S&W .38/.44

[JwesleyN]

I’m looking at a pre war .38/.44 heavy duty and there are just 2 photos left side and right side. The seller had little info on it so I asked a few questions. Was it reamed for .357 and do the serial numbers match? His answer to the first was he didn’t know. He answered my second question by explaining where the serial number was and there’s an assembly #s on pre war S&Ws. I asked again telling him the SN on the butt should match the back of the cylinder and under the barrel. He replied that a .357 would not chamber and they matched. My concern is the bluing looks original on everything but the cylinder. It has that plum like patina you usually see pretty much all over on old guns. Just seemed off to me. What do you all think?

 

[dzimmo]

We would need to see the pictures for a better answer, but for now it does seem like he's trying to pull a fast one.

 

[paplinker]

How is the sideplate fit and the logo stamp? Plum cylinders do happen but it does make me be more wary of a reblue.

 

[Tijeras_Slim]

i had a 1917 with a plum cylinder that didn’t look like it had been refinished. Also a Winchester 1894 that was purple all over, never figured why it does that.

 

[bpd303]

Lots of times the plum color in a picture is due to camera and lighting. I would ask him to send some more pictures. Then post them in your thread here.
Kinda like my Outdoorsman it looks purple on the side plate, but strictly camera and lighting.


Please don't take offense with Yoda...I think he is cute....

 

[bigggbbruce]

Is this gun refinished. Sideplate seam is open and logo looks light.

 

[bpd303]

Not refinished as far as I know and I have had it since 1990. The side plate is tight and I've had it off several times over the years. The logo is normal possibly a little lighter than later guns, it was made in 1938. The side plate bluing is the same as the cylinder and barrel.
My old camera does not take very good pictures and the lighting is just the kitchen overhead LED tube's and the camera's flash. This picture is a little better but you still can't see the logo.

 

[RKmesa]

bpd: Unfortunately, with the washed out roll mark and the rounded side plate edges/seems, I believe your Outdoorsman has been refinished and the front sight blade has been replaced. Still a very fun gun!

Compare it against this one that has not been refinished...

 

[JwesleyN]

We would need to see the pictures for a better answer, but for now it does seem like he's trying to pull a fast one.

It’s still an active listing and I felt posting pics of it would be for lack of a better word uncool. It’s a personal listing. Looked at it on my laptop and no signs of buffing and the markings were sharp and the polish was consistent with pre war revolvers not the high polish of post war guns. Just the cylinder was plum brown like oiled fine rust even on the ejector rod. I kind of think if the serial number on the cylinder match that it may have been re blued with something that turned that color. This person is asking just over $1000. It just doesn’t look right to me.

 

[JwesleyN]

Is this gun refinished. Sideplate seam is open and logo looks light.

The blue on the frame looks like your gun. That not overly polished like most reblues. I have a couple pre war S&Ws that are original blue. The strange thing is the plum brown color is on the ejector rod and I don’t think it’s lighting in the photo.

 

[Sealclair]

Sounds sketchy, mismatched cylinder patina plus vague answers are big red flags on a pre-war .38/.44 Heavy Duty. Pass unless you can inspect it in person.

 

[stansdds]

It’s still an active listing and I felt posting pics of it would be for lack of a better word uncool.

I think it is ok to post pictures, not ok to post links to active auctions or active sale offers.

 

[bpd303]

front sight blade has been replaced.

Yes it has and I have the original lower sight blade.

 

[GSP Fan]

Trust your gut.

 

[JwesleyN]

I’m looking at a pre war .38/.44 heavy duty and there are just 2 photos left side and right side. The seller had little info on it so I asked a few questions. Was it reamed for .357 and do the serial numbers match? His answer to the first was he didn’t know. He answered my second question by explaining where the serial number was and there’s an assembly #s on pre war S&Ws. I asked again telling him the SN on the butt should match the back of the cylinder and under the barrel. He replied that a .357 would not chamber and they matched. My concern is the bluing looks original on everything but the cylinder. It has that plum like patina you usually see pretty much all over on old guns. Just seemed off to me. What do you all think?

This is the Heavy Duty I’m talking about. The cylinder just doesn’t look like the rest of it.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

i had a 1917 with a plum cylinder that didn’t look like it had been refinished. Also a Winchester 1894 that was purple all over, never figured why it does that.

Friend a mdl 12 Winchester that was purple.........Results of a BAD reblue.

 

[stansdds]

This is the Heavy Duty I’m talking about. The cylinder just doesn’t look like the rest of it. View attachment 892196

Hmmmmm... I dunno, but I get a funny feeling about this one. The finish does not look right to me.

 

[lestert357]

This is the Heavy Duty I’m talking about. The cylinder just doesn’t look like the rest of it. View attachment 892196

A picture of the right side showing the side plate seam and trade mark might be more helpful, but wear and finish does not appear consistent throughout…..ejector rod appears almost bright and the cylinder shows more high edge wear than the frame. Also, of course, the grips are post war replacements. Suggest you pass on this one.

 

[paplinker]

A picture of the right side showing the side plate seam and trade mark might be more helpful, but wear and finish does not appear consistent throughout…..ejector rod appears almost bright and the cylinder shows more high edge wear than the frame. Also, of course, the grips are post war replacements. Suggest you pass on this one.

The thing about most reblues is that unless the factory did it most places do not get the sideplate seam right, right at the lowest front screw hole. Not sure if they are sanding on it off the gun and rolling the edge some or if the new bluing is thicker and creates a rolled looking edge. That area is my very first spot I examine a picture or gun in hand of a uncertain finish.

 

[JwesleyN]

A picture of the right side showing the side plate seam and trade mark might be more helpful, but wear and finish does not appear consistent throughout…..ejector rod appears almost bright and the cylinder shows more high edge wear than the frame. Also, of course, the grips are post war replacements. Suggest you pass on this one.

The sideplate looks good I can barely see the line. And no dishing around the screws and the slots are perfect. Some speckles of rust on the trigger on that side. I did gunsmithing for many years and hot blueing as well as rust and Belgian bluing. I had to play detective with some guns. People don’t like to tell you the dumb things they have done to their guns. They take them apart and put them back together wrong and have no idea how it got that way. I always kept my mouth shut but would think “ Yeah, probably some gremlin got at it” I think if that cylinder is matching that it got damaged and reblued in some manner that caused that plum color. Hot bluing one part of a gun can cause that if the temp is not right. Cold blue usually turns a muddy brown after awhile. Another possibility is the cylinder was removed to “Make it safe” and stored somewhere else to cause that patina which is actually oxidation of the finish. It’s not worth what he’s asking for it. If I could get it for $700 I might check it out? Problem is we’re in the same state but 6 or 7 hours away. Thank you all for your input.

 

[paplinker]

The sideplate looks good I can barely see the line. And no dishing around the screws and the slots are perfect. Some speckles of rust on the trigger on that side. I did gunsmithing for many years and hot blueing as well as rust and Belgian bluing. I had to play detective with some guns. People don’t like to tell you the dumb things they have done to their guns. They take them apart and put them back together wrong and have no idea how it got that way. I always kept my mouth shut but would think “ Yeah, probably some gremlin got at it” I think if that cylinder is matching that it got damaged and reblued in some manner that caused that plum color. Hot bluing one part of a gun can cause that if the temp is not right. Cold blue usually turns a muddy brown after awhile. Another possibility is the cylinder was removed to “Make it safe” and stored somewhere else to cause that patina which is actually oxidation of the finish. It’s not worth what he’s asking for it. If I could get it for $700 I might check it out? Problem is we’re in the same state but 6 or 7 hours away. Thank you all for your input.

For $600 I might make the 12 hour trip if I was bored or retired. Going to cost you 50+ in gas lol Of course I have driven 2 hours for great BBQ in the past.

 

[JwesleyN]

For $600 I might make the 12 hour trip if I was bored or retired. Going to cost you 50+ in gas lol Of course I have driven 2 hours for great BBQ in the past.

I’m retired but I get myself into projects that can frustrate me make me half crazy and get a great feeling when I get it right! Never bored lol.

 

[bpd303]

bpd: Unfortunately, with the washed out roll mark and the rounded side plate edges/seems,

As I've said before my little camera doesn't take very good pictures. The side plate does not have rounded edges and the roll marks are all crisp, not washed out. The S&W emblem is lightly stamped just like my other revolvers of that era. I had a friend take some pictures of the area in question with better lighting. What ya think, refinished or not. I say not.

 

[The Kid]

I say both revolvers in this thread have been refinished. The last one better done. than the one in the OPs question.

Sometimes guns, especially cop guns, were “dunked”, that is just disassembled and dropped into the blue tank with no prep work when going in for another small repair or maintenance. Many gun shops and armorer sheets listed this as standard or a low cost option. In these cases the markings may be crisp and the sideplate tight but often the color will be off.

On the Outdoorsman it appears to have been block polished by hand and pretty well done at that. But the sideplate isn’t the nearly invisible fit from the factory and very small polishing marks and directional changes are visible.

 

[lestert357]

What ya think, refinished or not. I say not.

This is the side plate seam on a gun with ORIGINAL FINISH (previously posted above)…..


This is the side plate seam on a REFINISHED gun (previously posted above)…..

 

[Dave Haynes]

I'm no expert and I wouldn't bother me one way or another but refinished pistols always have a polished look, that is sharp edges smoothed out etc. There is no definition if that is possible...