Local seller has this Model 4513 PC .45. Considering trading my 629-1 plus 500 in cash. Check out the pics and description of both and let me know if it is a fair trade. Gun was worked over by Teddy Jacobson and comes with 4 mags and original box and papers from the S&W PC. This seems like an interesting firearm. Thanks to all.........
S&W MODEL 4513 LEW HORTON TRADE???
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jeremy82
Member
a 629 and 500 whats wrong with the revolver id trade my 40s&w cougar in a heartbeat with 4 mags custom african mahogany wood grips
Nothing wrong with the 629. Just have too many 44's and don't have one of these. Considering they only made 179 of the 4513's in this configuration, ( as per S&W). Better chances of finding another 629 compared to finding a 4513 locally.
Nothing wrong with the 629. Just have too many 44's and don't have one of these. Considering they only made 179 of the 4513's in this configuration, ( as per S&W). Better chances of finding another 629 compared to finding a 4513 locally.
629 & $250
$500 EXTRA IS JUST TOO HIGH.
JIMP
$500 EXTRA IS JUST TOO HIGH.
JIMP
With the tiny images that you posted it is hard to tell what the 4513 is. It looks like a Shorty 45 but I can not see any of the roll marks.
Personally, I would rather own the 45. However I think the $500 kicker is way more than I would pay for the trade.
I would ask his CASH price and buy it outright. Then I would sell the 629 here on the forum. A 629 complete with original box should bring decent money.
I would also question the accuracy of the 179 production figure. Most orders for Distributor Exclusive firearms are even numbers like 200, 350, 500, etc. I find it quite unusual that a distributor would contract for 179 firearms. Most of the odd number runs were runs of left over parts and they were usually smaller numbers.
Personally, I would rather own the 45. However I think the $500 kicker is way more than I would pay for the trade.
I would ask his CASH price and buy it outright. Then I would sell the 629 here on the forum. A 629 complete with original box should bring decent money.
I would also question the accuracy of the 179 production figure. Most orders for Distributor Exclusive firearms are even numbers like 200, 350, 500, etc. I find it quite unusual that a distributor would contract for 179 firearms. Most of the odd number runs were runs of left over parts and they were usually smaller numbers.
The Figures for the shipment was from smith and wesson. There '
were definitely less than 200 shipped. As for the customer care representative. Cash price is 1350. It is a shorty 45. Confirmed as a Lew Horton. I have 650 in the 629.
were definitely less than 200 shipped. As for the customer care representative. Cash price is 1350. It is a shorty 45. Confirmed as a Lew Horton. I have 650 in the 629.
Sorry about the previous post. Tried posting with my phone. I spoke to S&W yesterday with all the info regading this Shorty 45. He told me the total amount of guns that were shipped to Lew Horton. I was informed there were two shipments. Total produced by S&W and shipped was as stated before. Cash price is $1350. So I would have $1150 into the gun. Has all the papers and box as it came from S&W as well as the extra mags and the work done by Teddy Jacobson who happens to be a very respected world class gunsmith. As well as the test target. I've seen these recently selling for around 900. So for the extra 250, I tought it was worth it as it locally available. By the time you get done with shipping and FFL charges I feel it would be very close in $$$$$. I have also attached hopefully better pics. Thanks. 
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SW CQB 45
Member
My opinion......too high for a gun that really did not need any mods.
I know teddy and he has done some work for me.....but the value of this pc gun has been hurt and you will not get those dollars back.
Those guns were/are selling plus or minus 700......at the most and dependant on condition no more than 9bills.
Again my opinion.
I know teddy and he has done some work for me.....but the value of this pc gun has been hurt and you will not get those dollars back.
Those guns were/are selling plus or minus 700......at the most and dependant on condition no more than 9bills.
Again my opinion.
There were at least two runs of Shorty 45 (product code 170075) as well as the run of Shorty 45 MK-IIs (product code 170088). The total production was at least 1200 firearms.
The serial numbers were SFF0001 through SFF???? I have seen a Shorty 45 well over the 179 mark and I have seen a Shorty 45 MK-II over the 1100 mark.
The serial numbers were SFF0001 through SFF???? I have seen a Shorty 45 well over the 179 mark and I have seen a Shorty 45 MK-II over the 1100 mark.
Why do you feel the value has been hurt???? Because it was worked by Teddy??? Here is the text giving the entire description of the gun. I would think it may add value with the extras. I have always been a "bone stock" admirer of guns. But this one just caught my eye.
- No-snag Tritium Night Sights (original adjustable sights included as well).
- Four S&W Performance Center magazines, one in unopened package.
- Full carry rig including belt, holster and mag carrier.
- Original "box" (a plastic case with the S&W Performance Center sticker and gun specifics sticker).
- Original papers (owners manual).
- Excellent condition.
- .45 ACP caliber.
- Target in photo was provided by S&W, hand-held with rest, 1.625" 8-shot group.
- No-snag Tritium Night Sights (original adjustable sights included as well).
- Four S&W Performance Center magazines, one in unopened package.
- Full carry rig including belt, holster and mag carrier.
- Original "box" (a plastic case with the S&W Performance Center sticker and gun specifics sticker).
- Original papers (owners manual).
- Excellent condition.
- .45 ACP caliber.
- Target in photo was provided by S&W, hand-held with rest, 1.625" 8-shot group.
That slide says MK2 on it. But that is not a correct MK2.
The MK2 shipped from the factory with adjustable sights.
While I have never handled Mr Jacobsons' work so I can not comment on it. I would consider modifying a Performance Center firearm by any custom gunsmith to lower it's collectability and value. Changing the sights would further reduce it's value to me.
If you are a bit paitient and look around you should be able to get into a Shorty 45 or Shorty 45 MK-II for several hundred dollars less than you are contemplating.
Now some folks just do not want to wait and the money is not an issue. The decision rests in your hands.
The MK2 shipped from the factory with adjustable sights.
While I have never handled Mr Jacobsons' work so I can not comment on it. I would consider modifying a Performance Center firearm by any custom gunsmith to lower it's collectability and value. Changing the sights would further reduce it's value to me.
If you are a bit paitient and look around you should be able to get into a Shorty 45 or Shorty 45 MK-II for several hundred dollars less than you are contemplating.
Now some folks just do not want to wait and the money is not an issue. The decision rests in your hands.
The product code on this is 170088. Bear in mind I can only tell you what I was told at S&W. I could have been misinformed. Sometimes calling gun companies I have found you will get different answers from different customer reps. Serial number on this one is SFF113x and was shipped late in 1997 according to S&W. The original owner who is selling this gun bought it in Dec. 1997.
orangehole
Member
Teddy does nice work but I agree the S45 needs very little work out of the box besides some sights. The barrel/hood jeweling is cool but is simply cosmetic and it might hurt some value with collectors but who cares if you are going to shoot it. You rarely get much money back from custom work that you put into a firearm. I would go as high as $1k on that particular Shorty 45. I am not into big bore revolvers (just a J frame guy) so I am not sure of the value on your 629. The shorty 45 is a fantastic gun. Much better than many over priced 1911's. Do what feels right.
SW CQB 45
Member
I agree with colt and orange....if you want it...get it.
Actions by T did great work but other than the jeweled barrel hood...what else did he do?
He was famous for action smoothing and changing the crown angle and mirror polish of the muzzle.
I was informing any amount of work on a gun that was not done by the factory usually has a negative factor on resale. Should something else pop up that you want and decide this S45 has to go....it may not sell what you have in it.
Take care
Actions by T did great work but other than the jeweled barrel hood...what else did he do?
He was famous for action smoothing and changing the crown angle and mirror polish of the muzzle.
I was informing any amount of work on a gun that was not done by the factory usually has a negative factor on resale. Should something else pop up that you want and decide this S45 has to go....it may not sell what you have in it.
Take care
I plan on meeting the seller tomorrow. If it is as clean as listed, I'm going for it. I feel that the work that was done to it, which is documented, may not deter the value down the road. It comes with the original sights, and other than some trigger smoothing and polishing here and there that was done by Teddy you can always restore it back to it's original configuration. The were no major upgrades like a slide change or frame mod.
It will be a great shooter, but as has been stated to you multiple times by knowledgable members here, there is very little collector value. On a standard production pistol, his work adds value. On a PC pistol, ANY modifications hurt value. It is obvious you want the pistol, so buy and enjoy it, but don't expect a collector to value it as much as you do. Let us know how it shoots.
I passed on the Shorty 45. I met with the seller and the deal just didn't feel right. I have to be honest, I'm more of a collector than a shooter. It was a nice gun as a shooter, but as Grinder and others have mentioned, collector value I feel would be affected as a negative as well. Plus I do agree that 500 on top of the 629 was high as an offer on my behalf. Sometimes you get wrapped up into a deal and you don't really see true value until later or not at all. That's why value is what someone is willing to pay. I think if the gun was all original, I might have considered the gun. Thanks to all who have responded and made me really open my eyes a little further. I actually felt a little relieved going hime with my 629 and the 500 still in my pocket.
Win52C
Member
Sorry about the previous post. Tried posting with my phone. I spoke to S&W yesterday with all the info regading this Shorty 45. He told me the total amount of guns that were shipped to Lew Horton. I was informed there were two shipments. Total produced by S&W and shipped was as stated before. Cash price is $1350. So I would have $1150 into the gun. Has all the papers and box as it came from S&W as well as the extra mags and the work done by Teddy Jacobson who happens to be a very respected world class gunsmith. As well as the test target. I've seen these recently selling for around 900. So for the extra 250, I tought it was worth it as it locally available. By the time you get done with shipping and FFL charges I feel it would be very close in $$$$$. I have also attached hopefully better pics. Thanks.
Work done by Teddy Jacobson......world class or not...its been altered from original...IMHO way too high
I'm getting into the fray after the fact, but I think you made the best decision.
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