last open case is listed as a Mahogany case and is a period Distributor case. All 3 seem to be a close match to me. Looking at Factory cases listed in my Neil & Jinks copy they also look near identical to the 3rd open case but no listing as far as wood type used.
Murph
Murph
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Hi There,
I wondered about the pics being from different boxes. Doesn't matter at
the moment. The more I look at the South American and Honduras
Mahoganies, the more they are looking like they are correct. I will have
to acquire a few samples of these Mahoganies and examine them up
close and test them with different finishes to check for a match.
The problem with these cases is the way they were constructed. The long
sides were cut with a slot roughly 1/4" from the left and right hand ends.
These slots are cut perpendicular, across the grain to provide a means for
the end panels to "lock" together and to provide a small amount of sur-
face for the glue to adhere to.
Now, those who have fooled around with wood and gluing it together
have learned that end grain doesn't hold well with glue. It will be the
first point to give way. This means the only point that is really holding
the end panels on is a very thin piece of wood. See pics for examples.
The arrow shows the typical type of break these cases suffer.
Cheers!
Webb
I wondered about the pics being from different boxes. Doesn't matter at
the moment. The more I look at the South American and Honduras
Mahoganies, the more they are looking like they are correct. I will have
to acquire a few samples of these Mahoganies and examine them up
close and test them with different finishes to check for a match.
The problem with these cases is the way they were constructed. The long
sides were cut with a slot roughly 1/4" from the left and right hand ends.
These slots are cut perpendicular, across the grain to provide a means for
the end panels to "lock" together and to provide a small amount of sur-
face for the glue to adhere to.
Now, those who have fooled around with wood and gluing it together
have learned that end grain doesn't hold well with glue. It will be the
first point to give way. This means the only point that is really holding
the end panels on is a very thin piece of wood. See pics for examples.
The arrow shows the typical type of break these cases suffer.
Cheers!
Webb
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Boulder350
Member
I think they are made from quarter sawn walnut. Cutting walnut quarter sawn will give the strait grain that the Smith & Wesson case has. Here are some pictures of an old walnut cabinet that is plain sliced next to a Smith and Wesson Case, which is quarter sawn. Plain slice wood gives the arches in the grain like the old cabinet. The pic with the string is the drawer front where the finish yellowed with time. The other picture is of the bottom of the drawer from the same cabinet that has not been exposed to the sun, hence the different color (less yellow). I think they used a shellac finish. I never used shellac myself so have no experince with it. The drawer is old, you can tell by the joinery at the corners. Did I mention I was a cabinet maker for a few years and still dabble in it.
Quarter sawn wood is much more stable than the other cuts of wood so it does not warp like the plain slice wood does.
Did a web search for quater sawn walnut vs the plain slice. This is one that came up. I'm not affiliated with them at all and have never bought from them.
doogeveneers.com
Quarter sawn wood is much more stable than the other cuts of wood so it does not warp like the plain slice wood does.
Did a web search for quater sawn walnut vs the plain slice. This is one that came up. I'm not affiliated with them at all and have never bought from them.
WALNUT-AMERICAN-BLACK WOOD VENEER | Dooge Veneers
American walnut is the quintessential native hardwood and a hallmark of wood quality and tradition—one of the country’s most versatile, varied, and well-loved veneers. It produces a wider variety of figures than any other wood. Quarter cut veneers have a straight, even grain; flat cut produces a...
doogeveneers.com
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OP
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Hi There,
No, I don't think it is Black Walnut. All the Black Walnut I have is too dark.
It doesn't have the red color these cases exhibit. I dug out an old piece of
Cherry that I had under the workbench and it is a good match color wise.
Even the grain looks similar. I'll post some pics later.
As to quarter-sawn wood, that was the way my Father usually bought his
wood. It makes a better looking gunstock IMHO.
Cheers!
Webb
No, I don't think it is Black Walnut. All the Black Walnut I have is too dark.
It doesn't have the red color these cases exhibit. I dug out an old piece of
Cherry that I had under the workbench and it is a good match color wise.
Even the grain looks similar. I'll post some pics later.
As to quarter-sawn wood, that was the way my Father usually bought his
wood. It makes a better looking gunstock IMHO.
Cheers!
Webb
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Hi There,
Here are some pics. You can see the missing side on the right.
Here I am comparing a piece of very old black cherry to the inside edges
where there isn't any finish. The color match is very, very good. The grain
matches better or worst depending on which side of the cherry wood one
compares. This piece of cherry is very old. At lease 100 years old. I libera-
ted it from the rafters of a small barn close to 40 years ago and the owner
told me, at that time, it had been up there for at least 75 years.
The planks were rough sawn and the wood had oxidized to black on the
surface. My, at the time, soon to be Father-in-Law had a thickness planer
and the boards were run through it and you see the results.
There is some sap wood on this board and the slightly coarser grain of the
sap wood is a good match for the top of the case.
Anyway take a look and tell me what you think.
Cheers!
Webb
Here are some pics. You can see the missing side on the right.
Here I am comparing a piece of very old black cherry to the inside edges
where there isn't any finish. The color match is very, very good. The grain
matches better or worst depending on which side of the cherry wood one
compares. This piece of cherry is very old. At lease 100 years old. I libera-
ted it from the rafters of a small barn close to 40 years ago and the owner
told me, at that time, it had been up there for at least 75 years.
The planks were rough sawn and the wood had oxidized to black on the
surface. My, at the time, soon to be Father-in-Law had a thickness planer
and the boards were run through it and you see the results.
There is some sap wood on this board and the slightly coarser grain of the
sap wood is a good match for the top of the case.
Anyway take a look and tell me what you think.
Cheers!
Webb
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OP
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Hi There,
No. You don't see that many of these with the 3" barrel; and blue too!
I only have one 3" .32 CF in my collection (so far).
Cheers!
Webb
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Boulder350
Member
I doubt the wood is cherry. Cherry ages more that most woods, turning much darker with age, on the outside. The inside is never exposed to the sun so when you machine it, you expose the original wood color. Once the surface is exposed to the sun for a few years, the surface darkens back up.
The other option I did not check out was mahogany. I have not worked with mahogany but I have a piece my wife got from her family. It is generally has a reddish tone but the pores are much larger and more frequent with the mahogany than walnut.
I still think the cases are made of walnut. Have you compared your case to a set of good condition antique walnut grips?
I just looked at the board you have again. That actually looks like mahogany. I have raw mahogany and cherry in my wood shop. The first picture is of my 32 case in front of mahogany. The second picture is the case, then cherry, and in the back is mahogany. The cherry has the numbers in it.
The other option I did not check out was mahogany. I have not worked with mahogany but I have a piece my wife got from her family. It is generally has a reddish tone but the pores are much larger and more frequent with the mahogany than walnut.
I still think the cases are made of walnut. Have you compared your case to a set of good condition antique walnut grips?
I just looked at the board you have again. That actually looks like mahogany. I have raw mahogany and cherry in my wood shop. The first picture is of my 32 case in front of mahogany. The second picture is the case, then cherry, and in the back is mahogany. The cherry has the numbers in it.
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Boulder350
Member
I just asked the internet if walnut lightens or darkens with age. It said Walnut lightens with age
OP
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Hi There,
I will have to make a closer (microscopic) examination to be sure but the
color of the Mahogany isn't red enough. Judging from the grain structure
these boxes were made as a solid box first and then sawn through to create
the top and bottom. And the new edges created when the box is sawn are
not finish and are the raw wood color.
I will admit that it might be something other than Cherry but that piece of
wood has the right color and the grain is close. Seeing that I am trying to
match (as close as I can) the wood that is part of the case, the raw color is
important to match. That is the main reason I am favoring the piece of
Black Cherry I showed.
Mahoganies I have seen so far haven't had the correct color but many varieties
of Mahogany are now protected and those Countries have banned the harvest
and export of Mahogany. So, an exact match may not be possible and this be-
comes a case of what I can get (or already have) that is "close enough."
As to Cherry getting darker with age, yes you are right. It sure does. But sunlight
bleaches Cherry. I have my Grandfather's Cherry wood desk and it sat up to a win-
dow for 50+ years (before I got it) and the part of the top that received the direct
sunlight bleached out and looks like sap wood now. The plank I showed is at least
100 years old and it was "fresh planed" in 1986 and has a lot of time to darken.
So, the color is going to be relatively stable (I think).
I'm going to do some more research. I purchased a book on wood identification
so I can learn more. I'll keep looking and learning and will report on my progress.
Cheers!
Webb
I will have to make a closer (microscopic) examination to be sure but the
color of the Mahogany isn't red enough. Judging from the grain structure
these boxes were made as a solid box first and then sawn through to create
the top and bottom. And the new edges created when the box is sawn are
not finish and are the raw wood color.
I will admit that it might be something other than Cherry but that piece of
wood has the right color and the grain is close. Seeing that I am trying to
match (as close as I can) the wood that is part of the case, the raw color is
important to match. That is the main reason I am favoring the piece of
Black Cherry I showed.
Mahoganies I have seen so far haven't had the correct color but many varieties
of Mahogany are now protected and those Countries have banned the harvest
and export of Mahogany. So, an exact match may not be possible and this be-
comes a case of what I can get (or already have) that is "close enough."
As to Cherry getting darker with age, yes you are right. It sure does. But sunlight
bleaches Cherry. I have my Grandfather's Cherry wood desk and it sat up to a win-
dow for 50+ years (before I got it) and the part of the top that received the direct
sunlight bleached out and looks like sap wood now. The plank I showed is at least
100 years old and it was "fresh planed" in 1986 and has a lot of time to darken.
So, the color is going to be relatively stable (I think).
I'm going to do some more research. I purchased a book on wood identification
so I can learn more. I'll keep looking and learning and will report on my progress.
Cheers!
Webb
Boulder350
Member
Was reading the section in the Smith & Wesson 5th addition about the 320 revolving rifle. It mentions the butt stock was made from Circassian Walnut. The 320 Revolving rifle was made from 1879 - 1887, the 32 S&W case was made about the same time. Here is a picture of a revolving rifle stock and a 32 S&W case side by side.
